Cam Newton to start game three vs. Bengals, Greg Hardy gets something more permanent
by James Dator on Aug 21, 2011 6:22 PM EDT
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Following today's practice Ron Rivera announced to the media that Cam Newton would be starting this Thursday against the Cincinnati Bengals and will be given a good, long chance to cement himself as the team's starter. We'll see Newton (and presumably the entire 1st team) for three full quarters before Jimmy Clausen and Derek Anderson are asked to handle the mop up duty.
While technically Newton hasn't been named the starter for week one against Arizona, really the writing is on the wall. As Steve Reed points out it would take a serious collapse by Newton to jeopardize his chances as the starting QB. Independent analysts all seem to agree that giving Cam the reigns is the right move, on two occasions NFL Network Analyst Greg Cosell has marveled at Cam's natural arm strength, poise under pressure and points out abilities that look ahead of his time as a rookie, conversely he sees many of the same issues with Jimmy Clausen rearing their head, while also noticing the lack on an NFL arm.
Today's talk by Rivera didn't just focus on Cam Newton though, Greg Hardy got some good news also and I'll tell you that...
After the jump
Despite missing the early weeks of training camp while recovering from a motorcycle crash Greg Hardy has made a huge impact on Ron Rivera and the Panthers' coaching staff, so much so that they've already told Hardy he will be the starting defensive end opposite Charles Johnson to open the season on September 11th in Arizona.
Hardy became a fan favorite last year with his manic style, flying around the field and making plays wherever possible. In fact, if Hardy is able to show a little more constraint he looks like he has the physical tools to become a truly dominant defensive end, a sentiment echoed by Bill Voth
Bill Voth
One more thing from #Panthers today: was reminded that Greg Hardy is a big man. Impressive. If he can figure out some things mentally...
Voth shares a similar view I do of Hardy, he is an extremely dominant DE, but he can get lost in the game becoming overly aggressive and at times looking like he forgets his assignments. After looking back on some tape from 2010 I have no doubt Hardy can play the run very well, however, he tends to over-pursue at times which leads to him biting on ball fakes and misdirections. Provided the coaching staff can help focus the Kraken then we will see his true potential released.
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Basically this says:
Oh fuck, we’ve spent our #1 pick on a QB and he hasn’t looked remotely better than the guy that the fan base wants run out of town…….so I guess we just start him anyway, right guys?
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
by OldhamA on Aug 21, 2011 6:23 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
He hasn't looked any worse than the guy the fan base wants run out either.
And the fans would rally behind Jimmy if he could legitimately take the #1 spot, but he hasn’t.
exactly...
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Did you watch on your movie
Rise of the Planet APES on the site I gave you ?
Not yet...I've been busy.
I plan on doing it though.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
OR...
It says that we’ve spent a 2nd round draft pick on a QB and he hasn’t looked remotely better than a rookie who only had 2 weeks practice is what it’s saying.
by David Threatt on Aug 21, 2011 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions
He's looked comfortably better. Remind me who's scored the more points this pre-season (which is what you all jumped on Clausen for last season)
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
I'll remind you
Clausen: 1 TD scored – 1 TD on a pick 6 = 0 net points
Newton: 0 net points
It’s a wash
Clausen has led two TD drives this pre-season as well as two FG drives.
What’s Newton had, one FG drive?
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
To be fair, one of those TD drives started on the Dolphin's 15.
And was pretty much all Sutton.
by ppfcpp on Aug 21, 2011 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Are you of the opinion that your objections will change anybody's mind?
The writing’s on the wall, like graffiti in the subway, and there’s too much of it for you to whitewash off. Might as well face it.
Are you really suggesting Clausen executed some amazing TD drive against the Dolphins?
Carolina Panthers at 08:32
1-10-MIA 15
(8:32) 22-T.Sutton right tackle to MIA 9 for 6 yards.
2-4-MIA 9
(7:53) (Shotgun) 2-J.Clausen pass incomplete short left to 81-K.Pilares.
3-4-MIA 9
(7:48) (Shotgun) 2-J.Clausen pass short middle to 87-D.Clowney to MIA 4 for 5 yards (45-D.Nixon).
1-4-MIA 4
(7:14) 22-T.Sutton right guard for 4 yards, TOUCHDOWN.
That 5 yard completion…. it made all the difference
ha
To be fair that has been an area of some concern for us
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 7:03 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Okay, so take away that TD drive
And Jimmy’s still scored more points than Cam has. Which supports Oldham’s argument. And Oldham is also right about Jimmy being lambasted and had everyone here wanting his head because he couldn’t score points. Now he’s scored more than Cam has, and everyone wants to sit him anyway. Disagree if you would like, but don’t try to make Oldham sound stupid, you guys.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 7:50 PM EDT up reply actions
It all depends on how much stock you like to put in a drive that started on the 15 yard line in which he completed one 5 yard pass
If you think he orchestrated that then it’s 13-6 Clausen, if you think anyone could have made that one pass then it’s 6-6
But "anyone" didn't score those points...
Jimmy did. If he is to be at fault for NOT scoring, how can we legitimately say that he isn’t responsible when we do score points?
Lookit, I want Cam to play as much as anyone. Given how close the competition’s been so far, I really wouldn’t have any problem with him starting. I’m just disturbed by how most of you make it sound like Cam’s earned the job, and he hasn’t. He’s getting the job by default.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
*insert terrible emo music that fits my current mood*
by scatterbrain on Aug 21, 2011 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Sigh...
I mean from the perspective of the QB position. Did we not give Cam credit for points he scored, regardless of how many yards our RBs got while Cam was out there? I feel like you’re being deliberately obtuse, James, really.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:04 PM EDT up reply actions
position battles are rarely straight up and down
the job is almost always someone’s to lose. In this case, the job is and will always be Cam’s to lose, so tho Clausen has performed slightly better, it wasnt enough for “take” Cam’s job. The question shouldnt be “Has Jimmy performed better,?” It should be “Has Jimmy outperformed Cam enough to take his job?” the answer to the 1st question is yes, the answer to the second is no
And this is what I'm saying...
The job was Cam’s to begin with. Jimmy would have had to outplay the rookie by a large margin to start. Which is ass-backward from the way the rest of the league does it. Cam has the job by default, not due to performance.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Sorry, but you cant expect Jimmy's job tob e secure when he goes 1-9 as a starter.
If he had proven in anyway that he can win against even mid tier teams, he might have a shot. He’s not the right guy for this team, an you can tell by watching the sidelines during the game. The offensive guys gravetate towards Cam, which is extremely telling.
by Ryan439 on Aug 21, 2011 8:49 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Oh, sure.
Jimmy definitely couldn’t done last year, but it seemed like a coaching staff that was completely disinterested (seemingly) made our year last year so painful. But yeah, I mean, nobody drafts a QB at #1 if they have the QBs they think can get the job done already on the roster, absolutely. I was just hoping Cam would do something demonstrative to win the job, not just squeak by Jimmy.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 9:04 PM EDT up reply actions
I think everyone knew Clausen was screwed in April.
If you read between the lines you knew sooner as Rivera wouldn’t comment on him at all: “We’re evaluating.”
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
New poster...
Just wanted to point out my newbie status amongst the forum elites. Hello everyone.
As a response, I agree with Kackalack that I, too, didn’t want to see Cam squeak past Jimmy. However, both would probably be significantly better had there been an actual offseason with OTAs and camp.
by BlackHowling on Aug 22, 2011 8:36 AM EDT up reply actions
People like to tout that 1-9 record
I always kinda chuckle at that. He played well enough to get to 3-7 or 4-6, but somethings just didn’t work out. DeAngelo getting tackled for a loss. Kasay missing a field goal. And no one on our defense being able to stop Lagarrette Blount or Josh Freeman in the second meeting with the Bucs.
Last season was such a quagmire.
I'm not shifting any of the blame here
Clausen had a complete meltdown against Seattle after playing perhaps his best half of the season. That’s on him.
I didn't say it wasn't, but last year was a team effort.
Shocking coaching, injuries on the O-line, rookie WRs, rookie QB.
The list goes on. It was the perfect storm of suck.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
I’m just looking at the drives. If you look at who the primary chain mover in Clausen’s TD to Olsen it was Jimmy, in the TD drive… it was Jimmy, but in the TD against Miami that was all Sutton.
Conversely, on Cam’s 2 TD drives the primary reason the yards were picked up was due to Newton.
Here’s a brief breakdown:
- Clausen TD v. Giants: 2 completions, 34 yards 1 TD (total drive was 54 yards long)
- Newton FG1 v. Giants: 2 completions, 40 yards (total drive was 62 yards long)
- Newton FG2 v. Giants: 2 completions, 54 yards (total drive was 54 yards long)
- Clausen FG v. Dolphins: 3 completions, 19 yards (total drive was 32 yards long)
- Clausen TD v. Dolphins: 1 completion, 5 yards (total drive was 15 yards long)
So, to further break this down:
- Clausen was responsible for 57% of the offense on his three scoring drives
- Newton was responsible for 81% of the offense on his two scoring drives
To me, that stat is telling
Do you think that on Cam’s drives we were trying not to run the ball? To give him more reps and to see how he reacts to NFL defenses? If that’s the case, the validity of those numbers takes a serious hit.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:16 PM EDT up reply actions
I looked at the numbers
- Clausen’s scoring drives: 3 times rushing on the two passing drives (2 in the Sutton drive)
- Cam’s scoring drives: 2 times rushing on the two passing drives
It seems like it’s a wash
Fair enough.
Seemed to me, to the naked eye, that we ran much more with Jimmy than we did with Cam overall. Which would make sense, if we’re wanting to see how Cam throws and reads. I’m willing to accept your analysis, like usual. =)
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions
And, thanks, btw.
Good numbers work. I can see why we’d be starting Cam, in those terms.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:24 PM EDT up reply actions
No problems
These lack of running numbers (43 attempts in two games) is very promising because it shows overall how many yards were being left on the field so they could focus on passing the ball (71 attempts)
Not to mention
Our running numbers are going to inflated, due to Cam’s skill with his feet, which I’m hoping we’ll see more of in the regular season.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:31 PM EDT up reply actions
to *be inflated, duh
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions
That's debatable
He worked his butt off to the point where he’s already at about the same level as Clausen, who has had a full year in the league. I think can be considered earning the job.
+1
Its not a fail… Just a conflict of opinions. How is trading jimmy a good thing? We aint gonna get anything for him. He’s better than DA.
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:15 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Those 5 yard checkdowns seem to be all he can do...we need something a little more vertical than that.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
He did have an awesome pass to Clowney
Which was negated by Clowney not lining up correctly. His pass to Sutton when the play broke down and he had to run forward out of the pocket was pretty bad ass too. If he could have put together more plays like that last year things might be different. But Rivera picked his future QB, and now he is going to play his future QB. Rivera is putting his butt on the line early and it will be interesting to see if it pays off.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
That's a given
A John Kasay field goal miss and a Wililams tackle-for-loss were all that really separated us from 2-14 and 4-12. We wouldn’t even have Cam if that had been the case.
To be fair
Neither QB was getting a whole lot of help from the receivers. It’s really hard to give either one of them the edge. I can understand the argument to let Newton take the reigns since they seem about dead even. It’s the same argument to letting Clausen take the reigns last year when he looked pretty even with Moore. After that experiment failed last year, I’m not sure I like the idea of trying it again, but I can understand the logic behind it.
Those 5 yard checkdowns
Converted on third down, which is something Cam hasn’t been able to do in two preseason games. I know we all want to see Cam play, but to say he’s out-performed Jimmy is just flat wrong. Cam’s getting the starting job, most likely, because he’s a #1 pick that just got paid about 50 million, not because he’s looked head-and-shoulders better than our other QBs. Let’s be honest.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 7:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Okay, it’s 22 million. Or 50 million. Or 100 million. What’s the difference? Point is, that you totally ignored, was that Cam has NOT played much better than Jimmy has. We’re starting him based on something other than his performance. It’s as simple as that. Maybe it’s ticket sales we want, or just to be on TV every night, or that we HAVE to play the guy because he’s the reason why people are paying attention to us now. But it’s not his football ability that’s got him out there.
I’m hoping that what everyone suspected here is true, that we’ve limited him to speed his learning process and to keep opposing teams from seeing all our offense has to offer in the preseason. But, like I’ve said before, that sounds eerily like last year, when we said the same things to blow smoke at each other so we wouldn’t have to accept the fact that this team is a long, long way from anything resembling competitive.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions
They've played about the same
I never said Cam was head and shoulders better, but given the fact he’s only had two weeks seeing an NFL defense vs. Clausen in his 18th occasion (4 preseason 2010, 10 games last year as starter, 2 years as fill in, 2 preseason this year) and they’re still about equal then it makes no sense to go back to the well for the 19th time when you have someone who looks as good on outing number 3.
Assuming Cam starts
It will be fascinating to see how well Cam holds up once defenses get out of their vanilla looks. Cam is already (expectedly) lost at times. I’m thinking the coaching staff will ask a lot less of him during the regular season and give him a Sam Bradford-type KISS game plan.
I love it that our OC is humble enough to adjust their game plan, instead of just blaming the players.
Maybe you missed all the Auburn games last year, but it is Cam's play that got him there.
If they’re dead even, but the team rallies to Cam, then he should start. His contract is not big enough for them to feel pressed o play him early.
by Ryan439 on Aug 21, 2011 8:25 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
But this is the Big Boy league, my man.
QBs not named Brees, Brady, Rivers, or Manning can’t carry a team. And even Rivers is debatable.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm going to have to stop you right there on the Rivers aspect
He is perhaps the most underrated elite QB in the league simply because his team hasn’t done well in the playoffs and perennially gets off to a slow start at the beginning of the year. Given the inherent disadvantage of being a west coast team (some ridiculous statistic like west coast teams lose 75% of the 1:00 east coast games), that isn’t all too surprising.
I'm gonna take umbrage at that whole "west coast team" thing...
Seems like the east coast teams going out west to play would have a deleterious effect on them as well, but the numbers don’t support that. I’m thinking that the west coast teams coming out and losing on the east coast is one of those weird statistical aberrations.
But I agree totally about Rivers. I think he is an elite QB, and has been carrying SD for 3 years now. I’m just saying, SOME folks would debate that.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Well think about it like this
Are you more active at 1:00 PM or 10:00 AM? And that doesn’t even include the time to get up and get ready for the day. Going from a 1:00 game to a 4:15 game probably has no effect because it doesn’t reduce the amount of prep time your body and mind would normally have like going from a 4:15 game to a 1:00 game.
You have a week to tailor your practices to the new time zone. It's a poor excuse.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Say what you will
The statistics don’t lie. 75% of the West coast teams flying and playing at 1:00 PM EST lose. That is a fact. I could dig up the exact stat if you want to try and dispute it, but this is common knowledge.
I'm not disputing the stat, I'm just saying that excuse holds no water with me.
It’s poor coaching and preparation.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
If it were only the time zones
Then St. Louis and Kansas City would dominate their respective western divisions as they both play in the central time zone giving them an edge over there western rivals. The same central time zone that the Steelers and Colts play in.
West Coast teams have not been managed or, in most cases, coached well over the last decade. That has a lot more to do with win/loss records then time zones.
"I kinda just sling it" -Jake
by bleed_in_blue on Aug 22, 2011 8:48 AM EDT up reply actions
May I interject a question in this fascinating, and original, doalogue?
What exactly has Jimmy Clausen ever done in the BBL?
Nope
You can’t =P (I kid.)
He struggled, that’s about what he did. Just like any QB in his situation would struggle, I think.
and to top it off.. cam was up against miami's 1's.. clausen.. not so much
by curiousmanners on Aug 21, 2011 8:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Which one...the one to Olsen, or the one to NYG's linebacker? ;-)
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Time check:
No answer to your pointed question in …3 hours.
This may be a move
towards what the fan base wants. its obvious that everybody (mostly) loves Cam. I could care less between the 2. I just believe that it makes sense to start Cam.
could ya learn to love me? - Old Greg
by numero uno panther on Aug 21, 2011 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I counting on Rivera being a good enough coach not to care what the fans think.
I’ll say it again. If Fox had the stones to put Tebow 3rd on the depth chart, I’m sure Rivera has the stones to play who he thinks will be best too.
I cannot wait to see how Cam looks with a week of training to pick apart a Defense, rather than just training to remember plays.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
I can agree with that.
and not that the fan base loves him should be the only reason he would start. I believe he gives us a better chance to win and he has shown any sign of folding under pressure. While pressure seemed to fold Clausen up like an origami swan. As long as we dont swith back and forth i’ll be fine with either or. Decision time is coming though and hopefully it comes soon so we can get to work.
could ya learn to love me? - Old Greg
by numero uno panther on Aug 21, 2011 7:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Upside
That is the difference. Cam has more upside potential. We can argue all day, because their performance is pretty matched, but Cam has more potential to be a game changer than Jimmeh.
I feel like Cam and Jimmy have been a wash so far, but here's why I go with Cam.
With Jimmy you pretty much know what you’re going to get. Every time he drops back to pass, you may or may not get 5 yards.
While Cam is far less polished, you have no clue what’s going to happen when he drops back. He provides a level of talent and hope that is going to run off on his teammates. He may throw an interception. He may throw a 40 yard dart. He may take off and run for 20. And however unpolished he may be, defenses are going to have to respect that. That’s not the same for Jimmy.
And that’s why you start Cam.
I don't always fail, but when I do...
I do it awesomely.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Aug 22, 2011 9:29 AM EDT up reply actions
like the post below me says.. Clausen a pick 6 and one TD. But ill even go farther and say Cam led 2 scoring drives with no pick 6. So cam is responsible for 6 net points while with Clausen its a wash.
by PantherTrain on Aug 21, 2011 6:42 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Don't Go Off Your Rails "PantherTrain", Cam 2 FG's (6 Points) Clausen 2 TD's, 2 FG's, & 1 Int Fpr A TD (13 Points)
I’m not pushing for Clausen, just setting the record straight on their scoring drives.
The Bengals are looking like the top contender for the #1 pick in 2012, so if the Panthers don’t win then it’s a concern.
by PanthersRoar on Aug 21, 2011 7:55 PM EDT up reply actions
New poster here..So they're separated by 7 points; Netwon's been playing a few weeks, Clausen is in his second year
It’s perfectly reasonable for the coaching staff to look at this and select Newton. Better than reasonable—it’s the smart decision.
how often does a qb comes into the nfl and dominate straight away?
People keep comparing cam to josh freeman. Did he set the world on fire in his first season? Hell no. I’m big on cam but we need to be realistic, he needs more time. We can’t expect him to be amazing straight out of the blocks. That said he had one off game. Let’s not go condemning us to another 2-14 season just yet
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 6:54 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
No, that's an intentionally narrow minded way of looking at it
This says:
“We rolled the dice on a QB who nobody thought would be NFL ready for 1-2 years, but he studied, prepared himself and immediately looks on par with a player who started 10 games as a rookie. Based on that, coupled with how the team responds to him we might as well begin the development and maturation of the player we believe to be our franchise QB”
Jesus Christ I much watch a different game to half you guys.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
by OldhamA on Aug 21, 2011 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
OLdhamA
You have a right to your opinion, but , please how about weatching your language. I’ve got a 1o year old grandson that likes to read our blog !!!!!!!!
Jim
by goofygolfer on Aug 21, 2011 6:48 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
10 year olds should not be posting.......
or reading the posts here.
"Keep Pounding" -Sam Mills
Follow me on Twitter
My brother started here when he was ten.
Now obviously there’s some stuff that’s inappropriate that I wouldn’t want him seeing, but I object to the age limit on posting. He articulated himself fairly well while he was here, and he’s a fan, just like us.
Yes I'm a dude.
by Flowing Willow on Aug 22, 2011 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Your brother is the exception, not the rule.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
... I see no swears?
"If ya ain't first, you're last."
- Ricky Bobby's Dad
"There is no evidence that the tongue is connected to the brain."
-Frank Tyger
by KaiserBromley on Aug 21, 2011 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions
To some of us
Using the term “Jesus Christ” in anger or frustration, is not an appropriate use of the Lord’s name. Sorry, I have to pull my “Pastor” card on that one. Not judging, just explaining.
To some of us, that term means nothing.
So it’s kinda tough being told to avoid it, just because I’m told not to say it.
I don't always fail, but when I do...
I do it awesomely.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Aug 22, 2011 9:31 AM EDT up reply actions
thats just oldham being english
Taking the lords name in vain really isn’t frowned upon over here
by LimeyPanther on Aug 22, 2011 9:33 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I got two Saturday detentions for saying it once in high school lol
"If ya ain't first, you're last."
- Ricky Bobby's Dad
"There is no evidence that the tongue is connected to the brain."
-Frank Tyger
by KaiserBromley on Aug 22, 2011 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Take off the jimmy-colored glasses...it'll be a whole new experience when you do.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
When he was drafted, everyone knew Cam was raw
He needed a lot of work with his mechanics and his reads. So far he has had 3 weeks of practice and 3 quarters of preseason play to work on these things.
Clausen, on the other hand, was considered the most NFL ready QB in his draft, has been with the team for a full year, and has played in 9 regular season games. He also has experience with the current WRs.
Clausen should be leaps and bounds ahead of Newton. That fact that it’s a marginal difference already is kind of telling.
Ah well, guess we'll have to enjoy another shitty season.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
I think the improved coaching alone will lead to more than 2 wins.
so odds are the season wont be AS shitty.
could ya learn to love me? - Old Greg
by numero uno panther on Aug 21, 2011 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Did you go to Bama? Notre Dame?
Seriously, I get that you like Clausen, but at this point it seems like you’re past just pulling for Clausen to the point where you’re rooting for Cam to fail.
Charlie Wiess passed on Clausen twice if I remember correctly
So I can say for certain that OldhamA is not Charlie Wiess
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
Pretty nice for Hardy
Getting handed a starting job while missing training camp. Rivera i’m sure has seen everything we did last year. I hope he comes up huge.
"Excuses are a disease." -Cam Newton
by Smitty89 on Aug 21, 2011 6:30 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
i dont understand how he won the job while working with ryan vermillion the past 3 wks
sounds to me more like a knee jerk reaction to how poorly brown has played, and unfortly, norwood also gave us no pass rush against the fins
"We want them to play fast, we want them to play physical, we want them to play hard and most importantly we want them to play smart." RR 8-3-11
makes sense.
You dont take a qb number 1 overall and not start him if he looks just as good as the qb in place.
could ya learn to love me? - Old Greg
by numero uno panther on Aug 21, 2011 6:33 PM EDT reply actions
I do have faith
I just believe that this is the week one of them has to step up. This is the week they’re prepping like a real game, and it’s against the Bengals, who most feel will be the worst team in the NFL this year. Last game was forgivable, playing against a top 10 D.A poor performance this week would be unforgivable. Not that it would be the end of the world, but it would be a huge setback for us.
I agree, cam’s getting a longer opportunity to show what he can do this time too. Just hope he shows us what he’s capable off.
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 7:18 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Even though last pre-season was an indicator for our regular season......
It usually isn’t. I’m not getting concerned over any pre-season game.
"Keep Pounding" -Sam Mills
Follow me on Twitter
my really big concern is the lack of otah
Know its been mentioned a few times now but he was listed as hip keeping him out of practice today (according to the observer). Which is it? Hip? Knee? Testicles? Or heart? I know he’s a big boy but surely at some point he needs to get on with it.
Errrrr…. Just really want him to get back fit cuz our o-line needs him bad at the moment. Come on son. We NEED you!
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 6:40 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Question is how long can we actually put up with it?
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 7:11 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Pretty sure it's his contract year, so erm, 16 games.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
We need to bite the bullet,
Accept that Otah is an injury cart ornament, and sign Jon Stinchcomb to get us through the year so we can draft a right side for our O-line. The last thing we need is Cam going down to injury because our tackles on the right side are either hurt or useless.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions
only thing is
Otah is an absolute monster when healthy. But agree with the cam injury concern. If he’s running around all over the place he’s at a higher risk anyway. Jimmy could be looking at game time even if cam is named qb
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:21 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He's a run blocking monster. His pass blocking is merely ok.
But yeah he’s trying my patience with this injury nonsense.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
I've been beating that drum for a year now
Otah has never played a full season and has spent almost 2 years on IR. OLines can’t afford that type of discontinuity.
Right On
Agree 100% with that statement. Bernadeu better be cut. We need to kick Ziemba into right guard since both Schwartz and Otah might as well go on I.R. and pick up a right tackle or see of G Williams can step up.
bell might be better than ziemba at RG
"We want them to play fast, we want them to play physical, we want them to play hard and most importantly we want them to play smart." RR 8-3-11
urghhhhh
The thought of ziemba and williams on the right side makes me cringe. That’s a recipe for disaster. If no otah we need a vet rt otherwise cam and jimmy are gonna get squished
by LimeyPanther on Aug 22, 2011 5:28 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I would rather
Cam start, and this season tank if it means that future seasons are annual playoff berths. If Clausen starts we may do a little better this season while only prolonging the inevitable of Cam taking over.
could ya learn to love me? - Old Greg
by numero uno panther on Aug 21, 2011 6:43 PM EDT reply actions
At this point
I wouldn’t mind seeing what Derek Anderson could do with the ones. It’s possible he could be serviceable for a good portion of the season, while Cam works on the finer points of the position, like working out that back foot throw that sails over everybody’s head…since Jimmy and cam have been basically a wash to this point, DA could be the ace in the hole, but looks like we’ll never know…
please..
tell me that Steve Smith is playing this time.. like for real playing.
by PantherTrain on Aug 21, 2011 6:47 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Honestly, I refrain from making predictions this early...
But they look the closest to an 0-16 team I’ve seen in a long time… a total front office meltdown has ruined that team and Andy Dalton has shown absolutely nothing that tells me he has any skills to be an NFL QB; I felt the same way before the draft- I just didn’t get the hullaballoo over him
This preseason game
that I’m watching to scout the Bengals….they just look bad. First-teamers are looking rough, lol.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah
Right now Dalton’s at 8/19, 86 yards and 2 INTs… it’s pretty bad he just has so way to pass deep
Never understood that pick. He reminds me too much of Kellen Moore.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Side note...
Sanchez is looking much better than last year. It’s looking more and more like it’s his team now, which the Jets desperately need if they’re to be in contention the way they were last year.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:33 PM EDT up reply actions
I believe Ryan said in an interview that Sanchez will be running the offense more this year than the past.
That he will be making more of the calls at the line instead of just doing what the play called for.
Official member of the 2011 Panthers Mafia
Rofl.
If I may be permitted, I’m getting the sneaking suspicion that you and I share the same dreadful certainty that Jimmy is going to come back to haunt us, in the most painful way possible.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 9:44 PM EDT up reply actions
I think he's going to be a good QB in this league.
If he goes to the right team then yeah we’re going to struggle against him.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
I wouuldn't go as far as to say we'll struggle against him
Jimmeh is the type of QB who can thrive in the perfect system for him and a complete set of offensive pieces around him. More of a game manager than a game changer IMO.
"If ya ain't first, you're last."
- Ricky Bobby's Dad
"There is no evidence that the tongue is connected to the brain."
-Frank Tyger
by KaiserBromley on Aug 21, 2011 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions
He would thrive until he heard the clomping footfalls, ansd smelt the hot breath of, BigMoney and the Kraken...
…and then the thriving would turn into hunkering, and get fetal, real fast.
God, I hope you're right.
It’s like one of those things that’s too horrible NOT to come to pass: Jimmy gets cut, goes to a WCO, gets better and beats us in three years in the first round of the playoffs. It’s like….. I can see it already….hold me……I’m cold inside.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 12:44 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
There, there - it's Okay.
It was just a bad old dream.
This is the funniest post...
..I’ve read about the Jimmeh. The sad thing is, I could actually see that happening.
I kinda like power running football though. It’s iike a bloody violent ballet…
When it was working it was a thing of beauty to me. - Vagus
(Please note that from now on I shall only refer to Cam as "The Newt" and Rivera as "BAMF")
Jerry Richardson: "Bitch slapping the NFL one signing at a time" - MMA_Pitbull
by The Duke Dude on Aug 22, 2011 8:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Not worried at all
Even if Clausen ultimately does do well, I think what we’ll see from Newton will be exceptional.
They should have took Mallett
Sooo me, Cam, Ron, Marty, Don, Chud, Sean, Mike and Jerry are going out to have some Cammy Cam juice... Who's coming?
He was all that was available after their first pick, so they reached.
They would probably be better off playing the other Palmer. At least he has experience.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
I like that they didn't play him last week actually.
There’s no way a cut like that was fully healed,an extra week will help. As intense as he plays he could easily have hurt it again.
And cake is better than an ingrown toenail.
What is your point?
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
by Oi2dwrld on Aug 21, 2011 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Of all the weird analogies we get on CSR...this is my current favorite.
Well played, sir.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
OK
I’ll get right on that 20 years ago.
Try again?
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
My bad.
It’s the 40 year old virgin syndrome. Sell the comics and Transformers and find something better to do than analyze posts on a website for the fans of the Panthers. Go Panthers. Looking forward to a positive season. Oh yeah please get laid.
Jeez man, c’mon. This is a Panthers blog, not a sandbox pissing contest.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader and coiner of the (minus Bowers) meme
by Ivan459 on Aug 22, 2011 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
*facepalm*
Bad troll is bad.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You're right, I love that movie.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
The 40 year old virgin thing would surprise the hell out of my wife
And I’m 34 I actually moved out of my parents house when I was 17, but I rounded up for brevity.
Strike two.
But I do love the hell out of some comics. Some people are just well rounded.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
Are you that defensive, naturally?
http://www.facebook.com/dranged1 - Add me on Facebook. Can never have too many CSR/Panther friends.
......WTF?
"If ya ain't first, you're last."
- Ricky Bobby's Dad
"There is no evidence that the tongue is connected to the brain."
-Frank Tyger
by KaiserBromley on Aug 21, 2011 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions
+Cake
see: Iglesias, Gabriel
I kinda like power running football though. It’s iike a bloody violent ballet…
When it was working it was a thing of beauty to me. - Vagus
(Please note that from now on I shall only refer to Cam as "The Newt" and Rivera as "BAMF")
Jerry Richardson: "Bitch slapping the NFL one signing at a time" - MMA_Pitbull
by The Duke Dude on Aug 22, 2011 8:52 AM EDT up reply actions
Big PICTURE
I am glad Cam is starting. I think he has shown he will do everything he can to succeed. If the don’t fix the DB’s and DT’s a young Brett Farve want help them. I am excited for the season, but those two areas will cost the Panthers 3 to 5 wins this year.
by NCBAMAFA on Aug 21, 2011 7:08 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
I'm sorry....what?
I kinda like power running football though. It’s iike a bloody violent ballet…
When it was working it was a thing of beauty to me. - Vagus
(Please note that from now on I shall only refer to Cam as "The Newt" and Rivera as "BAMF")
Jerry Richardson: "Bitch slapping the NFL one signing at a time" - MMA_Pitbull
by The Duke Dude on Aug 22, 2011 8:54 AM EDT up reply actions
I second that.
That third sentence is rather brutal.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
Possible translation:
‘No QB will be able to save us, with the poor Defense he’s assuming.’
I'm just happy to hear that Hardy is going to be our other starter at DE.
I’m ready to see him back in action. We are going to be getting after the quarterback in a big way this season.
As for the QB situation, I’ve said all along that Newton would be the guy unless he was totally not prepared. Neither he nor Clausen have looked phenomenal so far this pre-season. Cam will get every chance in the world either earn, or lose the job. Like it or not, it’s what the plan has been since they drafted him.
"Keep Pounding" -Sam Mills
Follow me on Twitter
I'm glad that the Kraken will be released as well.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Looking forward
To seeing him play again… Release the Kraken!!!
by MidnightDrifter on Aug 21, 2011 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions
lol
That was my favorite cartoon back in the day… Love it!!!
by MidnightDrifter on Aug 21, 2011 7:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Cam has a lot of learning to do
but I don’t want him to be tutored by Jimmy’s playing. He has nothing to show Cam.
disagree
He can show cam that the deep pass isn’t the only option. Still cam should start, worse case he completely tanks it and oldham gets his way. Best case who knows. imo if clausen starts then we’re gash anyway so give cam a chance to show why we gambled on him
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 7:52 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I am sure Oldham would rather see Cam win games than lose just so Clausen can play.
Official member of the 2011 Panthers Mafia
lol
Sometimes I can’t tell :)
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:36 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
The best thing for Clausen, at this point, would be a trade
He’s never going to get a fair shake here in Carolina and I don’t think he’s a completely ruined prospect (yet…) but that boat has sailed in Carolina I think.
but what exactly would we get in return for him on a trade?
3 chickens and a glass of milk?
could ya learn to love me? - Old Greg
by numero uno panther on Aug 21, 2011 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I wasn't gonna say it...but since no one else did, I'd venture that his current market value is about...oh I dunno...
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
by Newsinz on Aug 21, 2011 8:21 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
I lawled at the $.50 piece.
They still make those?
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think so.
But I kept a few of ’em around for keepsakes.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
This is funny because you used a fifty-cent piece
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Did someone say Fiddy Cent and his piece?
I kinda like power running football though. It’s iike a bloody violent ballet…
When it was working it was a thing of beauty to me. - Vagus
(Please note that from now on I shall only refer to Cam as "The Newt" and Rivera as "BAMF")
Jerry Richardson: "Bitch slapping the NFL one signing at a time" - MMA_Pitbull
by The Duke Dude on Aug 22, 2011 9:00 AM EDT up reply actions
So we pay tree fiddy, they get Jimmeh...go it.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
I agree with you
In part that lack of a ‘fair shake’ rests on his shoulders too. Clausen made a huge mistake traveling back to California in the offseason and electing to workout there while a vast majority of the offense stayed in Charlotte and worked together; I’m not solely talking about the team organized workouts, but prior to that many members of the team were at least lifting together, and that kind of bonding is invaluable for a young team.
Jimmy belongs in an offense that can play to his unique strengths: short passing, numerous receiving options and a dink and dunk offense that rewards moving the chains over big(ger) plays. We have seen exactly this through the first two games when you get inside the numbers:
- Clausen: 10.6 yards per completion, 4 passes over 15 yards
- Newton: 13.3 yards per completion, 5 passes over 15 yards
As it stands this team has moved on from where it was when Clausen was drafted. Honestly, it was probably a mistake to select a QB early in a lame duck year without knowing what kind of offense the new HC would run, but c’est la vie. I’d be very interested to know what Andy Reid thought of Clausen entering the draft, because he fits the Eagles like a glove.
SF might be an even better spot
They don’t have anyone and their offense fits Clausen nicely. Agree totally about drafting Clausen with a lame duck coaching staff. The one thing you need when drafting a QB is buy-in from the coaching staff which they clearly didn’t have.
Likely Clausen had already moved on mentally from being a Panther. Certainly a mistake, but he does strike as somewhat pretentious.
In your post, you mentioned that Cosell bemoaned Clausen not NFL having an NFL arm. However, from all the interviews I’ve heard from him, he described it as an average (NFL) arm. Curious where your heard / read otherwise?
I head Cosell on WFNZ a few days ago, and again today on ESPN radio. He said Clausen lacks ‘an average NFL arm for the offense Carolina is running’ which I think is fairly apt. I think he has an average arm for a lot of offense, but below-average for a vertical, deep pass scheme like we run now.
Gotcha
Thanks for the reply. Makes perfect sense given the context. It is clear that Clausen is ill suited to Chud’s offense and lacks the arm strength to play Chud’s game as designed.
Good point about the 49ers though
It just seems like Harbaugh is ready to live (and die) through Alex Smith until he feels Kaepernick is ready to take over
49ers Have Their QB Of The Future In Colin Kaepernick (A More Experienced Version Of Cam)
by PanthersRoar on Aug 21, 2011 8:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Worst situation for Kaepernick
Less talented OL, WR corp kinda shakey, college coach adjusting to the NFL, etc.
Also, he was considered more of a project than Cam as well…
Huh, sounds similar to last season, except our coach didn't give a frak.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Not Really "OldhamA", CK's Numbers Are Actually Better Than Cam's
The 49ers faced a moster pass rush in game 1, with the Saints blitzing on every play. Kaepernick out performed the 49ers starting QB Alex Smith who was only 2 of 7, for only 10 yards, while Kaepernick was 9 of 19, 47.4% (after starting 4 of 11), for 119 yards, and also ran for his life 6 times for 47 yards. However, he did have 2 ints and 2 fumbles due to the pass rush. In the 2nd Game CK was 6 of 8 (75%), for 52 yards.
So Kaepernick has a completion percentage of 55.6% in 2 games of 47.5% and 75%, for 171 yards, while Cam’s completion percentage is only 45.5%, with games of 42.1% and 50%. Kaepernick has also out rushed Cam by 29 yards, on 6 carries, for 47 yards, while Cam has 4 carries for 18 yards. CK won’t be starting before midseason at least, so he will have no chance to out perform Cam this year.
So, if “crap” out performs Cam (except for 2 ints & 2 fumbles facing nonstop blitzes, with a non blocking O-Line), then what does that make Cam?
by PanthersRoar on Aug 21, 2011 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Fair enough - I literally haven't seen a second of the 49ers pre-season, I'm just going off what I heard.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
But part of Kaepernick's problem...
…was not just that he was considered more of a project than Cam. His college numbers were outstanding at first glance. But the moment you look at Colin’s strength of schedule, that’s when it all falls apart. Most of the teams Nevada played against were very weak, and the few games that were decent strength, Kaepernick fell apart and couldn’t perform.
Now, there’s going to be translation period for the rookies before they really start to shine as they get used to the pace of the NFL as opposed to college. That said, I don’t think Kaepernick can really be compared, chiefly for the fact that Cam is specifically being told not to run, to work on his passing. So comparing statlines on rushing is a moot point. Passing, statlines aren’t something to argue with all that much.
However, the main question is who the 49ers played last week and this past game — goes back to that “strength of schedule” thing again, in many respects. We won against the Giants, lost against the Dolphins. The 49ers lost to the Saints, won against the Raiders. Overall, I’d put that in Cam’s favor, because now matter how difficult the Saints are, the Raiders are going to sabotage that strength of schedule for the 49ers thus far.
However, I would like to look at their respective performances after preseason is done. The Texans are up and coming, and the Chargers ought to make things interesting for the 49ers. Our own strength of schedule takes a nosedive with Cincinnati, but then shoots way up again with the Steelers for the final game, so I’m inclined to call the strength of schedule relatively equal.
until cam settles we need jimmy
For me he has more upside than anderson… Seriously. Hate to completely use jimmy when he could be off trying to rebuild his career but we drafted him, trade him when it suits us… Not him.
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 7:56 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Plus if I’m honest those numbers aren’t exactly worlds apart. Don’t think you can bin jimmy because average is 3.3 yards less and he has one less throw over 15
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:00 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Wait didn’t read that right… 3 yards PER throw is a bit different.
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:02 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, the total difference is 2.7 yards per completion
It means if Jimmy threw is the same distance as Cam he would have generated an extra 35 yards of offense.
Yea & If Cam's Completion Percent (45.5%) Were Higher Than Clausen's Then He Would Have Even More Yards
by PanthersRoar on Aug 21, 2011 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Sure
But, it has to be taken into account how many of Clausen’s passes went to RBs, which artificially increases his completion percentage while Cam was trying to get the ball down the field.
whoa there
Sometimes trying to get the ball down field isn’t the right choice tho. Its not really artificially increasing his percentage. Just shows cam is willing to take more risks. No surprises
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:42 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Agreed
But in terms of saying “How many more yards would Cam have had if he completed more passes?” it becomes flawed, because it has to be hand in hand with “How many times would Cam have gone to an outlet over getting the ball downfield?”
I find this argument interesting
Ultimately, isn’t it about production? To me, Newton tried to get the ball down field and tried to force it at times. Clausen also couldn’t get the ball down field, so he went to his next best option. I think that just shows they are two completely different type of players. Jake never really dumped the ball off either. and we all know how much he liked to force the ball into bad spots. Not trying to compare Jake to Newton or anything like that. I just see it as two different play styles. Neither are inherently bad. They’re just different.
For an example… Rivers likes to take shots downfield too. All it takes is once for that to work, or at least come close to working, and the defense has to respect the threat. Newton seems more apt to play that kind of game. Clausen is more like Peyton I think in that if you try to cover deep, Peyton will just shred you underneath. Granted, he’s a phenomenally better QB (which is why he can be successful in both aspects), but I’m trying to illustrate an example and that was the best I could come up with off the top of my head.
Manning can put it on a dime deep or short.
Teams obviously choose to let him take the short stuff in the hopes that the offence somehow stalls.
Obviously being Manning he doesn’t care, he’ll take what you give him.
I don’t think Clausen is any different to any other QB – he loves big plays, but he also knows his limitations (his deep ball isn’t the best) and he knows ultimately it’s about moving the chains.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
As I said, it was just an example...
That doesn’t invalidate my comparison. When I think about a QB that can nickle and dime you all day, no one pops out in my mind more than Peyton. Maybe Drew Brees.
The best ones all do it.
As I’ve said multiple times, Hasselbeck (the guy I think Clausen will turn out to be) in the WCO was a master of it. Almost unstoppable.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
It's one of those arguments that will last forever
The question ultimately is this:
“How many times could Cam Newton have found an outlet rather than forcing a pass, and how many times could Clausen have trusted his arm and gone deep vs. finding an outlet?”
On both occasions the QB leaves yards on the field, one forces the ball and gets nothing while the other plays it too safe and sacrifices the big gains. Without an overhead coaches film on a game it’s impossible to evaluate how many times this happened with each player.
I don't think you have to ask that question really
To me, that’s not what it boils down to at all. It’s about who is more productive. And I don’t have an answer to that question.
true
But all to often last year clausen ‘played it safe’ and threw a pick. If your gonna master the wco you can’t have 3-1 interception/touchdown ratio. Your not gonna master any system like that. But again jimmy was just one piece of the hideous puzzle last year
by LimeyPanther on Aug 22, 2011 5:44 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Great Idea "doncarolina", Being From Notre Dame Indy Fans Might Love Clausen
The Colts need a better long-term back up for Manning, and Clausen’s salary is very afordable at $405,00 this year, and minimun for the following 2 years. I’m not sure about onzales though, he’s injured again, maybe for a draft pick.
by PanthersRoar on Aug 21, 2011 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn't buy into that
I have a friend to went to school with Clausen. They didn’t much like him there from what I understand.
He appears to be hated everywhere - I've read multiple times that they blame him for not winning things at ND.
Despite putting up ridiculous numbers in his junior year. That defence was atrocious.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Never realized an endearing personality
Was necessary in being successful. Philip Rivers much?
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 9:19 PM EDT up reply actions
My understanding from the few Chargers fans I know is that he kind of came off as a self-entitled douchebag, and much like Jay Cutler didn’t endear himself to the rest of his team.
However, when he played in the playoff game vs. the Patriots in 2008 on a completely destroyed knee (he had ACL surgery two days after the loss) he completely won the locker room due to his toughness.
If he didn't win the locker room after that game, he never would have.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I LOVE Rivers' attitude.
I mean, how can you NOT at least respect a guy with that much fire? I never had a problem with my leaders getting down on me when I screwed up. That’s why they call them leaders. Outside the team structure, I’m sure you could call him a prick, but like ace said, I’ll bet his teammates appreciate that to no end. And, I mean, it’s the spirit of competition. It makes people a little…testy, lol. Sometimes, it takes being a prick to get you where you want to go. =)
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions
He comes off as a little classless at times, but his team like it so it clearly works.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
ha!
I thought you said you didn’t mind your leaders going down on you when you screwed up. Lol
by LimeyPanther on Aug 22, 2011 5:48 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
speaking of being a prick to get you where you want to go
Classic case in point eli manning. What douche bag refuses to play for a team that drafts them?
by LimeyPanther on Aug 22, 2011 5:51 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Kobe Bryant
Said he wouldn’t play in Charlotte.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
Phillip Rivers...
is actually a pretty cool guy. My last year at NC State, I would speak to him in one of the buildings a few times a week.
~A bullet may have your name on it...but grenades are addressed 'to whom it may be concerned...'
by boywonderncsu on Aug 21, 2011 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Sorry
Didn’t know he was hurt again. The colts are the only team I can see that makes sense for us. Maybe Buffalo? Green bay if they move Flynn?
Well, if nothing else...
it’s more fun to watch Cam being mediocre (with flashes of potential) than it is to watch Pickles be mediocre. If they can just get him to stop throwing off of that back foot…
Rofl.
I’m glad that you can say it’s better to watch one guy look average than it is to watch another guy look average. I have a feeling I’m going to need to adopt that kind of a mindset this year. Lol.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Left off a bit, actually...
“than to watch Pickles be mediocre (full stop).” I am looking forward to at least one cam-to-smitty bomb per game – that potential alone makes him more fun to watch than another series of Jimmy checking down to a RB.
Of course, this is all coming from the frame of mind that this team, while better than some Panthers teams of the past, is still no world-beater. I’m expecting a 5-11 / 6-10 season, unless Cam suddenly turns into the second coming of Brett Favruh AND Clowney becomes TJ Houshmanzadeh 2.0. From that perspective, yeah, one or two edge-of-your-seat offensive plays a game is preferable to the slow death by checkdown of last year.
You do mean
TJ when he was a Bengal right? Because if it’s TJ from the last few years in Seattle and Balt. I’ll stick with Clowny as himself…
Oh, god yes,
That’s why I’m hoping for Clowney to develop rather than advocating we see about Houshyermama himself!
Put it on the board.
Championship.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I still laugh my ass off thinking about that commercial.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:37 PM EDT up reply actions
I think the point that a lot of people are trying to make on this thread...
is that it took Clausen a full season, including a full preseason last summer, in order to reach the status of “mediocre.” Cam is there already after a cram session of an offseason, and just a few preseason games.
If I had two women to choose from, and they both looked beautiful, except one of them needed to spend an hour in a mirror to look that way, and other simply rolled out of bed looking gorgeous, it’s a no-brainer.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
by Newsinz on Aug 21, 2011 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well, what if neither one was beautiful, but you had two “6s”…..you wouldn’t give a bit more credit to the one who actually tried? ;)
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions
lol...if she was a 3 or 4 before she tried...
…sorry; I’m gonna stick with the “natural 6.”
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
Lol. So did I.
And now my girl is beating the crap out of me for calling her a 6.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Tell her you were using the Budweiser scale.
That’s how many Clydesdales it would take to pull you away from her.
"I may be old but...eh, I forget the rest!"
by GooseCreek on Aug 21, 2011 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The Clydesdale Scale...classic!
Love “Airheads”…great movie.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Rec'd for the reference. Nicely played.
I kinda like power running football though. It’s iike a bloody violent ballet…
When it was working it was a thing of beauty to me. - Vagus
(Please note that from now on I shall only refer to Cam as "The Newt" and Rivera as "BAMF")
Jerry Richardson: "Bitch slapping the NFL one signing at a time" - MMA_Pitbull
by The Duke Dude on Aug 22, 2011 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
i dunno
A 3 or 4 might appreciate it more. Nobody’s saying you have to marry her.
by LimeyPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:46 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
3s are like mopeds...
They’re fun to ride, just don’t let your friends catch you on one.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Archer reference?
That may not be where you got it; that’s just the first time I ever heard that comment/joke.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
Two 6's...
that counts as one 12, right? :)
~A bullet may have your name on it...but grenades are addressed 'to whom it may be concerned...'
by boywonderncsu on Aug 21, 2011 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Is that Clausen or the coaches though?
Let’s not forget, our QB coach was garbage and our entire offensive strategy was considered the easiest to gameplan against in the entire league. Clausen did inch forward a little bit toward the end (I’m thinking the Bucs and Browns games), but he clearly had a lot to learn.
I agree there.
We could have Frankensteined a QB last year using the dead bodies of Hall of Fame QBs and still had an embarrassing season. Coaching staff just mailed it in unlike any I’ve ever seen. Shameful.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions
you said it!
This has been a public service announcement.......
by CaptainPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:48 PM EDT up reply actions
I DISLIKE fox now!
This has been a public service announcement.......
by CaptainPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:48 PM EDT up reply actions
I dunno.....Mike Vick in his first few years would have probably made stuff happen.
Of course Smith would have probably beaten him to death for never throwing him the ball….
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Ugh.
I get a cold chill envisioning Vick in a Panthers jersey.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:49 PM EDT up reply actions
I heard somewhere richardson wanted vick but fox didn’t and then vick exploded so richardson wouldn’t renew his contract…. it’s not the whole story but just the icing on the cake with that relationship.
This has been a public service announcement.......
by CaptainPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:52 PM EDT up reply actions
vick mentioned he wanted to play here too! even though i don’t think the fox staff would have help his carrer like reids staff has!
This has been a public service announcement.......
by CaptainPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Ha, could you imagine Fox's staff developing Vick?
I have a pretty vivid imagination and even that’s beyond my talents.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
I somehow doubt
A guy like Big Cat wanted Vick. Wouldn’t have mattered anyway if the recent stories are true; i.e. the NFL steering Vick to Philly where he wouldn’t be a starter. I’ll bet Bills and Browns fans are losing their minds right now.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions
i read it somewhere
ill try and find u link…[to richardson/vick]
This has been a public service announcement.......
by CaptainPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions
It was a lost season for Clausen.
All he learned was how hard NFL D-linemen hit.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
This
~A bullet may have your name on it...but grenades are addressed 'to whom it may be concerned...'
by boywonderncsu on Aug 21, 2011 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, if Cam continues to utilize bad throwing mechanics and buckle under blitz pressure, we’re in for a long season again. If that’s the case, I hope it doesn’t almost ruin him the way it did Jimmy, or we’ll really be screwed.
C'mon now
You sound like you think Newton has never been able to pass or deal with the blitz. He only holds the NCAA single-season record for passing efficiency (188.2; higher than Luck, btw) and completed around 70% of passes against the blitz in the SEC. Of course the NFL is different; but that’s just it—he’s learning something new; it takes time.
But really, the level this guy is starting at is sick. Can’t wait to see him midseason.
++++1
This has been a public service announcement.......
by CaptainPanther on Aug 21, 2011 8:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Those stats look great
If Cam was still playing the SEC. But he’s in the NFC now, where dreams are crushed every single Sunday. College stats are what the guys who can’t make it hang onto.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 8:52 PM EDT up reply actions
No, those stats are great period. But it's interesting that you discount them...
Do you think Steve Smith and some of the other vets would have re-signed with the Panthers had Newton not been incredible in college?
His teammates know how good he had to be to lead his team to an undefeated season in what is arguably the toughest conference in CFB. They respect his collegiate numbers even if you don’t.
I think it was more Newton's intangibles
Than his hard numbers which pushed us to draft him. I think his demeanor is making it easier for the people on his team to have fun working. Honestly, I never really liked the guy based on his statistics; I liked him because I had fun watching him play. Cam’s stats were great, but where he really shines is in all the things you DON’T see on a stat sheet. He’s constantly smiling out on the field, on the sidelines, he genuinely looks like he’s having fun, and that is contagious.
Trust me when I say that no one’s on our sideline thinking, “Man, this kid is gonna go 24 for 30, with 295 yards passing, for three TDs today.”. They’re thinking “Look at how much fun this kid is!”. He is inspired and, that, in turn, is inspiring. And much more inspiring than how many rushing yards he had against Alabama in the Iron Bowl.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 9:34 PM EDT up reply actions
That's a great feel good story, but Steve Smith doesnt care about anything but winning football games.
It seems he believes they can and will win some games. I think most people see the athleticism and big arm and realize he is no Jimmy Clausen..
by Ryan439 on Aug 21, 2011 9:48 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Yep, people are willing to overlook character concerns if a guy can put Ws on the board.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Character concerns? We're talking about the NFL, right?
Lots of NFL players (from Peyton Manning on down the line) had character issues of some sort in college. Many of the issues get: swept under the rug, glossed over, brushed to the side…
I’ll say this for Newton: he works hard and he’s learning (according to Rivera). Sounds good to me.
Yes, just ask Brett Favre, M Vick, P Manning, or a legion of others..
It’s not like Clausen is a saint.
by Ryan439 on Aug 21, 2011 10:20 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Didn't say he was, but to my knowledge he also didn't receive stolen goods.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Pointless
Most of the time, very few people actually know what happens with NFL players off the field, unless the media takes a special interest—and sometimes not even then. So not having heard about something doesn’t mean it (or something worse) didn’t happen.
Who's talking about the draft?
I was talking about why Newton’s teammates respect him. He was dominant in college, and his numbers reflected that.
Intangibles too, why not?
So, since I have to, I'll spell it out.
Cam’s play so far, in THIS league, has not been especially inspiring, so the only thing I’m left with is his decidedly large advantage over Jimmy in the “hearts and minds” department. He hasn’t exactly blown anyone away with his play in the Big Boy League, but I’m thinking as time goes on, he’ll improve at the Xs and Os, and he doesn’t really have any work to do winning over his teammates, or being a great leader. The pros he’s playing with now couldn’t give a rip what his stats were in college. They leave that up to the front office.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Are you referring to the "hearts and minds" department of the team or the fans
If he has the team that is a huge advantage. If it is just the fans then I really don’t think the organization care.
You are right that his play hasn’t been inspiring. But what rookie QB in preseason has ever lit it up. Thursday is his first “real” game. Let’s reserve judgement until then.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
And that's only "real" in an alternate universe kinda way.
The real ‘real’ starts 9/11/11.
That's why I used the quotation marks
This will be a game he has to plan for. I think we will see a totally different Panthers than we saw last week. But I cannot wait for Sept 11.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
I think the team was embarrassed last week
As a result, I agree with you that we should see marked improvement this week—especially with “game situation” practices.
So Newton is going to start stepping into his throws?
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
With proper coaching, yes.
And he’s going to get better. Much much better. Something that you might as well get used to. ;-)
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Seriously - don't even you think that's got be one of the easiest things to improve?
It’s got to be easier than teaching a relatively short guy to overcome his fear of taking chances.
Wow.
Is Jimmy going to grow 4 inches? Throw over-hand? Take a shot down-field? Get much faster? Get stronger? Become a better leader? Gain the respect of his teammates? Stop throwing out of bounds or sliding short on third-down? Become less obsessed with the check-down? Grow an NFL caliber arm? Improve his pocket presence and awareness? Not be scared of the rush? Stand tall in the pocket? Improve the running game with his own threat to run? Stop throwing interceptions?
Why does he look like the 2nd best option to EVERYONE but you? I’m almost morbidly curious at this point.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
by ERL on Aug 22, 2011 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I am too, honestly.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
To me neither are ideal
But I don’t want a pony (reference to a certain picture I posted about a certain negative nancy). I’ll live with what we have I guess.
I like my QBs to win the job, rather than have it handed to them.
Obviously physically Newton is the more impressive prospect.
Mentally and technically though? I just don’t see it.
But whatever, I hated Delhomme and stuck around. Seems I’m destined to hate my QB.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Well on the flip-side...
Jimmy could have won the job, too. So you can’t sit there and back Jimmy when he has been no better, in fact I think he has been worse.
I just don’t understand how you can say that you “hate” Newton. Tell you what, when he’s done force-ably making love to your pets, and taking a dump on your favorite pillow, tell him he’s got practice at 3:30.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
He's been better than Newton this pre-season.
I find it very bizarre can’t actually formulate any sort of argument, so you start talking utter nonsense about ‘making love to pets’ and ‘taking a dump on your pillow’.
Having seen both pre-season games, Clausen is ahead of Newton at this point. If Rivera wants to start Newton and take his lumps, fine, but he should come out and say “This wasn’t an open competition. We planned to start Newton from day 1 regardless of how he looked.”
Just be honest with the fan base and the players. That’s all I ask.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Actually if you look at both players, they’ve been about even. Clausen hasn’t done anything that screams “I give this team the best chance”, and Newton has played comparable to him even though he’s only had 3 weeks of NFL experience, compared to Clausen’s full year of experience.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
We're just going round in circles.
My stance is pretty clear and it won’t change until Newton impresses me – which could be a while.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Based on your admitted hatred for Newton, it will be 2019 before that happens.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
It's going to take him 8 years to turn into a competent NFL QB?
Dear god.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
It’s going to take him 8 years to impress you…the first 7 of which he’ll be chipping away that the wall of hatred you’ve built up around yourself.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
There's no wall of hatred.
I disliked him as a prospect coming out and he’s done little to disprove that in my eyes so far.
Simple as that.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
(failed) Humor aside, I completely disagree.
He hasn’t looked better. He looked exactly like what we saw for 10+ games last season.
Hey, you are the one who said that you “hate” one of these two quarterbacks, yet you expect me to take your evaluation as a objective one?
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
Well to be fair, we “hate” the other one, so he’ll never take our evaluations as objective either.
However, he could probably take some of the other evaluations that show Newton is either dead even with or better than Jimmy seriously…there are plenty of them to go around, even from people who are objective on the matter.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Well, maybe he uses the word "hate" more freely than we.
Because I don’t hate Jimmy. Do I prefer him as my QB? Over my Aunt Gertrude, perhaps.
Is my evaluation of Jimmy fair? Probably not. But if and when he has a great game, I will be happy for the team, and happy for Jimmy. I’m not sure Oldy would reciprocate.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
You're probably right.
I support whoever is the man under center.
Sure, I gripe and complain, and I’m overly critical of Jimmy, but that’s because I don’t think he gives us the best chance to win based on what I saw last year, and based on the fact that I see the same QB this year.
But if Jimmy were to magically turn it around and take the job from Cam and lead us to a 8-8 or better season, I would be ecstatic.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
...
Is Jimmy going to grow 4 inches?
That’s his parent’s fault…he can’t help how short he is.
Throw over-hand?
Clearly this can be blamed on the law of gravity, because it somehow prevents his arm from going up higher than a side-arm delivery angle, even though it doesn’t effect anyone else other than Phillip Rivers and Kurt Warner.
Take a shot down-field?
If the receivers would stop running so far down field, he would gladly take shots down field.
Get much faster? Get stronger?
The strength and conditioning coaches should be fired, because they’re not training him properly.
Become a better leader? Gain the respect of his teammates?
Let’s just replace the other 52 players with people who will respect and follow him. Problem solved.
Stop throwing out of bounds or sliding short on third-down? Become less obsessed with the check-down?
The rules should be changed where you only have to get 5 yards for a first down instead of 10. That way, when he checks down or slides short, he’ll get more first downs. As for the out of bounds throwing…we should change the rules to allow one receiver to catch the ball out of bounds.
Grow an NFL caliber arm?
Define NFL caliber. Apparently, you have the wrong definition.
Improve his pocket presence and awareness? Not be scared of the rush?
Give him a better OL. Obviously the top-10 OL isn’t good enough. Give him an OL created in a lab with DNA from 5 HOF offensive lineman. That should do the trick.
Stand tall in the pocket?
Again, it’s not his fault his momma made him short.
Improve the running game with his own threat to run?
Create a rule that prevents QB’s from running with the ball. Problem solved.
Stop throwing interceptions?
If our receivers could run proper routes and catch, he wouldn’t throw interceptions.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
by BW Smith on Aug 22, 2011 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
(Trying to contain laughter.)
Failed—LOL.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
No, it’s a “we’re not attached at the hip to Jimmy” thing.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
If I could be bothered I'd love to power search people's opinion on Newton.
Y’know, before Luck spurned us. You’ve all changed your tune.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
I'll freely admit that I have. You don't have to search.
But my biggest problems with him were the off-field issues, such as the laptop incident. The fact that JR drafted him showed me that those things about him were in the past, because I trust the owner to make the right call on that stuff.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I'll admit
No one can do anything about my opinion of Newton off field except for Newton. On that regard, I am skeptical at best. It doesn’t matter to me what other people think of him, but I’ve always stuck to my own opinions on things. We’ll see how it goes though.
I have not.
But regardless, much has happened since then. That is a flawed practice, because that doesn’t take into account all of the days from then ’til now.
You know, those days where Newton was working hard to learn the playbook? Where he had done all the right things?
If you want to take satisfaction in the fact that you hate someone regardless of what they do, that’s fine. Disgusting and incomprehensible, but fine.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
Okay.
You are the one who said you “hate” Cam Newton, despite never having been on the same continent.
What does that leave on to think?
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
*What does that leave ONE to think
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
You think I've never visited the US?
And I hate him as a QB prospect. Plus his personality irritates me.
Coupled with the crap he pulled in college. Yeah that’s a pretty good basis for disliking someone.
And before you start – I didn’t cheat or ‘receive stolen property’ in college. So it’s not something everyone does. I also didn’t have a free ride like he did either.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
See, this is kind of the thing that gets me...
What has he done (or not done) on the football field that furthers this opinion?
If you had all of these examples to show me about how he sucks as a QB, fine. I would sit here and try to digest any opinion you could possibly conjure.
But as it is it’s all too personal.
I know you don’t like the “swagger.” But that is the way the kids do it over here now. I don’t particularly care for it, either. But if you think that Peyton Manning and Tom Brady are not cocky, arrogant fuckheads that you need to check them out a little more.
Cam is no different. Perhaps there is a slight difference in their cockyness from a cultural standpoint, but you CANNOT be a great QB in this league without belief in self. However Cam needs to make that work is fine with me.
As for the laptop and the pay for play…If you don’t think that nearly ALL of the Division 1A football players live within the same moral code than you got yet another thing coming.
Hate him, hate ’em all.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
Something that needs to be said
There’s never a good reason to dislike someone you don’t know. The truth is, you sound envious.
I don’t know of anyone who approves of Newton’s conduct at UF; there is nothing wrong with giving him a second chance, however. And he seems to have handled it well—at least according to his NFL coaches (you know, the people who actually know him). According to them, he is a hard-worker, takes his responsibilities seriously, and is improving.
The reality is this: he’s good-looking, rich, and (in your opinion) has gotten away with doing things that are wrong (I don’t think his actions were without consequence, but that’s another discussion).
On top of all of these things, Newton was drafted #1, is confident, and has tons of fans rooting for him. Now you feel like the coaches are “giving” him the starting job (again, I must contest this view).
This whole situation seems unfair to you and alot of other people. You are just waiting for “karma” to put him in his place. Perhaps you should be more concerned about what such a perspective reveals about you personally, and your own future date with “karma”, so to speak.
By rooting against Newton, you attempt to feign a love of justice (to balance out the scales!), but this is belied by your love of other athletes who have also done things wrong.
I’m done with this topic.
Which athletes do I love, exactly?
As for the rest, utter, utter nonsense.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Was Luck a better prospect for 2011?
You bet your ass. Long-term? We dunno.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
He was both a better prospect long term and in 2011.
He had some major question marks about his game too – ones that he’s going to answer this season (mainly: was it the coach or was it Luck’s talent that made Stanford so successful).
And no it’s an inexact science. No-one knows who will pan out. It’s much more about where they land than people give credit for.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
I've always agreed that one's situation is critical.
Luck, if he decides to turn pro next offseason, can only hurt his stock. It will, as you eluded to, be interesting to see what he does post-Harbough.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
your both wrong
Derek anderson is this teams future. Now all of you pipe down. Its time we were serious
by LimeyPanther on Aug 22, 2011 3:50 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
also we can sit here and argue about who's better all we want
But in the end. RR is gonna pick newton.
by LimeyPanther on Aug 22, 2011 4:21 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Apparently, I need to spell it out, as well...
Obviously Newton needs to improve. Were you expecting Tom Brady numbers after a couple of weeks?
And why are you still talking stats? My point with the stats is that they point to his dominant play—which IS something the pros respect.
No, I was not expecting Brady-like numbers. If you would like to know why I wasn’t expecting those types of numbers, just look at my earlier post where I stated that all I was really expecting was for Cam to look obviously better than Jimmy, which, given Jimmy’s play last year, seemed like a sure thing. But Cam hasn’t done that.
And many, many QBs have demonstrated dominant play in the college game, only to get drafted way too high and drummed out of the league inside of three or four years. Matt Leinart? Back-up. Alex Smith? Barely serviceable. Vince Young? Backup headcase. JaMarcus Russell? Ryan Leaf? Troy Smith? And then, you have to consider guys like Tom Brady and Good Jake, who did absolutely nothing in college relative to the above guys, who came in and found a system that they understood completely, and flourished. You have to SHOW you can be dominant at the highest level before the guys who play at the highest level will believe that you can do it. They’ve seen too many Heisman Trophy winners come and go.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Uh-huh, already know this
It’s called “the quarterback problem”—no one can predict future success of QBs in the NFL. No one is trying to. Read my previous post to see why I mentioned the stats.
Now: Cam doesn’t have to look better than Jimmy—Cam’s been at it 3 weeks; Jimmy 2 years. The fact that Cam is about equal with Jimmy who is in his 2nd year says it all right there.
/dead horse beaten
Heh
I hope you realize your misrepresentation of playing time really takes away from your argument. This is Jimmy’s 2nd year. That means he’s had 1 year of experience, not 2.
That pretty accurately descibes Clausen, doesn't it, and the frequency with which his supporters hark back to his ND stats?
But he’s in the NFC now, where dreams are crushed every single Sunday. College stats are what the guys who can’t make it hang onto.
You haven't noticed? ;-)
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Hey, I don't keep bringing up this spurious reasoning about Clausen being our QB - you and oldham and Kackalack are the ones.
I’m just commenting, when the urge strikes me.
Was there a rule passed when I was absent that limited conversations to only your side of the issue?
by bigdavis on Aug 22, 2011 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
And you're absolutely wrong by thinking I think Jimmy should start.
See if you can find where I said that. I’ll wait.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions
I'd kindly like to be omitted from that...
Maybe you should go back and actually read some of my comments before jumping to conclusions? I’m squarely on the fence.
Omissions granted, for both you and Kackalack.
Sorry that I scanned a lot of posts quickly, and got the impression (refuted upon closer re-reading) that you two were more or less on Oldham’s side, in supporting Clausen as our QB. The comment comparing Clausen to Peyton Manning, and dinking and dunking you to death, was key to my mistaken inferences.
I hope you’ll note that I do, unlike some others, man up and admit an error, when I’ve made one.
Carry on. To bed for me.
It's all good, BigD.
Most of my posts were just in stark contrast to some of our peeps glowing endorsements of Cam, who I feel has won the starting job by default, and that, to me, is upsetting. I expected a guy with this much talent to come in and immediately look at least marginally better than Jimmy.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions
I know
The Peyton comparison is probably ill conceived because Peyton is quite possibly the best QB in the NFL and Clausen is quite possibly the worst. I just can’t really think of a good “dink and dunk” QB off the top of my head probably because when successful, that style of play opens up other opportunities. And we were quite a bit less than successful.
Love him as a person, but until emus learn to fly, I don't want him as my QB.
The Big Boy League just sounds a bit grown up for his skill set.
I disagree
I’m pretty willing to give just about everyone a clean slate after the mess of last year. Not saying he can make it, but I haven’t completely written him off yet either.
Well I saw enough to convince me he wasn't growing into the job.
But that’s JMO, and you have yours. Whichever one of us turns out to be right, I just hope it’s for the benefit of the Panthers, because that’s why I’m on this blog, and not because of any individual player, per se.
I just see parallels to his situation with Drew Brees
I don’t necessarily think he will become like Brees mind you, I just think the door isn’t completely shut on him. Granted, I don’t know if that door is going to stay open too much longer, but it’s not shut yet.
Can't shut the door on a guy who's 2 years into his career.
That seems…vastly unfair. Especially when the guy was a second round pick at QB projected in the first round.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 12:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Right
that’s what I mean really. Drew Brees was in almost the exact same situation. He’s shorter, has trouble getting balls over the line, and doesn’t have the strongest of arms. Lot of similarities there. Of course, he could also be as big of a bust as some of the other guys who were first round projections too and there are many more of those…
Yeah, why do that
Instead rip a rookie who’s been practicing for a few weeks.
Fair has nothing to do with anything.
Look, dude,
I don’t want the guy to fail. I don’t even think he will fail. Nobody’s ripping anyone. I definitely think Cam will be a great NFL QB. He’s just ain’t there yet. It’s okay.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 9:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Jim Plunket & Steve Young Might Be Better Example "aceofsween"
Both started out poorly, getting traded or cut, but came back to win Super Bowls with their 2nd teams, and Young wasn’t blessed with a very strong arm either. i think Brees started out a little better than the other 2.
by PanthersRoar on Aug 22, 2011 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions
Neither names are familiar enough to me to make comparisons
Jim Plunket I’m not familiar with at all and Steve Young was just a little bit before I started following football closely. I wasn’t even in highschool when he played his last game…
Yes...
People who are now in their mid 20s were not in high school when Steve Young played his last game. ; )
Yeah, I guess it does.
But no one’s suggesting that Jimmy can carry this team.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions
No, I sound like someone who doesn’t believe a guy will automatically be great in the NFL just because he was great in college, or because we drafted him.
by SlayerGhaleon on Aug 21, 2011 9:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I think we learned that with Weinke, if not K Collins..got a taste of it with Clausen but I suppose the jury is still out.
by Ryan439 on Aug 21, 2011 10:23 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Great news about Hardy
Hotty Toddy, you’ve earned it.
Not afraid. - Deuteronomy 31:6
by dowhatchado on Aug 21, 2011 8:27 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Once Brayton left I guess he was the next man in line.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
No, it was because he was going to start, that they got rid of Brayton...
…that, and the fact that Brayton did absolutely nothing last year to keep the job.
I expect Hardy to show great production this year. With CJ earning more double teams, it’s entirely possible that Hardy may be the better of the two.
Hardy's only flaw last year was run defense
And in that aspect he will certainly be better with a year under his belt. I completely agree. I expect good things from him, assuming the interior of our line shows up.
That rep might need a bit of reinspection.
I noticed on many occasions that his pursuit on running plays was more aggressive and productive than that of any other DLman.
There were, by my count, only 2 times that he didn’t seal the edge, whereas Brayton failed to do so continuously.
The next time Hardy gets on the field, resist the urge to watch the ball-carrier, and notice instead the intensity with which Hardy plies his trade.
Now, some questioned his effort, coming out of college, but I never saw him take a play off last year. And from what he’s said and done since the motorcycle brush with death, his very joy at being alive should only ratchet up that intensity.
He has abnormal size and power, and that coupled with desire makes a very mean DE. If we can only develop some push up the middle from our group of DTs, we’ll have a formidable pass rush.
Perhaps
I’m remembering Hardy being in their, (particularly against the last Bucs game I think?) and not defending the run at all. Then again, if memory serves, that was a bad defensive outing in general particularly in the run department. So you’re right, it may be unwarranted.
I'm so geeked about getting to see THE KRAKEN on a regular basis!
I thought one of Foxy’s biggest “FUs” to his former employers was keeping Hardy on the sidelines for the majority of last season, even when he seemed to be making huge plays every time he was given an opportunity. E. Brown has had more than his fair share of chances to keep his spot, and hasn’t done much with them aside from perfecting the art of spinning right into the chest of the man he was trying to spin away from.
Hardy on one end, CJ on the other, and a pair of eager rookie DTs trying to earn their keep sounds like an awesome defensive front. I look forward to seeing them this Thursday for more than a series or two.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
The Other Alternative
Through this entire string, it appears very clear that neither Cam nor Jimmy is ready to start. We knew we were going to start this season two months behind experienced crews. Sheerly from his experience level, and particularly with Chud’s offense, Derek Anderson should start the season.
I don’t think anybody is seriously looking at the Panthers as a Super Bowl contender this season. Give Cam and Jimmy a good six weeks with the clipboard and, more importantly, Coach Shula. If Anderson hasn’t stolen the job by then (and that is extremely doubtful), let one of the kids take a shot. That time will give them a better shot all the way around and not ruin the prospects of a #1 pick with shell-shock.
I'd like to nominate this for "Worst Idea Ever"
by Ryan439 on Aug 21, 2011 9:06 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 4 recs
No offense, man, but
Sheerly
is like nails on chalkboard to me, lol.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Not saying it's poor grammar
Just…I don’t know, lol. It sounds bad?
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Or we don't care as much as people think we do ;-)
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Ok, fine. You caught me. :-)
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
by BW Smith on Aug 22, 2011 12:52 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
New Kicker just made a twitter account.
@OlindoMare10
Those who have Follow
Proud member of the Panthers Mafia!
Saving The Environment One Green Comment at a Time
Nickname that stuck. He is a beast Fox kept locked away and a BAMF is about to set him loose. Guess that makes Ron Rivera Zeus lol
Proud member of the Panthers Mafia!
Saving The Environment One Green Comment at a Time
by MMA_PITBULL on Aug 21, 2011 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Rivera as Zeus makes sense...
Zeus – father of the Gods
Rivera – father of the BAMFs
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
Because he's huge
And we can only sate his bloodthirsty rampages with sacrifices of cute little Greek girls.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 21, 2011 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions
We’re here to help. ;)
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Do we know who all will be playing this game?
3rd game is the big one. We need to see some Smitty, Stewart, Beason, Otah, Hardy… Are these guys in?
STEVE SMITH!
by southtunnel on Aug 21, 2011 10:11 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Smitty: In
Stewart: In
Beason: Out
Otah: Out
Hardy: In
At least that’s what I’ve heard
by James Dator on Aug 21, 2011 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions
everybody but Otah and Beason have the green light as of today.
Proud member of the Panthers Mafia!
Saving The Environment One Green Comment at a Time
by MMA_PITBULL on Aug 21, 2011 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions
it defiantly doesn’t look good but sept 11 is when i want to see him on the field. Which is still 3 weeks away. Although even when he comes back he still has to learn the system. Connor and Gaither might have to fill in until Beason gets 100% and gets a feel for the system
Proud member of the Panthers Mafia!
Saving The Environment One Green Comment at a Time
by MMA_PITBULL on Aug 21, 2011 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm not worried. We have a pretty good LB behind him, unlike with Otah.
I’d rather him play obviously, but if he misses a couple of weeks, we’re not taking nearly as big of a hit as we are when Otah isnt playing. We have no OL depth.
by Ryan439 on Aug 21, 2011 10:35 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Honestly, I'm not concerned yet
The guy has a knack for being ready when the real games start, and he’s never missed one. I think he’ll be okay by the time Sept.11 rolls around
by James Dator on Aug 21, 2011 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Otah, on the other hand...
I don't always fail, but when I do...
I do it awesomely.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Aug 22, 2011 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions
beast will be fine
Otah clearly has knees that are made of paper held together with spit and glue. A light breeze seems to be enough to put him IR. I can just hear the commentators now…. Otah is down… It appears a defensive lineman farted vaguely in his direction… Get the cart
by LimeyPanther on Aug 22, 2011 8:23 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Hardy just started practicing
He’s still recovering from abrasions. He’s not going to play thursday
Guacamole <3
The game is actually Thursday, not Friday.
Just FYI, so you don’t miss it. :-)
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
You're right! Damn. Age showing. Thanks.
Played in a tournament today, and missed my nap.
they aren't broadcasting the game on NFLN are they?
I hope it will be on a local channel.
I don't always fail, but when I do...
I do it awesomely.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Aug 22, 2011 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions
It should be on local tv.
I don’t think we have any national games this year…and if they picked the Bengals game as the one game they show nationally, then someone should be fired, lol.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
lol
I don't always fail, but when I do...
I do it awesomely.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Aug 22, 2011 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions
I think Armanti should start ahead of LaFell this week
LaFell just hasn’t shown anything. Armanti however has made the most of his opportunities. And while he still might not be that polished… He’s shown he has a high potential to improve a alot! Something I’m not so sure of with LaFell.
STEVE SMITH!
by southtunnel on Aug 21, 2011 10:22 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
I agree. Armanti has looked like our #2 if you ask me..
LaFell is disappointing bcuz he has the physical tools, and while he’s not as bad as D Jarrett, he does under perform. Seems like he’s not working very hard at becoming a btter WR..
by Ryan439 on Aug 21, 2011 10:55 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
So they are this high on Hardy simply from film?
I find that a little strange…he hasn’t put pads on yet in practice right?
I just think with his size and ability they see him more as a every down DE and Norwood and Brown as more specialist. They are strictly pass rushers
Proud member of the Panthers Mafia!
Saving The Environment One Green Comment at a Time
by MMA_PITBULL on Aug 21, 2011 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions
And in brown's case he can't even do that effectively
Sooo me, Cam, Ron, Marty, Don, Chud, Sean, Mike and Jerry are going out to have some Cammy Cam juice... Who's coming?
One wonders how much the 2010 draft played into this
We have two former defensive coordinators on the roster, maybe it was as simple as both Rivera and McDermott wanting Hardy for the Chargers and Eagles respectively, and when he was in Carolina they already did the due diligence to know his ability.
by James Dator on Aug 21, 2011 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions
very possible. Hardy at one point was first round talent. Both guys could be familiar with him from Ole Miss scouting.
Proud member of the Panthers Mafia!
Saving The Environment One Green Comment at a Time
by MMA_PITBULL on Aug 21, 2011 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Or...
After Hardy crashed his bike, he carried it the remaining 200 or so miles to Spartanburg, walked into Rivera’s office, and said “Coach, when these nagging cuts heal up I’m starting right?”, and Rivera, impressed with the young man who reminded him so much of himself when he was a 20-something linebacker trying to make a name for himself, said “Yes, son. You are.”
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
by BW Smith on Aug 21, 2011 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions 9 recs
I had nothing to do with greening this
But to not rec’ it would be to deny the sheer awesomeness of that situation happening in this or any other universe. And thanks to many worlds theory, this did probably happen somewhere.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
3*
don’t forget Meeks
"Don't put off til tomorrow what you can put off til the day after tomorrow." -Mark Twain
by SouthernPanther on Aug 22, 2011 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions
They surely must have studied last year's film exhaustively, in order to evaluate who to keep, and who not to.
If we could see the effect that Hardy had, vs that of Brayton, so could the new staff. Had he not suffered the cycle mishap, he’d have been starting the last 2 games, and the whole Brown/Norwood misadventure would have been lessened.
Are we ready to call Brown a bust yet?
1st round draft choice for a player who is still not looking like he can make an impact on game day. Maybe it’s just his position, but do DEs really take 3 years to mature? Brown seems serviceable at best. It’s unfortunate he hasn’t really materialized (though like I said earlier, last year was such a damn quagmire). Granted, James Anderson didn’t start lighting things up to 09 and now he looks rock solid, but still.
As for Norwood… I really have no idea what we should do with him. Overstocked on LB and he’s a little small for DE, kinda in the same boat as Brown.
I am...
he hasn’t shown me anything aside from preseason last year. All he does now is spin himself out of plays, he’s simply too small to be able to push back NFL O-lineman…
I think he’d be able to stick at a 3-4 OLB spot somewhere
"Don't put off til tomorrow what you can put off til the day after tomorrow." -Mark Twain
by SouthernPanther on Aug 22, 2011 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Freeney is a freak though...
Brown just gets pushed around to easily…he has no other move than the spin move…
"Don't put off til tomorrow what you can put off til the day after tomorrow." -Mark Twain
by SouthernPanther on Aug 22, 2011 12:44 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm personally not ready to call Brown an outright bust, BUT
I’m definitely ready to pull him from the starting lineup. I have been since around mid season last year, actually. I’m just so glad the Fox school of “You’re-a-starter-until-you’re-not-but-who-are-we-kidding-I’ll-start-ya-until-you-keel-over-and-die” is no longer a crippling element of our organization’s philosophy.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
wcnc 36 just showed clausen's highlights from friday nite
2 of them were handoffs to sutton
"We want them to play fast, we want them to play physical, we want them to play hard and most importantly we want them to play smart." RR 8-3-11
any word on why 32 is getting in the game before 22 so far?
is josh outpracticing sutton?
"We want them to play fast, we want them to play physical, we want them to play hard and most importantly we want them to play smart." RR 8-3-11
I'm not really sure... at this point all I could do it guess
Vaughan is a much larger back, easily the biggest on the roster at 6", 232lbs- so maybe the idea is to see how he can handle the load.
Perhaps they’re trying to get a good look before 1st cuts to see if he’s someone they need to find a place for on the PS
by James Dator on Aug 22, 2011 12:27 AM EDT up reply actions
Vaughn was on the PS last season though...
I feel like they know what they have in him. I still think Sutton > Goodson…
"Don't put off til tomorrow what you can put off til the day after tomorrow." -Mark Twain
by SouthernPanther on Aug 22, 2011 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions
I don't understand that either
I think Sutton is quite easily as good as if not better than Goodson. Last year, Goodson kinda leap frogged Sutton due to his injuries and then coming on strong, but Sutton doesn’t have that fumbling problem…
as far as carrying the ball though
i’d take sutton any day over goodson, until goody proves he can hold onto the ball. Sutton is so underrated it’s ridiculous. The guy could start IMO for some teams, he is so strong for his size and shiftier than people would think.
"Don't put off til tomorrow what you can put off til the day after tomorrow." -Mark Twain
by SouthernPanther on Aug 22, 2011 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions
And he blocks like a FB.
And did so when Hoover was out, I recall.
That he does
Sutton made a great block on a blitz pick up where I really thought Clausen was going to get creamed. If I recall, it was the play where Clausen scampered ahead and then threw it right as he got to the line of scrimmage. Forgot who he connected with, but without Sutton, he was eating turf.
I was thinking
That Fi has really underwhelmed in camp and the preseason, and that the coaches want to see what Vaughan could do out there because Vaughan was going to be our FB after Fi got cut, seeing as we were probably going to carry four TEs going into the regular season. But now with Barnidge’s injury, I dunno what Fi’s role is going to be, and that muddies up the waters for Vaughan as well.
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 1:00 AM EDT up reply actions
It should be noted
In the first game with Fi at FB the 1st team RBs averaged 5.8 yards per carry, in game two the 1st team RBs without Fiametta averaged 2 yards per carry
by James Dator on Aug 22, 2011 7:36 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Before you posted this
I was gonna ask Kid where the news of Fiametta under-performing came from. I haven’t really heard much about him one way or another, which is usually a good thing for a fullback.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
He's being on the upswing, its just the bitterness from the past
When he spot-started for Hoover when Hoov was injured, it was like night and day. The run game was absolutely atrocious. In the beginning of 2010 it was still that way for a bit but improved throughout the season. He missed a LOT of blocks, but that has settled down a bit.
Whoa!
Well…I was definitely wrong there, lol. I bow to your wealth of accumulated knowledges, sir. =)
"You know you're in Charlotte when every day while you're having lunch in the city you hear ... "GOD Scott Fowler is a retard!"
by The Kackalack Kid on Aug 22, 2011 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions
but KRs are less important this year with the 35 yard line thing
"We want them to play fast, we want them to play physical, we want them to play hard and most importantly we want them to play smart." RR 8-3-11
If we had the same coaches I would agree we knew all about Vaughn
But BAMF and Co. probably only have 3 weeks of info on him. With Stewart nursing an injury and it being preseason, it is a good idea to let him run with the big boys. Hell, he could become trade bait too, or atleast get picked up by someone who can use him. I don’t think BAMF is going to not let a player get some tape so that he can stash them on the practice squad. I may be wrong, but I don’t think that a former player would do that.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
Greg Hardy
He was my favorite pick of last years draft and that still holds true. The guy has incredible tools and unlimited potential. I thought he was our future starter as soon as we drafted him. Had he not been injured at Ole Miss he woulda gone in the 1st round. They guy is a freak athlete and I’m so glad he fell into our laps in the 6th round last year!
"Don't put off til tomorrow what you can put off til the day after tomorrow." -Mark Twain
by SouthernPanther on Aug 22, 2011 12:37 AM EDT reply actions
Any word on when he'll be ready?
Season opener would be great
Just out of curiosity
We kinda say Clausen is in a bad situation… but someone who is even worse off could be Tony Pike. Regardless of what happens with Clausen and where he ends up in the depth chart, he’s still in the mix for the starting job. Pike on the other hand is not, and I’m not even sure he can be put on a practice squad due to playing last year. I don’t know the exact requirements for the PS, but that’s arguably the worst possible situation you can be in.
i still don't understand why we drafted pike...
i understand best player available…but when it is a QB who was clearly a project, and had no shot over clausen…let alone over newton now…just seemed like a wasted draft pick…
"Don't put off til tomorrow what you can put off til the day after tomorrow." -Mark Twain
by SouthernPanther on Aug 22, 2011 1:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Pike wasn't a project. He was your typical low round rookie QB.
He needed to bulk up, learn the play book, and adjust to NFL speed.
The fact that he’s had a nagging shoulder injury is why he’s struggled.
It was a value pick that made sense considering who we had on the roster.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Not really...
I mean, we went in with 2 rookie QBs and 1 QB who had only started what.. 8 games or something? That was never a smart move I don’t think.
Finally a negative comment about clausen (WOW)
My theory was wrong your not the father and I quote Mel Kiper Jr of the “MOST NFL READY QB IN THE DRAFT 2010” I stand corrected
by FigNewtonsNClausenBars on Aug 23, 2011 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Um.....
That comment is about Tony Pike, not Jimmy Clausen.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I Feel The Panthers Had Settled On Pike Before The Draft & Clausen Falling Surprised Them
I haven’t heard anything about how Pike’s trip to California to see a shoulder specialist went last week. He was injured in December, and I still don’t thank he’s been able to throw. They could put him on the PUP list since he hasn’t practiced yet, see if he’s ready by the 9th week, and if not then put him on IR, or they could just cut him.
all i know is this...
Tony Pike, Dereck Anderson, Jimmy Clausen or Cam Newton. Doesnt matter who starts Thurs. If we cant beat the sorry ass Bengals I will most likely cry myself to sleep..
by PantherTrain on Aug 22, 2011 2:13 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Our defense will have a lot to say about the outcome on Thursday.
I’m thinking Arby’s our D will have even more impact on the final score than any of our QBs. If we get gashed up the gut like Reggie “Freakin’” Bush (with whom I have never been and still am not terribly impressed, btw) did to us last Saturday, it won’t matter if Newton tears it up for 3 quarters.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
It’s good mood food…
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
by BW Smith on Aug 22, 2011 9:06 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Greg Hardy!!
Lining up as the starting DE opposite of Charles Johnson. Hells yeah!!
You get what you put in and people get what they deserve.
by Disciple of Carolina on Aug 22, 2011 7:26 AM EDT reply actions
OK I'm just gonna say this and y'all can agree or not
Otah, while very talented and a definate force when he is on the field needs to be cut and they need to find a solid replacement. I love to see Otah on the field because he is one of the best Olinemen we’ve ever had but he can’t get on the field without getting injured. He missed part of the ‘09 season, all of the ’10 season and it ain’t looking good for this season. This is his third or forth season and he has been injured more games than he has played. I think it’s about time to call this dude a bust and move on.
IT AIN'T SIZE OF THE DOG IN THE FIGHT BUT THE SIZE OF THE FIGHT IN THE DOG
I'd say there'd be anywhere from 20-25 teams that would snatch him up the second we cut him.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
that's fine why don't they trade him then
Let it be somebody elses problem.
IT AIN'T SIZE OF THE DOG IN THE FIGHT BUT THE SIZE OF THE FIGHT IN THE DOG
That wasn't my point.
To be blunt, I think you’re giving up on him too soon. Let’s agree to disagree, shall we?
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
What's the benefit
Of cutting Otah. I’ve heard people advocate cutting him a few times now, but what is the benefit of cutting him/cons of keeping him? Don’t think we’d save any cap $, if he gets cut he def doesn’t play, if we keep him maybe he does play and we all agree he is good when he plays.
We can sign another RT whether we cut him or not so I don’t see the benefit of cutting him, not until the end of the season at least…
It's a wild thought, but Jimmy to Indy in the next few weeks?
Do you think that Indy would trade for Clausen if Manning’s neck isn’t healing quickly enough? The idea of Jimmy going there has been floated around in this thread, but does anyone think that may happen in the next week or so.?
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
Nope
If for no other reason, because Jimmy simply doesn’t hold any value right now. Anything the Colts (or any other team, for that matter) would be willing to offer us simply wouldn’t be worth letting go of Clausen for.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
The only reason I thought of it is that their backup QB's are worth even less.
Jim Irssay even made a Brett Favre joke on twitter due to Manning’s injury. They may see Jimmy as a guy who can come out for a few weeks to start the season and then pull an Arron Rodgers thru the rest of Peyton’s career. It would probably be the best situation Jimmy could fall into, but it would leave us screwed for depth.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
Your last sentence speaks volumes.
…but it would leave us screwed for depth.
I think Jimmy stays, at least for this season.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
Fair enough.
Goddamn quebecios! It is 35 miles per hour, not 35 kilometers per... whatever is metric for hour.
Colts have 4 QBs on their roster
They don’t need any more.
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