Vikings GM Rick Spielman said Wednesday, per NFL.com. "We're the third overall pick, so we'll be looking at all the options. If someone wants to come up and get our pick, we're going to be more than willing to listen."
So, two questions...
What would it take to trade up to three?
And if it cost us our 2nd rounder, do we pull the trigger if Matt Kalil is still on the board at #3?
I understand that would leave us without a 2nd or a 3rd, but you could argue that a once in a generation left tackle could be worth the price, (the argument is strengthened after reviewing Hurney's draft history in round 2).
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No way do I move up
We’ve got too many holes. If we’re making a draft-day trade then it needs to be a trade back.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
I'd do it.
We could get a anchor on the OL for the next 15 years for a measly 2nd round pick? Count me in.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
*an anchor
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
I'm inclined to agree...
Hence the existence of this article.
Twaa.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
lol
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
Agreed.
If it only costs us our 2nd round pick to move up, I’m all over it to get the best LT prospect in years.
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That would be a first and a second round pick, sir!
I can understand what you are saying but the reality of the cost is a first and second round pick.
"I may be old but...eh, I forget the rest!"
For a team retooling like the Panthers? Yes.
Hopefully in the near future the Panthers can make such moves, but I believe the help the current roster can get from the two picks outweighs the benefits of trading up for Kalil.
"I may be old but...eh, I forget the rest!"
Well, my hope is that Marty and crew acutally hit on the 2nd rounder.
I can’t think of one guy outside of Ryan Kalil who was drafted in the 2nd round and is contributing to the team.
My thinking is: if we had the ability to pull this off, but Hurney declined, and then he flops on the 2nd rounder (and say we draft Kirkpatrick 8th/9th) I would consider that a mistake. Yeah, that’s a glass-half-empty approach to the situation, I guess. But I’m kind of at the point where Hurney has to show me he can make the right pick in round 2. Many of the picks have been reaches. Sherrod Martin being the most recent example.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
I totally feel your pain.
When they selected Martin I was pissed because Sean Smith was available in that slot. He is a 6’3", 215 lb. cornerback from Utah that runs a 4.5 (40 yard dash).
Would be nice to have a big corner like that right now, huh.
"I may be old but...eh, I forget the rest!"
Very familiar with Smith.
Just about anyone we could have picked there would have been a better choice.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
Technically it's a 1st and 2nd, but we're still in the 1st round so we're not losing our 1st round pick.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
I doubt our second would be enough.
Yes I'm a dude.
by Flowing Willow on Jan 26, 2012 12:42 PM EST reply actions
The Browns may move up for RGIII or a major impact player.
Since they robbed the Falcons last year and someone else the year before, they have a lot of room to work with.
even if we wanted to, it would take our 1st and 2nd this year plus a future 2nd or 3rd
This value chart is by no means final, just a guideline, but its the same ones NFL GMs and analysts use to initially evaluate draft trades. According to this the 3rd pick is worth 2200 and our combined top 2 picks are worth 1900 (and thats assuming we get lucky on the coin flip)
Does this chart account for the new rookie wage scale?
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
No, its the same one thats been used for years
The new rookie pay would definitely factor into the decision making though
IMO, even if it means this years 2nd and next years 3rd
I would still pull the trigger.
Kalil is the safest bet in this entire draft, safer than Luck. Probably the 2nd safest bet is DeCastro. We would have the opportunity to protect the blindside of our franchise QB for the entirety of his career.
Also, having a pair of brothers on the same O-Line is a huge bonus. Brothers are competitive… always looking to best the other. Ryan and Matt would keep each other playing hard, not to mention the cohesion that would probably be 2nd nature, as certainly they grew up practicing together.
To me, this is definitely worth doing, even if it costs us more than this years 2nd.
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by Tater596 on Jan 26, 2012 2:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The other reason to do this... I'm not so sure we'll have a chance to again for awhile
This team is moving up… with that being the case, it means we won’t be picking in the top half of the draft anymore. Anyone pegged as a franchise LT is going to be gone by pick 10, with the best of the best in the top 5. It’s just one of those positions that you aren’t going to find later in the draft. Same could be said about QBs.
Right now… coming from the 8/9 spot would not cost that much, theoretically our 1st round pick with a 2nd rounder, maybe a later round pick to sweeten the deal. If we start making the playoffs pretty often, the price tag to move up into contention for a franchise LT gets REALLY REALLY expensive. Look at what Atlanta gave up in the Julio Jones trade.
While Jordan Gross is a great player, he is not getting any younger… the last thing we need is for this team to be in its prime, and we get caught with our pants down lacking a great LT to protect the blind side. In this case, it may be worth paying the small ransom now as opposed to a kings ransom later.
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hypothetically
lets say we give them a 2nd and get Kalil. who do we play where? Gross is still an elite LT, he should stay their, but Kalil is also an LT. he is a prototypical LT and might not be a good fit at RT. if we do put him at RT, what do we do with Otah? A lot of people say move him to RG but he might not do well there. that also puts Bell, Schawrtz, and Hangartner as back-ups, which is a little wasteful for them.
I think Kalil is great, but i dont think we need an improvement on the O-Line that much. he isnt as much of an upgrade as someone like Claiborne would be. If it was a different circumstance and LT was a weakness for us than I would do it no question. but i think our O-Line is set for now
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
Having 2 Is A Bonus Until They Both Holdout Wanting To Go To A New Team
by PanthersRoar on Jan 27, 2012 1:35 AM EST up reply actions
Um, when have we ever seen an example of that happening?
Ever?
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
Neeeeeeeeeope!
We’ve got too many depth holes to fill that can be much better filled with the extra draft picks; besides, this is shaping up to be one of those drafts that is light on the “elite” talent, but very deep on the “good-to-great” talent IMO
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
I'd still do it but can definitely see this side of it...
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
I wouldnt do it
I love Kalil but I couldnt give up that much, besides, i really like our O-Line. I’m starting to really like the idea of trading down. if we traded down 10-ish spots we could still possibly get Kirkpatrick, Jenkins, Brown, Coples, or Floyd
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
Sure....why not?
We can trade away picks to include a high pick next year, get the guy we want followed by a bunch of underperforming players trying to emulate Everette Brown
No thanks….if anyone makes a move to get #3 overall, its the Redskins…maybe even Cleveland. The target…RGIII
Integrity first. Service before self. Excellence in all you do. -- USAF Core Values
by Disciple of Carolina on Jan 26, 2012 5:02 PM EST reply actions
I wouldn't do it.
The guy we pick up in the 2nd is potentially a starter at CB, DT, OLB. We also have Schwartz and Williams coming back next year; Not world beaters, but solid rotational guys who provide good depth.
Cam Newton, when a reporter asks him who will win the Heisman Trophy on Saturday: "I'll tell you Sunday."
by Son of a Newton on Jan 26, 2012 5:31 PM EST reply actions
You don't really rotate O-Line guys...
In fact, that would probably be terrible for the unit as a whole.
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True. But those guys are fine to play if someone on the O-line gets banged up and has to sit a series out.
Cam Newton, when a reporter asks him who will win the Heisman Trophy on Saturday: "I'll tell you Sunday."
by Son of a Newton on Jan 26, 2012 5:51 PM EST up reply actions
Kalil is worth it... but I think the price will be too high
The value of the 1st, 2nd and 3rd picks typically skyrocket and then drop down from there. In order for us to move up the 7 spots I imagine it would take our 2012 1st, 2012 2nd and 2013 2nd at least. Kalil is elite, but we have a lot of problems to try and fix.
unless we traded a player
that can be a great way to close the gap. if you are trading a player that you dont need/want or is the guy that is being replace by the new guy, and the other team needs a player of that position. just throwing it out there. Would you trade Otah and our 1st for the 3rd pick to get Kalil? also do you think they would take it? they would be getting a OT (although a RT and they need a LT) while moving back a few spots. We would be getting an elite OT (even though he is a LT and our hole would then be at RT).
I wouldnt do it, but just throwing our an idea.
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
What about trading Gross?
If you’re selecting his replacement…
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I would prefer to move Gross to RT. But if Otah is good to go then its an option.
But that would be tough.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
Move Gross to RT and Otah to RG.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
Now we're talkin.
And that way, our most veteran guy is right next to the weakest link (in pass pro).
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
Yep...
And with Otah at RG, Double Trouble would have all the room in the world to run.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
I wouldnt call Otah a weak link in pass coverage
i think people assume he cant pass block because he is a run blocker, but he is a good pass blocker as well. Thats like people who assume that J-Stew isnt fast for that D-Will isnt strong (which really pisses me off. people assume both are on one side of the extreme and cant do the other at all. In Madden D-Will’s ‘trucking’ and ‘stiff arm’ ability are ridiculously low, like 30 or 40th among RBs, even though he weighs a solid 217 and has no problem running through people)
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
Well, if you have to pick one player (as the weak link in pass pro) among the following O-linemen...
Kalil – Wharton – Kalil – Otah – Gross
It would probably be one of the guards. And between Travelle and Otah, Travelle is probably a little better in pass pro.
Don’t lose the context of the comment—not saying he is weak at pass pro, but compared to the other four players, he is the not better at pass pro than any of them. He is certainly better than all of them in the running game, unless you want to talk about what Kalil does—being the technician that he is.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
just the wording and use of the term weakest link
Here is how i would grade out this hypothetical O-Line on pass and run blocking
Pass Blocking:
Kalil: A
Wharton: B
Kalil: A-
Otah: B
Gross: A
Run Blocking:
Kalil: B-
Wharton: B+
Kalil: A-
Otah: A+
Gross: A-
overall it would definitely be the best unit. i still dont think i would want to give up our 2nd rounder for it though
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
well...
i would be willing to give up our 2nd round pick to move up if we made a splash in FA. If we signed guys like Tyvon Branch, Manny Lawson, and Terrell Thomas.
I think a 2nd to move up is very possible. If someone trades up with St. Louis for RG3 than the market for moving up will be down. At our spot Minnesota could still get Reiff or Martin. They might think one of them is just as good or at least good enough to get plus an extra 2nd.
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
Good point.
Bringing in FAs could influence my thinking on trading up.
"I may be old but...eh, I forget the rest!"
I dont like the idea of trading an elite LT for a rookie LT
just a bad business risk. especially what would we be trading? Gross and 8/9 for 3? No WAY. Gross for 3? they wouldnt ever take it
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
As I said just above...
Would rather keep him and move him to RT.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
Otah would be a beast of a G, and it would probably be easier on his knees.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
Move him to RG.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
I guess i could live with
Kalil-Wharton-Kalil-Otah-Gross. would be best O-Line in the league. but i wouldnt give up our 2nd. We cant wait until the 4th to get some defense help.
Here are some players with ‘some’ trade value that i would be willing to part with:
Bell
Hangartner
Senn
Goodson
Butler
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
Is Kalil going to help
the poor secondary get better tackling/covering? This team has issues to continue to give away high future draft picks. The 2013 draft will have good tackle prospects as well.
by adam carter on Jan 26, 2012 6:18 PM EST via mobile reply actions
TD and Beason being back will sure as hell help the D with no changes made
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
Do they play cb and safety though? Outside
of Gamble and a inconsistent Godfrey, I would get rid of the rest of them. TD can’t be counted to stay healthy, nothing guarantee Beason will be the same player prior to his recent injury. Heck La’Ron is having trouble with his achilles.
by adam carter on Jan 26, 2012 7:17 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Check The Vegas Odds On Both Of Them Starting All 16 Games Next Season - LOL
by PanthersRoar on Jan 27, 2012 1:39 AM EST up reply actions
This year was the first time Beason has ever missed a game
TD doesnt have great odds in his favor but im sure he is taking super extra precaution
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
Let's keep in mind that nobody is immune....
to becoming a bust, for one reason or another. Nobody. There have been plenty of sure-fire, can’t-miss prospects in the past that have failed to live up the hype. Just sayin’.
there have been.
but a Kalil opportunity is almost like the stars are aligning. OT surefires aren’t like WR or RB or QB surefires. it’s more of a disciple position that can be better evaluated through tape. if he survives st Louis, which i doubt he will, it could be a beneficial trade up scenerio for both us and Minny. course this all depends on our FA cap options for defense. i really wouldn’t mind, from a fan’s perspective, one more “rebuilding year” if we’re throwing up 30+ points per game.
by Lost_terrapin on Jan 28, 2012 12:45 AM EST up reply actions
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