Blogger Round Table: OROY: Newton or Dalton?
by Jaxon on Jan 19, 2012 11:12 PM EST
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PrintWelcome to Blogger Round Table, a civil discussion between fans about who should win the NFL 2011 Offensive Rookie of the Year award. Should it be Panthers QB Cam Newton or Bengals QB Andy Dalton? Joining me to make the argument for Dalton is Jason Garrison from SBN's Bengals blog Cincy Jungle.
Now I admit when first approached about this round table my first thought was ‘What is there to argue about?" But I thought I would hear what he has to say trying to keep an open mind. Besides I had an ace in the hole that it turns out I never had to use (Peter King's ‘greatest rookie season ever' endorsement lol!). Turns out Jason had no delusions about Dalton's chances or even merits when compared to Newton. But he does make some good points, but I will let you be the judge from here.
So in classic web chat format, here we go:
Jason: Now that the 2011 season has come to an end, the name at the top of most analysts' lists to be named the Offensive Rookie of the Year is Panthers quarterback Cam Newton. However, another rookie who deserves to be in the conversation is Bengals quarterback Andy Dalton. Why do you believe Newton deserves the award over Dalton even though Dalton led the Bengals to the playoffs?
Sent at 9:33 PM on Thursday
Jaxon: While I agree Dalton had a good year, maybe even a great year for a rookie QB, he was unfortunate to be in the same draft class as Cam Newton. Newton set how many records, both rookie and NFL? 5 or 6, I'm not going to list them unless I need too
Sent at 9:37 PM on Thursday
Jason: No, you don't need to. I completely agree that Newton has had an amazing season. He has given the Panthers a huge boost and has completely revitalized Steve Smith's career. However, don't you think that a quarterback's ability to win games should be factored in to this award? I personally don't think Dalton has a shot at the ROY award, but I think something should be said for nine wins on the season and a playoff berth.
Sent at 9:40 PM on Thursday
Jaxon: I have no problem with wins being factored into it, it should be a consideration since winning is what it really is all about. Yet I might point out the Bengals were 0-8 against playoff teams. The best win was against the Titans who I will say happened to be our worst loss of the season. So I'm not sure either of those facts mean anything.
Sent at 9:44 PM on Thursday
Jaxon: How about the fact Newton took the 32nd ranked offense to 5th in a single season with no other significant additions outside of two TE's?
Sent at 9:45 PM on Thursday
Jason: All of that is very true. However, when there is talk about the league MVP, I mostly hear people calling out Aaron Rodgers. He had a good season, there's no question about that. He led his team to a 15-1 regular season record. However, there were three other quarterbacks who arguably had better seasons: Drew Brees, Tom Brady and Matthew Stafford. All three had 5,000-yard seasons but it's Rodgers that is getting a lot of the attention. If wins are a factor for his award, if he wins, they should be factored into all awards and they could at least level the playing field between Newton and Dalton.
Sent at 9:49 PM on Thursday
Jaxon: Very good idea. We talked a lot about this topic throughout the season and this past Tue night on my radio show. Dalton did have a bit of an early lead when you guys were sitting at 6-2 at the Panthers at 2-6. You make a good point on the league MVP vote. With both the Packers and Saints losing it will be interesting to see which way it falls. So will a Brees win = Newton should win and Rodgers likewise to Dalton?
Jason: Not necessarily, I just think it's something that needs to be thought about. If wins factor in for one award they should for the other as well.
Kind of switching gears, though. Since both teams had a rookie quarterback in 2011, which team do you think will be more successful in 2012?
Sent at 9:55 PM on Thursday
Jaxon: Well I always first look at schedules. Ours was pretty hard in 2011 but looks easier in 2012. The Bengals had a pretty easy schedule in 2011...I'm betting its tougher in 2012.
Jason: Much tougher
Jaxon: So we might meet in the middle?
Sent at 9:58 PM on Thursday
Jaxon: Honestly I don't think Dalton was the best rookie on your team...I'm a big fan of AJ now that he left UGA (I'm a GT grad). He torched us for three years
Sent at 9:59 PM on Thursday
Jason: That's a very good point. As a Bengals fan, it's hard not to wonder whether Dalton would have had the season he had without A.J. Green. Green was incredible from start to finish and has the potential to be a star in the NFL.
Jaxon: So clear so something up for me, was AJ as mad as he looked on stage about going to the Bengals?
Jason: Haha. If he was, he never said so.
But that's the kind of guy he is. He's quiet and he lets his play do the talking. He's an exact opposite of Chad Ochocinco.
Sent at 10:02 PM on Thursday
Jaxon: Yeah...I had some UGA people say that was just his personality as far as being laid back and not realizing the expressions he had on his face; that he has looked that way before. He was probably just nervous....Okay I got another good one for you
Jason: Shoot.
Jaxon: At #9 the Panthers are on the clock...Trent Richardson is still on the board [or insert other name] the Bengals phone rings...your #17 & 21 straight up. You doing it?
Sent at 10:05 PM on Thursday
Jason: Nope. No way. The Bengals still have a lot of holes to fill, especially in the secondary and on the offensive line. If they moved up to grab Trent Richardson and lost one of their first-round picks in the process, it would be a huge mistake. There wouldn't be much of a point of having Richardson if the offensive line couldn't block for him and the secondary couldn't stop any team from passing on them.
Jaxon: So you're playing hardball. What else you want? Name your sweetener
Sent at 10:08 PM on Thursday
Jason: Oh man, it would have to be huge. Maybe.... and it's a huge maybe.... I would do it for your No. 9 and the better of your two running backs. And I still probably wouldn't pull the trigger on that one.
Jaxon: It's good we're not GMs!
Jason: lol, true.
Jaxon: So who's the favorite at #17 on Cincy Jungle?
Jason: Well, the ways the mock drafts are going right now, we're still picking up Richardson at No. 17, but I don't see that happening. They need a guard, cornerback and safety first, in my opinion. How about the Panthers. What are you thinking at No. 9?
Sent at 10:12 PM on Thursday
Jaxon: Most are still talking Kirkpatrick in spite of his misdemeanor...but I think Brockers might work his way into the equation. The pass rusher seems the obvious move but none seem worthy. Most on CSR think Coples is over-rated. Being from UNC we've seen plenty of this kid and we aren't impressed. Need a corner more than anything or a WLB, but again, none seem worthy. A trade back is very possible. We have a solid section wanting Alshon Jeffery too.
Jason: No offense, but I hope that if they trade back, it isn't with the Bengals. haha
Jaxon: I don't think they will trade back that far.
So have you guys given Dalton a nickname yet?
Jason: The Red Rocket sounded terrible so I think most people are calling him Red Rifle now. How about with Newton?
Sent at 10:18 PM on Thursday
Jaxon: Newton came with a whole marketing campaign built in... I like Supercam...Can you believe how quickly that superman move became popular...the blog blew up when D-Wade did it to Cam right there in Charlotte after beating the Bobcats at the buzzer...dude is personable for sure thought haters are gonna hate
Jason: There's no question. He was made for football and marketing.
Anything else you wanted to go through?
Jaxon: Nope I'm good. Thanks for the invite, I had fun
Jason: Most people at CJ will probably call me crazy for even trying to argue it lol
END CHAT
So there you go...forget the trade back with Cincy!
So this chat made me think about Newton's Superman TD celebration and decided ot see how it compares to famous TD celebrations, like the Ickey Shuffle. So I went looking for vintage Ickey Shuffle from the '89 Bengals SB run, but instead got this video of old Ickey doing it. Seared in my mind!
So here's video of the original shuffle which was 'infectious' as Musberger would say:
Impressed? Here's a video of some of epic TD dances, which also happens to contain a couple other Bengals:
Cam's superman is original and catchy but it's not quite as entertaining as some of those! Really need to Dirty Bird in there though and Smitty's galloping horse.
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Both Newton and Dalton have merit to win OROY
so…why not split it? It worked a few years back with the MVP award
Integrity first. Service before self. Excellence in all you do. -- USAF Core Values
by Disciple of Carolina on Jan 19, 2012 11:19 PM EST reply actions
No man, Newton, hands down. No question.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader and coiner of the (minus Bowers) meme
Trust me, In a way I kind of agree
But with the debate raging between stats/records vs wins/playoffs, perhaps that is the best way to handle the vote on the award. We all know the only hardware Cam cares about is a Super Bowl ring and the Lombardi Trophy.
Integrity first. Service before self. Excellence in all you do. -- USAF Core Values
by Disciple of Carolina on Jan 20, 2012 10:22 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t get it. Why not just pick the best rookie off the Packers then? Jason’s argument about wins made no sense, the MVP isn’t ROY. Comeback player and Offensive player should now take winning into account as well?
I agree
Wins can contribute especially if the wins can be attributed directly to the ROY candidate in question but wins should not factor into ROY as much as it does into MVP. My logic is this: because what a team values most is wins, the MVP will likely be the one who has delivered the most wins to his team.
Because what is most valued for a ROY is raw talent, impact to the team’s production and potential for growth/greatness these are the factors that should most affect the ROY decision. Wins are in there, but further down the list.
Wins is a team stat
I just dont accept that Ragedy Andy flat out wins games most of the time he mostly just managed them he didnt have to score 30 week in and week out to keep his team in games.
by allthatremainsstillowns on Jan 20, 2012 8:25 PM EST up reply actions
Dalton
The one thing he does have in his favor bit time is the quality of defenses he faced Balt twice, Pitt twice, San Fran, and Houston of course they didnt beat any of these teams.
by allthatremainsstillowns on Jan 20, 2012 8:32 PM EST up reply actions
Sure, Dalton is in the equation
Just like other candidates were in the equation last year for the Heisman. But Newton deserves OROY flat out. There’s no question really.
No
"If ya ain't first, you're last."
- Ricky Bobby's Dad
"There is no evidence that the tongue is connected to the brain."
-Frank Tyger
by KaiserBromley on Jan 20, 2012 1:41 AM EST up reply actions
Woah! You should be banned for suggesting Sir Cam split an award with a mere mortal
What are you smokin dude?!?!?
This is how I roll, animal print pants out control.
by southtunnel on Jan 20, 2012 10:20 PM EST up reply actions
it's his first offense
we try to be lenient.
He’ll get a small fine and he’ll have to do a bit of community service but that’s all.
No way. Blasphemy is punished only by stoning.
This is how I roll, animal print pants out control.
by southtunnel on Jan 20, 2012 10:50 PM EST up reply actions
There's a chance we could have 4 of the most talented players of the Alabama NC team from 2009 in the NFCS
You’ve got Julio in Atlanta and Ingram in NO. There’s a chance the Bucs could draft Richardson and the Panthers (depending on the weed incident) take Dre. All the NFCS is missing is Dareus lol.
by Atlantapanther on Jan 19, 2012 11:24 PM EST reply actions
Ugh, gah, meh…. BLEH. Cam is the OROY. No competition at all in my opinion
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader and coiner of the (minus Bowers) meme
This is just fluff to make headlines until they announce it
Everybody in their right mind knows there is no competition. Cam’s already got this.
This is how I roll, animal print pants out control.
by southtunnel on Jan 20, 2012 10:21 PM EST up reply actions
Cam ran away with the OROY.
If it was NASCAR Dalton is a lap down and not the lucky dog.
Three more wins and and wild card is awesome for the Red Rifle I have to admit. But most years 9-7 is not a playoff team and is just a fart away from 8-8.
I do not favor the “stats=award” appoarch in other awards such as MVP but with the ROY alot of it has to do with performance impact scenarios. The Bengles were not greatly imporved by Dalton as much carried by a stout defence. Palmer or any managable QB could have done it.
The Panthers record may be 6-10 but the impact of Newton went deeper than a four game bump in wins. THe attiude became different, an the offecence was unreconizable this year as Cam did thinks not other QB had ever done rookie or not.
I am a proud supporter of troll hunting.
I look at it like this
Swap our defense with the Bengals defense, and we would have won more than nine games.
"What do want to say to those critics now?"
"Just sit back and watch the show." -Cam Newton
To me the choice is pretty clear. Cam Newton takes the OROY with very little obstruction from the competition.
Yeah Dalton deserves consideration but that’s about it. You pay Dalton his dues by acknowledging him and then move on and pick the obvious winner…SuperCam.
"Hope for the best plan for the worst"
"They laugh at me because I'm different, I laugh at them because they're all the same"
He deserves acknowledgement, but not consideration
There’s nothing to consider. Cam ran away with this.
This is how I roll, animal print pants out control.
by southtunnel on Jan 20, 2012 10:22 PM EST up reply actions
I didn't actually read all this...but
How is this even a debate???
"The way y'all are lollygaggin around here with them picks and them shovels, you'd think it was 120 degrees...can't be more than 114."
by SouthernPanther on Jan 19, 2012 11:36 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
It's not. Folks are just killing time.
This is how I roll, animal print pants out control.
by southtunnel on Jan 20, 2012 10:23 PM EST up reply actions
Cam FTW
It honestly isn’t even close. 2nd place to me isn’t even Andy Dalton, it is Von Miller followed by AJ Green.
This comment section has officially been Tater'd.
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This
Then at 4th there’s the Red Rocket
by rscott94 on Jan 19, 2012 11:46 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
How is that strange?
64 tackles, 11.5 sacks, 2 FFs, 4 PDs
That’s an impressive stat line for anyone, much less a rookie.
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OH just realized why you were calling it strange.
Forgot we are just talking OROY. I was thinking just rookie of the year period.
This comment section has officially been Tater'd.
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Does anyone watch New Girl?
Should Tater596 have to put money in the douche bag jar for that?
PS – I may be on to something here.
And over there in the tree, is a chipmunk nest. And that right there, is our corn, best in the city, it's delcious. And that is a crazy lady. So now you pretty much know what I do. Pretty dang exciting, huh?
Retrospect
Should I have to money in the douche bag jar for basically saying I watch New Girl?
No – because Zooey is the girl next door!
And over there in the tree, is a chipmunk nest. And that right there, is our corn, best in the city, it's delcious. And that is a crazy lady. So now you pretty much know what I do. Pretty dang exciting, huh?
by lazerlayell on Jan 20, 2012 8:49 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
LOL yes I watch New Girl...love that show
Love Zooey more though.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
Amen to that
She was great in “Your Highness” as well.
~A bullet may have your name on it...but grenades are addressed 'to whom it may be concerned...'
by boywonderncsu on Jan 22, 2012 1:36 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
I think you should put money in the jar for referencing New Girl!
by Jaxon on Jan 20, 2012 10:46 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I thought that too
but, in hindsight, is watching anything with Zooey wrong?
And over there in the tree, is a chipmunk nest. And that right there, is our corn, best in the city, it's delcious. And that is a crazy lady. So now you pretty much know what I do. Pretty dang exciting, huh?
... I watch New Girl...
Both me and my girlfriend have the hots for Zooey.
This comment section has officially been Tater'd.
Dropping Tater Bombs on Twitter Too! Follow me if you dare...
I like Aldon Smith
for DROY more than Von Miller. 14 sacks is quite the achievement.
We didn't lose the game; we just ran out of time. ~ Vince Lombardi
by ThePanthers! on Jan 20, 2012 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
definitly close
pickem this race is much closer then the offensive rookie of the year Miller helped spark this defense during that good stretch they had and the addition of smith has made san frans 3-4 as dangerous as Baltimores or Pittsburgs.
by allthatremainsstillowns on Jan 20, 2012 7:45 PM EST up reply actions
they are close but i would go with Miller
Smith had a lot of sacks but thats all he did. he was just a situational pass rusher. Miller has a more complete game
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
Good point. Dalton should be considered for #2 to #4
- is already locked down.
This is how I roll, animal print pants out control.
by southtunnel on Jan 20, 2012 10:24 PM EST up reply actions
It's gotta be Cam
Andy Dalton would probably win the award any other year. Unfortunately for him, Cam is a rookie too. Dalton’s year has been great, but it’s not much different than what we’ve seen before in Matt Ryan and Sam Bradford. For a rookie QB to be the first player to have 4,000 passing and 500 rushing is unprecedented (And he ran for 700!!).
He broke seemingly every record there was to break. I don’t know how any rookie could possibly come even remotely close to what Newton did this year.
Rodgers vs Brees not comparable
He brought up wins with Rodgers, but Rodgers set the NFL record for highest passer rating in a season, ever. Speaking of records, Rodgers led his team to a 15-1 record with the worst defense, that gave up the most yards EVER in a single season. And in the playoff game, guess who led the Packers in rushing yards against the Giants…Rodgers. If Dalton led the team to the playoffs with the worst defense EVER, and was a better runner, and didn’t have a RB worth a dime on the roster, then maybe he’d be deserving. Brees, Stafford and Brady all had lower passer ratings, didn’t run as well, and had better defenses. So if Dalton had a better passer rating than CAM, with a worse defense, and had a better season running the ball than CAM, we could have a debate. But CAM had the best rookie season of all-time!!!
210 is the bottom line
We scored 210 more points than we scored last year. CAM went for 35 TDs. 35 TDs totals 210 points. It’s hard to argue against that.
wow.
That is an excellent way to put it in perspective.
just wow.
None - Peter.
Stat of the Week
The Carolina Panthers scored 210 more points in 2011 (406) than they did in 2010 (196).
Cam Newton accounted for 210 points in 2011. He threw for 21 touchdowns and ran for 14. Those 35 touchdowns, multiplied times six points, equal 210.
Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/01/16/divisionals/index.html#ixzz1k8bOjwoC
i think that's shorting him.
i didn’t do the math i just assumed the factor was 7 points. Seems like he should’ve been responsible for 245 if you give him the extra points.
you'd have to give him credit for the field goals too then
He didnt kick the extra points, he’d only get credit for them if he threw or ran for 2 extra.
i don't care to see them on his career points scored stat
but i think, in a discussion about how many more points the panthers scored as a direct result of Cam, it can be said that Cam contributed directly to the extra points. It just gives a more full picture of the impact to the score board. Sure O’Mare missed an extra point or two and there were a couple of 2 pt conversions, but if you average it out i think you can say that Cam increased the scoring of the panthers by 245 rather than 210.
not even a debate
i’m sorry, but there’s no way dalton takes this award. there’s about 101 reasons cam wins this one…
has dalton had his football put in the hall of fame for getting 9 wins? I guess not.
Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
a.k.a. DeAngelo Williams in the stalking business- agile and elusive
There's no real doubt that Cam is the ROY, hands down.
And I really disregard the argument concerning the fact that Dalton won 3 more games. When it comes to the MVP race, of course wins matter, but we aren’t talking about the MVP here. ROY =/= MVP. Most Valuable Player implies what individual was most responsible for his team’s success that year. Rookie of the Year is just that, the best rookie in the NFL. The most highly talented rookies go to, obviously, the worst teams. Clearly their respective teams have a lot more problems than just that player fills and they’re more than likely not going to win a ton of games. If wins were how we decided ROY, Julio Jones or Nate Solder would getting talked up right now.
"If ya ain't first, you're last."
- Ricky Bobby's Dad
"There is no evidence that the tongue is connected to the brain."
-Frank Tyger
Ragedy Andy is what I call him
Thats what he looked like to me when Sue was tossing him around in the preseason.
by allthatremainsstillowns on Jan 20, 2012 7:47 PM EST up reply actions
Or
It could mean a red missile that uses propulsion from a rocket engine.
And over there in the tree, is a chipmunk nest. And that right there, is our corn, best in the city, it's delcious. And that is a crazy lady. So now you pretty much know what I do. Pretty dang exciting, huh?
But it also means a dog's boner.
I don't always fail, but when I do...
I do it awesomely.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Jan 20, 2012 10:07 AM EST up reply actions
I tell mine to put his lipstick away.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
by ERL on Jan 20, 2012 10:08 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
LOL
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
yes, yes
it does. Or it good mean a red shark’s clasper.
And over there in the tree, is a chipmunk nest. And that right there, is our corn, best in the city, it's delcious. And that is a crazy lady. So now you pretty much know what I do. Pretty dang exciting, huh?
could*
And over there in the tree, is a chipmunk nest. And that right there, is our corn, best in the city, it's delcious. And that is a crazy lady. So now you pretty much know what I do. Pretty dang exciting, huh?
Like I said on the podcast...
If you put Cam on the Bengals, and if you put Dalton on the Panthers; the records would be significantly different. The Bengals with Cam would have won at least 12 games, and the Panthers with Dalton would have been lucky to win 4.
There’s really no debate…Cam is the ROY.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
I like your thought
But I would somewhat disagree because of the play calling. I think Cam and Chud are a perfect match, stay with me here, similar to Walsh/Montana and Belicheats/Brady. I don’t think Brady or Montana would have had the careers they had with out those coaches and minds.
KEEP CHUD!!!
And over there in the tree, is a chipmunk nest. And that right there, is our corn, best in the city, it's delcious. And that is a crazy lady. So now you pretty much know what I do. Pretty dang exciting, huh?
is there an award for coaches?
Chud definitely deserves OC of the year.
Dalton is decent QB with a D to carry him
Newton beats Dalton in every single measurable stat for a single player
I am the WAMMA Light-Heavyweight Champion
Now with more defenses than Fedor
Wins are a team accomplishment. ROY is an individual award.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
there's already precedence regarding winning games as a QB in the AFC
“he who not be named” isn’t better than Newton, either.
for me the most impressive thing about newton and dalton
Is that they exceeded expectations by such a long way. We all hoped cam would be great but did we really expect him to smash records like he did? Probably not. Same for dalton, he came into a situation where we was expected to take over from an established quarterback and he did so in such a manner that people are glad carsten palmer decided to turn his back on the bengals. Dalton has emerged as cincy’s hero and credit to him. Everybody expected aj green to be incredible and he delivered, but dalton and cam fair exceeded what we thought they would be. Still in the end, it has to be cam… He’s made the nfl sit up and take notice
Save us Pilares
by LimeyPanther on Jan 20, 2012 10:15 AM EST via mobile reply actions
All one has to do is watch Dalton highlights,
and you will be amazed at how often his receivers made great catches on poorly thrown passes. I think he will regressin the future quite drastically. I don’t see the same happening with Cam based on the throws he started to make as the season progressed.
by TXPanther on Jan 20, 2012 10:53 AM EST via mobile reply actions
The same can be said about Cam too though
Take Smiths 54 yard TD against the Saints, that ball was overthrown, it’s just that Smith can leap 45 feet into the air to make a catch.
Don’t get me wrong. Newton was obviously better than Dalton. However, Newton was far from perfect. He’s a rookie, I expect him to get better than he was this season.
Maybe in some cases but Steve Smith is still playmaker, he's got to do some of the work at times.
He’s also mentioned throws where Cam was absolutely on the money with the football that it would be a crime not catch it. I have not seen many if any throws from Dalton that has resembled the type of throws Cam showed that he could make. LOL, even in most of his “Rookie of the Week” nominations most of the plays were made by his receivers and the announcer didn’t even mention his name.
"Hope for the best plan for the worst"
"They laugh at me because I'm different, I laugh at them because they're all the same"
Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing Cam.
I’m just sticking up for Dalton a bit here. No, he doesn’t belong in the conversation for OROY last season, but every NFL QB makes some poor passes.
If you have a good season as a QB, I don’t think you can say “it’s just because of his receivers”. I think you have to give some credit where it’s due.
Dalton did play great for a rookie QB. I think most years, he’d certainly be a favorite for OROY, it’s just that Newton was head and shoulders ahead.
I buy this
Dalton had a lot of help but so did Cam. Dalton had a likely future pro-bowler to throw to, but Cam had a former pro bowler to throw to. Dalton on any other year would easily be a front runner but he had the misfortune to be drafted the same year as Newton
of course all qb's need help
And yes Cam needed a lot of help early in the season. He vastly improved by seasons end, though with some hiccups. I saw good throws from Dalton but it is very surprising to see how innacurate he is. The winning record masked a lot of his flaws.
by TXPanther on Jan 21, 2012 1:21 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Dude... Stop bashing Cam
You mentioned Cam and Dalton in the same post. Technically, that is considered bashing. Straighten up yo!
This is how I roll, animal print pants out control.
by southtunnel on Jan 20, 2012 10:54 PM EST up reply actions
it wasnt overthrown steve is just undertall
by allthatremainsstillowns on Jan 20, 2012 8:28 PM EST up reply actions
dare ya to say that to his face...
(or to the top of his head)
by TXPanther on Jan 21, 2012 1:22 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
You know Dolton only had 3 more wins then cam.....with an easier schedule
And torched a texans defense that beat dalton the week b4
by bird2jasun on Jan 20, 2012 11:45 AM EST via mobile reply actions
And that Texans defense beat Dalton again in the playoffs.
Look at Cincinnati’s wins: CLE, BUF, JAX, IND, SEA, TEN, CLE, STL and ARZ.
If they had our schedule they would probably have finished 6-10 or worse.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
Perhaps. However, they beat 1 of the 2 teams to blow us out
Granted, we beat a team that beat them as well.
no other significant additions outside of two TE's?
I think you are discounting the effect those two had. Does that take away the OROY? Nope. just want to give credit to the FO for making them a priority.
by panthersnbraves on Jan 20, 2012 11:54 AM EST reply actions
I wouldn't say the new starter at #2 was a significant addition
He had fewer yards at the end of the season than the number 3 WR. He played 15 games instead of 16, but I wouldn’t say he was a significant addition at all.
Dalton had one thing Cam didn't
For the better part of the year Dalton had a solid defense helping him. Not to talk ill of our D, but they dropped the ball a few times and did not give Cam much help. The Bangles had the number 7 defense in the league while ours was 28th. There is no doubt Dalton is a good QB and will do the Bangles well, but id we had a better D this year, we would be in the playoffs no doubt!
Panthers4Life
Dropped the ball a few times?
You mean they showed up for a few plays each game.
I will admit that a big part of it was injuries, but a big part of it was also our starting secondary just getting torched and failing to make tackles.
I just want to talk crap about the team...
They know how they played so there is no need to have me bash them. But I can’t argue with what you said…
Panthers4Life
QB wins are more useless than pitcher wins.
Newton in a landslide.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
Let's settle this once and for all!
Dalton had a cute little rookie season, especially for a Ginger-nut. But Cam is the f**k’n Paterfamilia! He’s in the discussion for best rookie ever… EVER! Go away Annie, this tree is WAY too big for you.
This is how I roll, animal print pants out control.
Newton all the way, but never forget or forgive...
Don't bother hanging yourself or shooting yourself, just watch Atlanta sports.
by InMattWeTrust on Jan 20, 2012 10:34 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I like this one better...
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
personally Im all in on Newton but here's another angle.
If your talking value, the bengles held out and got their man in the second round last year so you when comparing who you like, another question might be Newton vs. Dalton AND Green?
Cam still trumps them both
Cam Newton 35 TD’s. > Andy Dalton AND AJ Green 28 TD’s.
Proud member of the Panthers Mafia!
Saving The Environment One Green Comment at a Time
"I don't see no ceiling. I don't see no breaking point." - Cam Newton
by MMA_PITBULL on Jan 21, 2012 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
i cant believe you guys are still talking about OROY
I will be pissed if he doesnt when ROY
I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was
EVERYONE on here should be a giants fan this weekend!
So eli will go to the SB and CAM will be in the probowl!
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