2010 Panthers Position Review: Fullback
by Jaxon on Jun 8, 2011 9:21 AM EDT
in Panther Player & Position Reviews
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The fullback position for the 2010 Panthers offense has proved to be a difficult position to evaluate. The only true fullbacks to see action for the Panthers in 2010 only received 7 carries between them. RB Tyrell Sutton essentially filled the role for a couple games but you can't really tell from the stats which, if any of his carries came while lined up at FB. So this position review is going to be very subjective.
The FB position in a John Fox running game doesn't get many carries; the position is key though simply for the blocking aspect. The 2010 season was the first season since 2000 that the position was not locked down by long-time fan favorite Brad Hoover. If you go back and watch 2008 highlights of RB DeAngelo Williams or Jonathan Stewart you will most likely also see Hoover clearing the way for big runs.The dude could simply stone a DE and annihilate LBs. So his replacements in 2010 had big shoes to fill and I think that did affect my 2010 season grades for the position.
2010 Season Stats: 7 carries for 22 yards (3.1 YAC); 5 rec for 34 yds in 14 games and 9 starts
In my view Fiammetta had an inconsistent year in his first season as a starter. He was only a 2nd year player so it's understandable that he struggled at times. I recall throughout the season that on one play he would execute his assignment as required and the next completely whiff. His low YAC is no concern as I imagine most were 3rd and short type of carries where all was needed was a yard. I am surprised he didn't catch more balls out of the backfield but then again given the offense was epically bad it's hard to fault him for that. Yet overall I think he does carry some of the burden for the Panthers starting RBs averaging nearly a yard less per carry than seasons past. Given his athleticism I was hoping for a little more.
Grade: C-
A little more after the jump...
Rashawn Jackson
2010 Season: None in 2 games and 1 start
I'm not surprised the rookie UDFA was not trusted to carry the rock. Given the limited action it's impossible to really grade the kid but honestly I don't recall him being any worse or better than Tony F in his limited action. Hence I'm going to give him the same grade. I do like his potential and think he has a future.
Grade: C-
I've tried to avoid discussing the 2011 season in these reviews since we plan a whole other round of reviews for 2011 but with the FB position I feel so inclined. Though we expect the Panthers to throw the ball more in 2011 under the game plan of Rod Chudzinski I think it's safe to say the FB position will not be obsolete. In fact a player like Fiammetta who has good hands could be quite dangerous in both play action and 3rd and long situations. With the threat to run on any down likely to be present with Cam Newton under center it should allow the FB to get free from the MLB typically assigned to spy the backs coming out of the backfield.Both of the Panther fullbacks have good hands so whoever wins the TC battle should see an increase in touches from 2010.
So in spite of the position being mediocre at best in 2010 I think the current choice between the two young players should be sufficient enough for the Panthers needs in 2011.
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Fullback is always the most under-appreciated position, with a steep learning curve.
I think it takes far more nuance to learn the position and play effectively than it seems out of the gate. Fi was disappointing this season, but he does show enough flashes that he has the potential to get better.
by James Dator on Jun 8, 2011 9:39 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
He was considered the best FB in the draft at the time. I do think the potential is there.If i remember correctly from draft scouting reports he has excellent receiving skills something our last staff could never comprehend let alone use on the field. New system kid could shine
"I have opinions of my own -- strong opinions -- but I don't always agree with them." - George Bush
"I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant." - Robert McCloskey
I agree with James...
I think that FB is grossly under-appreciated. I hope Fiammetta can make an impact this season under Chud’s offense, and I hope he does have the pass-catching ability that we all believe he has because we need as many weapons as we can get on offense.
One cries because one is sad. For example: I cry because others are stupid, and it makes me sad.
You read my mind...
times like this I miss Hooooovv
Nothing ventured, nothing gained...sometimes you have to go against the grain.
by Disciple of Carolina on Jun 8, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yes...I still pine for the days when...
watching a replay of a big running play and instead of focusing on the RB you marvel at the awesome block by the FB to spring the RB. So many times if the FB makes their block its 5 yds plus…miss the block and its a one yd loss or no gain
I think Jackson might have a higher ceiling as far as lead blocking goes.
But receiving will now be a big part of what our FBs do, so I give Fi the edge.
"Has the whole world gone crazy? Am I the only one around here who gives a sh!t about the rules? Mark it zero! "
Jackson Is Better Than Fiammetta
It was a mistake to draft FB Tony Fiammetta (6-0, 245, 4.63-40) at #128 in the 4th round of the 2009 draft. Unless a FB has shown great abilty in college as a runner or pass catcher, it’s always a mistake to draft him before at least the 6th or 7th round, and Fiammetta did neither. In 44 college games (18 starts), he only had 16 carries, and 28 catches for 202 yards in his whole career. In contrast, Rashawn Jackson (6-1, 239, 4.73-40) just in his senior year at Virginia had 96 carries, for 461 yards, a 4.8 average, with 25 catches, for 222 yards. Fiammetta was the #1 ranked FB in the 2009 draft, while Jackson was the #2 ranked FB in the 2010 draft, and he wasn’t drafted.
I would hope that the Panthers try to sign Auburn UDFA RB Mario Fannin (5-10 3/8, 231, 4.38-40, 1.51-10), because he’s a great blocker that can be a backup FB, in addition to being a very good backup for Jonathan Stewart. Fannin’s familiarty with Cam Newton’s style of play, coupled with his blocking ability, could be a big help to Newton as he scrambles in the backfield.
I respect your opinion on that but I don't really care about a FBs stat line
I care about him being a tremendous lead blocker, and when he was drafted Fiametta was considered the best lead blocker in the draft. So I don’t feel like Jackson is better than Fi, I just think Jackson had a better stat line.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Jun 8, 2011 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions
"The best lead blocker in the draft"
The first half of the season, when I was doing Play-by-Play posts, I often noted that Fiametta showed little heart for the lead blocker role he was drafted to play. All too often, he wandered through the wrong hole, was still standing when the whistle blew, and our RB had been tackled for little or no gain. He was a far cry from Hoover’s standard of excellence.
Now I’ll allow for the “steep learning curve” that was cited, but c’mon, give it some effort. One of our RBs was quoted once as saying the FB has to hit the hole he sees for the RB, and expand it. Either Fiametta has no sense of which gap to hit, or is afraid to do so. That’s how I saw it. For every play in which he made a decent block, he whiffed on 3 others. To my eye, his inadequate blocking was equally to blame for our declining run production, as was Jeff Otah’s absence, maybe more.
Terrell Sutton on the other hand, is (despite his smaller size) far more effective and courageous as a lead blocker, a way better runner, and a superior pass catcher. I wish he were 20 lbs heavier, but, even at his reduced size, is better at the position.
by bigdavis on Jun 8, 2011 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Perhaps you nailed it here:
Either Fiametta has no sense of which gap to hit, or is afraid to do so
I think it may have to do with the issue that maybe Fiametta is still unsure on which gaps to hit. D-Lo and Stew are very experienced backs and finding the proper path is tantamount to a RBs success, something they’re very good at. Perhaps that is why Sutton and to an extent Jackson are having more success at FB due to their having far more experience carrying the ball and having to find and exploit holes in the defense. Hopefully when Fiametta gets a better feel for the holes he should hit he can better utilize his size and strength to make him a much better blocker.
Rules and Regulations of the Game: 89, Bottom Line
If he's unsure about which gap to hit, that would lead to him looking tentative and afraid.
I expect him to get better with time. He does have a pretty good skillset as far as catching the ball goes, from what I’ve seen that’s used pretty commonly in Chud’s offense.
Yes I'm a dude.
by Flowing Willow on Jun 8, 2011 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Just to be clear I'm no fan of Fiametta
I am commenting on the criticism of where he was drafted. When he was coming out of college he was thought of as the best blocking FB in the draft. He certainly hasn’t translated it to the NFL.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Jun 8, 2011 8:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Just curious, but are you Mel Kiper? You seem to only talk about draft position and stats.
Just wondering, and not trying to be a dick.
One cries because one is sad. For example: I cry because others are stupid, and it makes me sad.
Face it BW...
sometimes you can be without trying.
by GooseCreek on Jun 8, 2011 8:33 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
lol true
One cries because one is sad. For example: I cry because others are stupid, and it makes me sad.
Zing!
I kinda like power running football though. It’s iike a bloody violent ballet…
When it was working it was a thing of beauty to me. - Vagus
(Please note that from now on I shall only refer to Cam as "The Newt" and Rivera as "BAMF")
by The Duke Dude on Jun 9, 2011 8:20 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm New, So Most Important First
I’ve only been posting for a few days, so the most important comes first.
I’ll start cheerleading once the season starts.
Now is the time for discussing the Panthers needs, and everyone knows you can’t fix all of a 2-14 teams with 1 draft. Now should be the time to identinfy the Panthers post draft needs, then look at their options in the UDFA rookie market, the veteran free agent market, the Supplemental Draft, possibe player cuts, and then what players who might be cut would be worth signing.
Substance over simple cheerleading.
That's cool. I was just messing with you. Welcome to the blog.
One cries because one is sad. For example: I cry because others are stupid, and it makes me sad.
No problem.
You’ll find that I’m sarcastic all the time. It’s one of the perks that I offer.
One cries because one is sad. For example: I cry because others are stupid, and it makes me sad.
Sarcastic?
You? Really? I haven’t noticed.
And welcome to the blog PanthersRoar
I kinda like power running football though. It’s iike a bloody violent ballet…
When it was working it was a thing of beauty to me. - Vagus
(Please note that from now on I shall only refer to Cam as "The Newt" and Rivera as "BAMF")
by The Duke Dude on Jun 9, 2011 8:23 AM EDT up reply actions
I see it as the general demise of the FB position
As colleges start moving more and more towards spread/pass heavy offenses, FBs see less and less time on the field. I also wonder if coaches are spending less and less time recruiting FBs. So if there aren’t any decent FBs in college, why should there be any in the NFL? I’m starting to think guys like Hoov and Allstot (one of my all-time fav players) are a dying breed that we might have seen the last of.
I kinda like power running football though. It’s iike a bloody violent ballet…
When it was working it was a thing of beauty to me. - Vagus
(Please note that from now on I shall only refer to Cam as "The Newt" and Rivera as "BAMF")
You can still find FBs in college.
A couple teams in the Big 10 still run pro-sets, but point taken.
"Has the whole world gone crazy? Am I the only one around here who gives a sh!t about the rules? Mark it zero! "
by ERL on Jun 9, 2011 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions
I think one of the reasons Hoov was so good
was because he was a running back entering the league. And played that position for a couple years. He thinks like a running back and has the vision of one, so he really knows which holes to hit.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Jun 9, 2011 10:04 AM EDT reply actions
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