Can the Panthers Compete for a Playoff Spot in 2011?
It seems every time I break down how I think we can win it all, or at least be competitive, the naysayers come out and tell me that 4 or 5 wins would be good enough, and we shouldn't expect more. I disagree. I'm gonna keep making my point until we either get to win number 8, or loss number 8. We'll know real soon if I'm right. I wanted to break this down by looking at team stats, and comparing us to other worst to first teams.
The first team I want to brin gup is the Miami Dolphins. In 2007, the Dolphins were 1-15. The next year, they won the division at 11-5. Ronnie Brown led the 2007 team with 600 yards, and Cleo Lemon was the starting QB. Cam Cameron was the coach. The next season, Chad Pennington was the QB, Ronnie Brown led the team with over 900 yds rushing, but Ricky Williams contributed 650 yds also, and Tony Sparano was the coach.
Then there were the Rams of last year. They were 1-15 in 2009, and only averaged 10.9 pts a game with Marc Bulger, who some think should come to Carolina. They kept the same coach, and added one key player, Sam Bradford. They were one win away from winning their division at 7-9. The Seahawks won it at 7-9.
So now I look at our Panthers...after the jump...
So now I look at our Panthers. Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams have never accomplished the dominance our top two RBs have achieved. Look at the Rams receivers, Amendola and Avery...nowhere near Smitty, Gettis and LaFell. I don't even know who their TE is. We have all the talent to beat anybody. No team in the league is as complete as we are. If you look at the Falcons, their LBs and secondary are not all that great, and they had problems with the pass rush. Look at the Pack, they don't have a dominant running game. The Patriots need a pass rush. The Chargers lost their offensive and defensive coordinator. The Jets are gonna lose at least one, maybe both, of their top two receivers, their running game struggled, and they may lose their #2 CB. We have holes, but we are extremely talented. The case could be made for the talent on the Steelers and Ravens, especially on defense, but that's only two teams, and neither of them won the superbowl.
Let's look at some numbers. Last year we averaged 143 yards passing a game. Many people predicted Cam would throw for at least 2,000 yards, maybe 2500. If Cam starts all 16 games, I believe he'll get to 3,000 yds passing. That's still less than 200 a game. So it's not all that phenomenal. Most rookies don't get there because they don't start enough games. Colt McCoy averaged 197 a game. Over 16 games, he would've been close to 3200. Cam can throw as well as McCoy. Cam has more quality receivers than Bradford and McCoy. Bradford threw for 3500 yards, with 18 TDs to 15 INTs.
Let's look at the running game. Maybe it's too much to ask both RBs to get over 1100 yards again, but who's gonna have an off year? In 2009 and 2010, D-Will and Stew combined for over 2200 yards both seasons. I think they will combine with Goodson to get to 2000 yards this year. Add to that about 500 yards from Cam (average of ONLY 32 yards a game, down from 105 ypg in college), and we're at 2500 yards rushing for the season.
Combine those passing and rushing numbers, and we're at 5500 total yards of offense. Last year, 5500 yards of offense would've put us at 15th, so I'm not predicting the greatest offense of all time. But if we go from the 32nd ranked offense to about 15th, that does more to help our CBs and DTs than bringing in new talent. We were 26th in pts allowed, and 18th in yards allowed. If we get D-Will and Stew running at full speed again, and Cam has an above average year, it could set us up to have a defense near or in the top 10.
Those numbers don't guarantee us a superbowl win. But if things unfold like I expect, then it wouldn't be a stretch for us get something close to the 2008 Dolphins or 2010 Rams. 7-9 is certainly a possibility, and I think 10 wins is not out of the question.
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A couple comments
You say that D-Will and JStew combined for over 2200 yards both seasons (’09 and ’10). Are you combining the numbers for those years? Last year stats for both:
(http://www.nfl.com/teams/carolinapanthers/statistics?team=CAR)
Stewart: 770 yards
Goodson: 452 yards
Williams: 361 yards
Also, I also think (especially with the history in this division of teams making quick turnarounds) that we can compete for a playoff spot. We’ve got a tough division, though, so we definitely have the odds stacked against us. I’m really hoping for at least 8-10 wins or better. I may be setting myself up for disappointment but I really like the roster we’ve put together.
by Fernando De La Cruz on Jul 25, 2011 8:44 AM EDT reply actions
my bad, i meant 2008 and 2009
Last year was horrible for the whole offense
by usana_gaines on Jul 25, 2011 9:43 AM EDT up reply actions
Be nice If
2011-2012
Williams: 1000 yards
Stewart: 1000 yards
Goodson: 600 yards
Cam: 600 yards.
by LovePanthers on Jul 25, 2011 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions
In 2011, probably not.
But in 2012…look out NFL.
One cries because one is sad. For example: I cry because others are stupid, and it makes me sad.
Can we? Well, sure.
If we are competing for a playoff spot this season, it means that we are probably like 6-8 in a weak NFC Wild card chase.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
I doubt 6-8 will be competing.
I mean 6-8 (lets say we end with 8-8) would probably be near the bottom in our own division. I doubt that would be enough to get a playoff spot, even as a wild card team.
We didn't lose the game; we just ran out of time. ~ Vince Lombardi
by ThePanthers! on Jul 25, 2011 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Not that I wouldn't be happy with 8-8.
or 6 wins. I’m just happy they’re getting a chance to play all 16 games.
We didn't lose the game; we just ran out of time. ~ Vince Lombardi
by ThePanthers! on Jul 25, 2011 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions
in a weak NFC wild card chase
I said that it would have to be a weak year in the NFC. I realize 6-8 is not typically in the running for a wildcard, but we have been around .500 in past years, yet still had an outside shot at sneaking in…with some help, of course.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
In the NFL anything is possible.
In NFC South that saying holds even more water. I agree with BW in that it is not likley for the Panther to make the playoffs. Yet that does leave room for a chance. Remember however that going 10-6 would not garrantuee a playoff spot. I think that in any case this season is going to a ride for us fans, and if lady luck finds us and the injury bug finds other teams we could find our selves in the wildcard spot. For the price of one soul the Super bowl… any takers?
I am a proud supporter of troll hunting---- me.
When I see or hear sports segments dedicated to fantasy sports I want drive a nail in my ear because it is less painful. --also me.
Well reasoned post, usana - I Rec'd it.
Personally, I think the Saints have peaked, and won’t compete for the Division again. Something about how Brees finished last year makes me think he’s seen his best years. The Katrina Effect has run its course. However, the Bucs are on the improve, and the Falcons will still be a force.
We’re probably a year or two away from the big stage, but if we can win 3 of the first 6 games (better than 50-50 to me), we’ll be relevant, and maybe snag a WC spot this year.
I have been Hearing that Brees was not 100% recovered from a preseason surgery last year.`
I do think inertia of “Who dat” nation has fadded a degree, however Brees is dangerous and Sean Payton remains a sharp offeincive mind so the road to the division for now goes through them. But we are comeing a Newton model 2011 so we might do it lol.
I am a proud supporter of troll hunting---- me.
When I see or hear sports segments dedicated to fantasy sports I want drive a nail in my ear because it is less painful. --also me.
by bigred28655 on Jul 25, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm honestly more worried about Ingram than I am Brees or Payton.
"I don't know whatchu came to do...but IIIIIIIIIIIIII came to praise his name, yeyuss!!
~Reverend Brown, Coming to America
His is going to be a nasty brusier.
And brusiers only get strong as the game goes on. he will not have the work load of Mcaluster had so he could be around longer as well.
I am a proud supporter of troll hunting---- me.
When I see or hear sports segments dedicated to fantasy sports I want drive a nail in my ear because it is less painful. --also me.
by bigred28655 on Jul 25, 2011 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions
A scary thought
Think what Payton could have done with Williams and Stewart on his team.
I am a proud supporter of troll hunting---- me.
When I see or hear sports segments dedicated to fantasy sports I want drive a nail in my ear because it is less painful. --also me.
by bigred28655 on Jul 25, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
improvement, but...
that dolphins turnaround was defly the exception to the rule. i think we can hope for a best case scenario of 7-9 wins. if the #6 seed is weak this year, then we have a chance, but a remote one. realistic expecs for us to succeed with a deep run in the playoffs would be cam’s 3rd year….unless he pans out to be, truly, SUPERCAM
good post
I think 7 to 9 wins is realistic. My issue is also with so-called experts who expect us to get the 1st pick again. I think Cam will be SuperCam, and we’ll see it this year, but not as consistently as needed to be a superbowl winner. Of course, if we win it all, I won’t be surprised. But, we could get 10 wins, like the Bucs last year, and finish 3rd in the division, and out of the playoffs. I would still call that a success.
by usana_gaines on Jul 25, 2011 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions
I think if we get more than 4 wins, we should consider it a success.
New coaching staff (and new offense/defense schemes) limited training camp, no mini-camps, rookie quarterback, leagues toughest division, difficult schedule…those all add up to a tough hill to climb. 5-11 or 6-10 would be a huge success.
One cries because one is sad. For example: I cry because others are stupid, and it makes me sad.
+1, I completely agree.
Yes I'm a dude.
by Flowing Willow on Jul 25, 2011 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions
If this were any division I would normally agree...
Also, I’m definitely biased and hopelessly optimistic. But the data points posted a while back on NFL.com about who wins the NFC south are pretty intriguing:
http://blogs.nfl.com/2011/07/13/data-points-the-up-for-grabs-nfc-south/
Any team in our division that has finished last since 2002 has bounced back with no less than 5 extra wins and no more than 7 extra wins.
Not saying it guarantees anything obviously… just that there is plenty precedent in our division for teams to bounce back very quickly.
by Fernando De La Cruz on Jul 26, 2011 8:30 AM EDT up reply actions
I would expect this year to be an anomaly
We have a coaching change, severely curtailed off-season activity, and a new QB likely to start the season. Our division foes all have established coaching regimes and all have very good QBs.
I’m all for optimism but talking about playoffs this year can only mean you get off by setting yourself up for disappointment.
I'm not expecting to win the division or anything like that...
But if almost a decade goes by and historically each 4th place team improves by at least 5 wins every year… I think you look at that as a trend. This includes Carolina’s head coaching change from Seifert to Fox in 2002 (from 1-15 to 7-9). But maybe you’re right. Let me take a look at what happens after a coach changes in the NFC South. The number of coaching changes in the NFC South since then:
2002:
John Fox replaces George Seifert (1-15 to 7-9)
Jon Gruden replaces Tony Dungy (9-7 to 12-4)
2006:
Sean Payton replaces Jim Haslett (3-13 to 10-6)
2007:
Bobby Petrino replaces Jim Mora (7-9 to 3-10) – left before season end
2008:
Mike Smith replaces Bobby Petrino (4-12 to 11-5)
2009:
Raheem Morris replaces Jon Gruden (9-7 to 3-13)
2011:
Ron Rivera replaces John Fox (2-12 – ???)
You might have a point there, pieterzen. But there’s also room for optimism in these numbers ;)
by Fernando De La Cruz on Jul 27, 2011 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions
A couple things about the Dolphins and Rams.
The Rams played in the NFC West, a division we would have been contending for had we been in it even last year. The Dolphins got a stroke of luck in 2008 when Tom Brady went down and was replaced by Matt Cassel. Cassel didn’t hit his stride until late in the year, too late for New England to overtake Miami.
This year, the Saints, Falcons, and Bucs are all looking like very dangerous teams. Not to mention we have one of the tougher schedules in the league. I like the talent we have, I like the coaching, and I know anything is possible in the NFC South. But I can’t realistically predict that we’re going to be anything more than the scariest team that didn’t make the playoffs.
Yes I'm a dude.
I hear you
Didn’t our only two wins last year come against NC West teams? If you look at last year’s winning percentage of our 2011 opponents, we do have the league’s toughest schedule. Our opponents won about 55% of their games last year.
When the Dolphins won the division at 11-5, the Patriots were also 11-5, but lost the division tiebreaker to Miami, and the wildcard tiebreaker to Baltimore, also 11-5. The other wildcard was the 12-4 Colts.
by usana_gaines on Jul 25, 2011 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Great post.
You make some compelling illustrations that show this team could indeed compete for a playoff spot. Momentum is the key, if this team can get on a roll anything is possible. I’m looking for our defense to become a takeaway machine under Rivera & McDermott.
What's more likely...winning the NFC South or getting a Wildcard spot?
A couple years ago I would say winning the NFC South…not anymore. WC is the easier scenario these days.
But the worst to first history of the NFC South should give any team hope regardless of how bad the previous season was.
Wildcard is the best I think we can hope for.
I think our divsion winner will be 12-4, unless the injury bug takes a chunk from the saints and Falcons.
11-5 might be the wild card winner, our division is scary not only to us but every onther 10-6 NFC team out there..
I am a proud supporter of troll hunting---- me.
When I see or hear sports segments dedicated to fantasy sports I want drive a nail in my ear because it is less painful. --also me.
I don't believe in that crap about toughest schedules or easiest schedules.
No1 can say how any team will be doing by week 8, even without injuries. I think the Panthers have as good a chance as any other team. Newcoaches you say? blah, they have been in the nfl for a while. Maybe Rivera hasnt been a head coach but if he is qualified then he is qualified. His coaching won’t suddenly become more clear to him after a year or 2, He is a grown man, has coached although not head coach, and knows what he has to do. The players are the only problem. They haven’t had time to learn the playbook as well as teams that arent as new, but they are still professional players. Most plays have to be very similar to most other teams plays, so i give the vets the benefit of doubt in learning the playbook fast. The rookies will struggle a little but they have training camp and pre season to learn. I say we can make the 10 wins. Is it probable? who knows, but it is possible and thats what i will hope for until it isnt possible.
Thing about our new coaches
is that they have not had the 3 or 4 months that most new coached get to install their systems. I have no doubt that Rivera will be a great coach this year but I do belive in 2-3 more years he will be a better coach. Rivera is not longer over one part of a team, but the entire team, he is going to have to learn the job of balanceing his responciblites quikly. Up until today all he has really been able todo is work on the therotical aspects of a game with his chess pieces. LoL just think how nervous and excited his is today. I bet he and Hurney are already working the phones.
I am a proud supporter of troll hunting---- me.
When I see or hear sports segments dedicated to fantasy sports I want drive a nail in my ear because it is less painful. --also me.
It's kind of scary how much we agree.
Yes I'm a dude.
by Flowing Willow on Jul 25, 2011 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions
I"m with Usanaa
I looke at the falcons and bucs in recent in recent years and the dramatic turn arounds. I believe the SAints take a step back. I really think we can make a run at 10 wins.
We're undefeated right now.
Anything is possible! Nice post.
Newton for '11 ROY!
Walker for '11 ROY!
Biyombo for '11 DPOY!
by Newsinz on Jul 25, 2011 8:14 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I think we can compete AGAINST playoff caliber teams...
…but I don’t think we’ll compete FOR a playoff spot.
I like the post
You made good points. There is always a bad team from the prior year that surprises everybody the next year. Those underdog/cinderella stories are what makes sports great. I hated the US girls lost but what a great story for Japan. Cam’s story so far has been a bit of Cinderella to me. So who knows? I still think its more likely that the Lions are this years Cinderella. Our year will be next year.
i disagree
I disagree because of one major reason…I don’t like Matt Stafford. I didn’t think he was all that good in college, and although he has been more impressive in the pros at times, he’s always hurt. I expect Drew Stanton to start at least 6 games, and the Lions, regardless of their record, will be looking at Luck or Barkley next year, or Terrelle Pryor in a later round or the supplemental draft if he is in it.
by usana_gaines on Jul 26, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions
The Lions will finish no lower than 3rd in the NFC North, taking them out of the Luck equation
I think we’re more likely to finish at the bottom of the NFL than the Lions.
ehhhh, i say no
I dont think we will be locked in the playoffs for sure but we should be much more competitive and if that happens we can then have playoff talk. I would just like to see this team fun to watch like they were in Foxys first 3 – 4 years. I enjoyed watching them even with rodney pete as QB, we had a good thing goin with new head coach john fox and jack del rio as defensive coordinator. Too bad evryone noticed how much of a bad ass jack del rio was and he fast tracked to head coach of the Jags, our franchise competitor. But, still Fox kept it goin, and got a lot out of players that werent all stars. We will miss John Fox, and Denver got a good coach. By the way folks the Broncos are always gonna draw players expect them to be dangerous.
by Jacob Robinson on Jul 26, 2011 12:59 PM EDT reply actions
Wrong Division. Wrong QB
NFC South is too strong. Our QB’s are too green. Still a sub-500 team this upcoming year.
"I won't publicly endorse a product unless I use it exclusively and I really believe in it. My only official recommendations are US Army issued mustache trimmers, Morton's Salt, and the C.R. Lawrence fine two inch style oscillating knife blade."
by MickSmiley on Jul 27, 2011 11:20 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs

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