Shades of 2008 characterize the 2011 draft
by James Dator on Mar 2, 2011 2:57 PM EST
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PrintLet me take you back to 2008: It was a simpler time... 'The Dark Knight' was hitting theaters in the Summer, the Carolina Panthers had renewed hope Jake Delhomme would come back from his elbow injury and the lowly 1-15 Miami Dolphins were sitting where we are now, holding the #1 overall pick in a draft that didn't scream "Here is the #1 pick!".
Like some current Carolina Panthers' fans the 2008 Miami Dolphins had a QB they believed needed another chance too... 2007 second round pick John Beck out of BYU who the Dolphins took with the 40th overall pick. The 6'2" Beck had a scouting report that should sound quite familiar: astoundingly accurate, but a less than ideal size and less than ideal arm strength. He had a very rough rookie season where he played in six games, starting four. He finished completing 56% of his passes, 1 TD and 3 INT with a QB rating of 62.0.
Any of this sounding familiar? It should
Bill Parcells was in charge of the Dolphins for the 2008 draft, and unfortunately wasn't a draft with a standout #1 overall pick. Many said the Dolphins should take LSU defensive tackle Glenn Dorsey, who was hailed as the 'Next Warren Sapp' but Miami had reservations about taking a DT overall given the fact they had numerous needs.
We'll continue this tale... after the jump
The 2008 draft has almost every element the 2011 draft had:
- Two defensive tackles who had very close grades (Glenn Dorsey/Sedrick Ellis vs. Nick Fairley/Marcell Dareus)
- The double-digit sack DE who had a vast improvement in his final year (Chris Long vs. Da'Quan Bowers)
- The athletic monster who had scouts drooling after the combine (Vernon Ghoulston vs. Patrick Peterson)
And then we reach the quarterback position. There was a guy in that draft too... he was considered to have good size and a smart head on his shoulders, but there were questions about his abilities in the vertical passing game. Definitely not considered to be a top prospect, and leading up to the draft most scouts had him going somewhere between the 5th and 12th picks; his name was Matt Ryan (graded at an equivalent 84/100 by TFY Draft Preview).
The Miami Dolphins were trying feverishly to trade out of the #1 overall pick given there were so many questions about the first round and were hoping that someone would fall in love with Glenn Dorsey enough to trade up, but alas that never happened. Afraid of striking out the Dolphins decided to go for the 'safe' pick and select Michigan LT Jake Long- and they have had astounding dividends with their all-pro LT, with no concerns about the position for years to come.
Meanwhile the Atlanta Falcons selected Matt Ryan #3 overall, and since have been to the playoffs two times in three years, while Miami has once in the same time period. Ryan was graded at 84/100, Blaine Gabbert currently has an equivalent 85/100 from Draft Board Insiders.
Just some food for thought.
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You had me until the Gholston/Peterson comparison.
This is not fair.
"If you see this ugly ass face, that means I scored...again!"
~Stevonne Smith
by ERL on Mar 2, 2011 3:02 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
That's only being colored by the fact he was a bust.
Prior to the draft it was completely apt. The athletic freak moniker does apply in this case.
Ghoulston had 14.5 sacks his final year, scouts thought he was out of this world after the combine. Some unfairly characterize him as little more than a ‘workout warrior’ but forget all the awards he won at Ohio State.
His scouting report:
POSITIVES: Explosive college pass-rusher who makes a lot of plays in the backfield. Displays outstanding first-step quickness, plays with good pad level, and fast off the edge or in pursuit of the ball-carrier. Gets leverage on blockers, stays within his pass-rush angles, and effortlessly alters his angle of attack to make plays in any direction of the field. Constantly doubled, yet deceptively strong and holds his ground. Possesses a great closing burst of speed and very explosive in his all-around game.
NEGATIVES: Stiff moving in reverse when asked to play in space.
ANALYSIS: Gholston has been an impact player at Ohio State the past two seasons and he offers tremendous upside for the next level. He offers potential at a variety of positions in either a three-point stance or standing up over tackle. Gholston should be off the board during the initial 10 picks of round one and has the potential to quickly produce as a rookie in the NFL.
Graded at 85/100
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
Conversly, to be fair to Gholston...
He has not played his natural position in the NFL yet. I truly believe that he could potentially be a serviceable starter as a 4-3 DE.
"If you see this ugly ass face, that means I scored...again!"
~Stevonne Smith
by ERL on Mar 2, 2011 3:17 PM EST up reply actions
i loved gholston
i wanted us to pick him so bad, and i wanted us to trade into the top 5 to get him. i heard foxy wanted to get matt ryan, but i didn’t think he was that good. i was completely wrong about both. oh well, that’s why i DON"T get paid the big bucks.
I would 100% compare the "freak athlete" status to either Von Miller or Quinn
Peterson confirmed what was thought of him, Julio Jones had a more “athletic monster” type combine even
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
I don't think he is a bust... I just think he is in the wrong defensive scheme
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
You'd think though, that after three seasons...
someone of his physical makeup would at least have 1 sack? Through sheer luck he should have one (especially on that defense)!
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Me being a football player myself I know the position he is in
and just because he hasn’t gotten a sack doesn’t mean he is a bust just yet. For one, has he even got to leanr the LB position and get on the field first. He hasn’t got much PT from the start and its a whole diffrent ball game when you switch positions like that. I’ll name you another natural DE that is also labeled a bust in a 3-4 system, Aaron Maybin. Athleticism doesn’t always translates to success, I would give them a chance in a 4-3 defense playing DE before I label them a bust.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
It'd be one thing if he showed some progress over three seasons...
but he’s failed to improve from year to year (much like Maybin, although maybin seems like much more of a bust because he’s failed in both a 4-3 and 3-4), and you have to imagine that if the coaching staff in NY had any confidence in his abilities he would’ve gained more playing time by now…
Although out of curiosity, what position do you play? I played QB myself (well, glorified hand-off specialist considering our HS’s talent pool was RB heavy lol), and it’s one reason I typically don’t like passing too much judgement on NFL players until they’ve had a few seasons under their belts. However, three seasons (at a pro level) is a lot of time to be devoting to his craft, and he’s obviously doing something wrong…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Man I've played RB, LB, DL
Yeah and I feel the same as you when it comes to passing judgement on NFL players.. I just don’t like to label anyone a bust considering the fact I’m not that athletically gifted myself. lol
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
No, and every now and then players of his athletic ability are able to bounce back with different teams...
but it’s one of those “exceptions to the rule”; For the most part though, guys with that much of a draft investment are pretty much screwed if they’re not able to make a good impression (at the least) within the first three years. QB’s tend to throw this off sometimes if they’re drafted to a team with a solid starter already in place (re: Aaron Rodgers), but Gholston is at a position where players are expected to make some sort of impact within those first couple of seasons…
At least he’s not Maybin, who seems to have some sort of delusions about his career so far (look up Maybin’s “rap” song…it’s a good peek into his mental makeup)
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Dude I heard it right before I posted my first comment on this subject
but yeah I heard it.. lol if you think thats bad then you should listen to Beason’s song lol…. Maybin hasn’t lived up to what his songs about
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Granted...I'm not expecting the next EZ to come out of the NFL lol
but I about died from laughter whenever Maybin referred to himself as “Mayhem Maybin” lol….
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Good analysis James. I will still be happy with whomever we pick…. but I’m now starting to ride the Gabbert train a little more. The prospect of finally having a QB who will secure that position for 8+ years in enticing to say the least. If we pick him, I hope he becomes that guy.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
What have you seen from Blaine that makes you say "he's our guy"???
Curious… because I want to see the same thing…
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 3:29 PM EST up reply actions
He's as athletic as Cam Newton, a better passer, and doesn't have red flags in his character.
And he allegedly aced the “football IQ” interviews at the combine.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
So he had a better passer rating???
No… that’s right he won ALL of the QB awards. Are we so easily drawn that someone can throw us a bone and we jump all over it. Noone mentioned this guy all year… noone, for whatever reason (I know they said he was projected for 2012). I’ll give credit where its due… they mentioned luck his whole freshman year and sophmore year.
Character concerns… I got it that.
What did Newton allegedly get??? key word is allegedly.
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 3:45 PM EST up reply actions
College awards mean nothing in the NFL
Chris Weinke won the Heisman. So did Troy Smith. Do I need to continue?
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 3:51 PM EST up reply actions
Wow I've been repeating this a lot lately
Gabbert was on the cover o fESPN the magazine two years ago and they ran a full story on him and Chase Daniel. They talked about the rise of Mizzou football and despite the monster season Chase Daniels was having how they felt Gabbert (Daniels included) would be a great pro. He was the #1 recruited pro-style QB out of high school. Simply put very few people expected him to come out this year. Additionally )and this is just conjecture on my behalf) he had almost no one to throw the ball to this year which doesn’t make for exciting news/pub.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Then why wasn't he sooo great when he did have wideouts???
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:20 PM EST up reply actions
Easy answer - He hasn't ever had them as a starting QB
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
I disagree with you
During the game, Gabbert is not as good a passer, and not nearly as athletic. I’m talking about what actually happens during the game, not during workouts. But I am convinced we’re taking a QB in the draft, and if we pick Gabbert, I’m going to assume that we made the right choice, and get me a Gabbert jersey.
I'll do the same...
but I haven’t seen much about this guy with all of the film study I’ve done on him. Not throwing at the combine only heightens my fear because everyone looks good on their proday… everyone.
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 3:57 PM EST up reply actions
eek...
my lesson on buying rookie jersey’s was learned back in 1997…god damn Kerry Collins!!!!
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
well, the jersey was purchased in 1995, but it was obsolete a mere 2 seasons later
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
I did it too,,,
Think about everyone who bought a Clausen jersey though if we draft a QB LMAO poor guys…I folded and got a customized jersey with my number and name…really the only way to go these days…ya never know whos gunna get traded or cut
#17 all day
Jake was a major factor in re-energizing the team, and he looked genuinely depressed when he was released…he took this team to heart (although I wish I had a mills jersey from back in the day)!
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Just do what I do
Go on ebay and get a vintage jersey for an older player, or snipe an authentic on the cheap. Haven’t paid more than 60 buck for a jersey yet.
If God came down on Christmas Day/ I know exactly what He'd say/ He'd say "Oi!" to the punks/ and "Oi!" to the skins/ but "Oi!" to the world and everybody wins.
-The Vandals
On Twitter:http://twitter.com/ oi2dwrld
lol
+100
Disclaimer: BusyBeingAwesome = Irony. And, on a side note. I miss you, Steve Beuerlein.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Mar 2, 2011 9:52 PM EST up reply actions
I agree too.
Lets not look at what a guy does in shorts and underamour and look at what he has done on the field. Him and Cam Newton were in the same system and Cam crushed him in the most important statistic (Completion percentage) not to mention others. Blaine Gabbert wouldn’t even be in this conversation if Luck would have declared in the first place. So what does commen sense tell you about that? They Media needed a QB to compete with Newton to make the draft interesting. Gabbert may appear to be a better passer, QB or whatever but he isn’t a better football player than Newton is come gameday and thats a fact.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Gabbert may appear to be a better passer, QB or whatever but he isn’t a better football player than Newton is come gameday and thats a fact.
Nothing is a “fact” in this draft. There are only a select few players in this draft that can possibly be called sure things for the NFL, and I count neither Gabbert or Newton in that category. I only think the Panthers will pick him if he has a good pro day and impresses our FO.
Nobody knows what they are going to do in this draft, not even the Panthers themselves at this point.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
I didn't he was a sure thing
I said he is a better football player than Gabbert. The stats back it up.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Newton is a better football player..period
The stats dont lie. Newton would be a threat in the air and on the ground.
Stuuuuuuuuu
Stats lie all the time
I don’t disagree about Newton. But stats are lying dirty bastards able to be twisted to whatever means you desire.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Read "How to Lie with Statistics" by Darell Huff
It was written in 1954. Statisticians have been lying their asses off for decades.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
I would say they’ve been lying since the dawn of time, but yeah, you’re right.
"If you see this ugly ass face, that means I scored...again!"
~Stevonne Smith
by ERL on Mar 3, 2011 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah my first college statistics class blew me away
I couldn’t believe some of the things my professor was able to do.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Also
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misuse_of_statistics#Types_of_misuse
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
First off, I didn’t say he is our guy at all. I said I am starting to lean towards him a little more. I am nowhere near being sold on him yet. If he is chosen by Carolina, then I hope he is the guy that stays here and becomes an elite player for us for many years.
Just because I didn’t say Cam Newton instead of Blaine Gabbert doesn’t give a pass to take my words out of context.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
Great post
Yeah is draft is very weak especially after the 1st round; so according the so called experts T. Mcshay and the other moron on Espn reporting from the combine yesterday the Panthers want D. Bowers out of Clemson to be the #1 Overall pick ? JUST SOME FOOD FOR THOUGHT ??
Good old Espn a date late and a dollar short ~ anyone with Broadband or wi fi can discuss the combine and draft to death. ESPN sucks on reporting from the NFL Scouting Combine and NFL Entry Draft and always have. The combine is becoming the biggest joke in sports followed by the NFC/AFC Pro Bowl. Look at the tapes an pick your guy but if I am Carolina and Hurney I make sure Bowers knee is 110% healthy before I pick him #1 overall.
by Holty_Panthers_Fan on Mar 2, 2011 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
I think Miami made the right pick though...
would we be talking about Matt ryan in the same way if he had gone to Miami? Let us not forget the string of failure they had at QB up to that point, and a lot of that could be linked to their lack of a consistent OL….
But yea…the similarities in prospects is a bit eerie; I think the biggest difference being that there really isn’t that “safe” pick in this draft, wherein one could make a case for any of the top 8 players to be #1’s, but there’s no consensus on anyone being that “safe” prospect….
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
one more question to pose...
Are these grades from a consistent grading system? I’m just wondering, because it seems like the 5 point system has been changing constantly over the past decade (what was a 4 in one draft would be a 3 in another, etc..)…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Many interesting comparisons...
I just really hope that the Panthers get this one right. Heck if I know what the right thing is. My amateur opinion changes from one day to the next (if not several times in the same day). But does seem that football history repeats itself quite frequently, so I do think that it is an intriguing thing to keep in mind.
by jamiedk on Mar 2, 2011 3:14 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
To acutally address the real issue of this article....
For me, its not at all about Jimmy, but its solely and completely about Gabbert. I’ll be honest: I don’t want either one. IMO, there are other players who can help us right now, and we can/should wait until there is a safer prospect at QB to find our franchise guy.
Frankly, Gabbert feels like a reach. What makes picking Gabbert especially troubling for me is we don’t have a second rounder. So if we go Gabbert at #1 (we will not be able to sell this pick), then we don’t get any clear-cut potential starters until pick 65.
That, I believe, would make the pick even riskier. We need to improve our DL quite badly. I’m not sure I want to wait until the third round to do so—even if there is a deep DL class this year.
Despite the Combine numbers and recent rumblings, I think there is a sizable gap between the D-lineman at the top and the guys who are projected to be there at 65. I have heard that there is not a big enough gap to go DL early, but when you look at what really matters—what they did on the field, you will see the difference (you being anyone, not you specifically, James).
"If you see this ugly ass face, that means I scored...again!"
~Stevonne Smith
I agree, I really hope Jimmy proves himself so we can acquire elite young talent elsewhere
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
How is Jimmy going to prove himself before the draft exactly?
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
Workouts with the team and OC/QB coach etc
on the board and on the field. They determine whether they think he is the answer, if not they draft Gabbert, if so, fill a need elsewhere with an elite young player
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
How does he accomplish that with the lockout looming?
With the way Rivera is talking, I think his opinion on Clausen is pretty clear.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 3:52 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
+1
Completely agree ERL. This year’s QB crop sucks. Gabbert is a reach, and def not worthy of no 1 IMO. I can’t see the harm in strengthening other positions and waiting and seeing how JC does. If he fails, we’re looking at Luck/Barkley, which is much more attractive to me. If he prospers, then super duper!
They'll both go in the top 5 IMO
and i really hope we don’t have a pick that high next year.
Disclaimer: BusyBeingAwesome = Irony. And, on a side note. I miss you, Steve Beuerlein.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Mar 2, 2011 9:57 PM EST up reply actions
I want to see his pro day before I lean any more in his direction
There needs to be hope that he can step in if he has to and play. Cam looks raw as hell and will probably take a lot of time to develop, time we don’t have. RJ posted some good info about him practicing for for non-spread play in his offseasons, if that practice bears promise on Mar 13th then he’ll become a major contender for that pick.
He really helped his stock in the combine. Cam was thought to be head and shoulders above everyone athletically, for Gabbert to come out and almost match him was huge.
He did improve himself... athletically, but
Did his athletic ability help him win games during the season when his supposedly poor wide recieving corp kept dropping the ball???
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
I take that as a no...
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
If he had been running in a system like Auburn's?
Probably lol
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
The systems were similar...
and throughout his career… he accomplished what again???
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 3:53 PM EST up reply actions
The systems are more different than you think.
Yes, they’re both spread offenses but they’re not the same. From what I understand, the system Mizzou runs requires more cerebral QB play than your standard spread offense. It’s essentially the same system Bradford ran at Oklahoma.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
Wins and losses...
he’s sooooo cerebral what were his wins and losses???
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 3:59 PM EST up reply actions
By that logic, Duke would be an NBA breeding ground
You can’t go purely by wins and losses from the college transition to the pros.
You're right...
You go by ALL of the stats… and not figuratively terms like more cerebral and projections.
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:04 PM EST up reply actions
... and Duke IS an NBA breeding ground
Sorry to follow the tangent here, but its fair to say that Duke is an NBA breeding ground.
Where the NBA Players Come From
UCLA, Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, and North Carolina are the leaders of the 112 Division I teams that have at least one former player on 2010-11 NBA opening-day rosters. UCLA leads the pack with 14 former players on NBA payrolls, Duke and Kentucky are next with 13 apiece, and Kansas and North Carolina each can boast of 12 players in the NBA.
What has UNC's golden boy done in NBA?
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
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by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 3, 2011 1:48 PM EST up reply actions
I think he was implying that Duke's stars have not, by and large, translated well to the NBA...
Outside of a few guys like Magette and Boozer and Deng, Duke seems to have a history of really good college players under performing in the NBA….
By golden boy I’m assuming you’re speaking of Hansbrough, but he’s averaging almost 9 points and 5 rebounds a game as a sixth man for Indiana. For sure, we’ve had our flame outs (Sean May anyone?), but Felton, Lawson, Mccants, Williams have all been recent examples of successful starters in the NBA (I’m sure we could spend an entire thread looking through many more historical examples from both teams)…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
UNC wins this debate.
Two words: Michael Jordan.
Discussion over.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
I like Hansbrough.
Just asking what he has done lol.
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
Follow me on Twitter!
by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 3, 2011 2:51 PM EST up reply actions
better question: Who cares?
Colt McCoy is the winning-est quarterback in Div 1 HISTORY and he still fell to the third round! There’s a reason that prospects, ESPECIALLY QB prospects don’t get judged solely on their collegiate records…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
I replied to that right above you...
and Matt Ryan was highly regaurded coming out of college… Blaine wasn’t mentioned at all this year.
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:06 PM EST up reply actions
He was mentioned quite a bit - just not apparently to the media
you tend to frequent. Again he was not expected to enter the draft this year.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
+1
Disclaimer: BusyBeingAwesome = Irony. And, on a side note. I miss you, Steve Beuerlein.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Mar 2, 2011 9:58 PM EST up reply actions
You can't win without a supporting cast
Wins for a QB are like wins for a pitcher, you can’t do it on your own. But if you much know, Gabbert was 18-8 as a starter. That’s the same as winning 11 out of 16 games, the current NFL schedule.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 4:04 PM EST up reply actions
Cam was 13-0... give or take a win or two
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:07 PM EST up reply actions
So you're basing your argument off a bullshit stat
And one year’s worth of data? Cool story bro.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 4:10 PM EST up reply actions
You're cursing...
The guy is a winner… that’s what I’m saying. Not talking about wideouts dropping balls, or Chase Daniels successor, players leaving for the NFL.
Who were Cam’s wideouts???
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
lol
Disclaimer: BusyBeingAwesome = Irony. And, on a side note. I miss you, Steve Beuerlein.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Mar 2, 2011 9:59 PM EST up reply actions
Jeff Blake's son!
lol actually Auburn had a “solid” WR corps this year; they were dependable targets (although adams had the case of butter fingers in a few games), but that offense was built around Cam/Dwyer/Mccaleb (sp?)
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
+1
I love cool stories.
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
Follow me on Twitter!
by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 4:30 PM EST up reply actions
And he had the best amateur football team money can buy
surrounding him. Believe me I know, I’m a Tarheel fan.
Gabbert had very little high quality talent to go to this season.
Look I’m not completely sold on Gabbert, but I think your love for Newton is obfuscatory.
Gabbert is a very, very good prospect. Nearly as athletic as Cam, nearly as big as Cam, with a much larger catalog of throws for scouts to make a judgment on him. They’ve done so and have graded him higher than Cam. It isn’t personal.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
by Vagus on Mar 2, 2011 4:14 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Rec'd...
…because of “obfuscatory.” Had to go to dictionary.com.
by The Duke Dude on Mar 2, 2011 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
Where's the link that says that...
and the larger catalog of throws for scouts to make a judgment on him what did they come up with.
Let’s not make up stuff to say you like someone.
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:24 PM EST up reply actions
It was a live broadcast of the NFL Network
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
I guess you can't find it... Vagus has left the building!!!
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:27 PM EST up reply actions
I'm sitting right here
It was a live broadcast on the NFL Network….you know…like on live TV…the kind you watch on your television in your home while drinking beer…
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
You must have been drinking a beer...
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:30 PM EST up reply actions
Here ya go - since I can't fart out a link for live TV
Here is our own illustrious editor referencing it on our very own catscratchreader
The problem with Cam in a nutshell… all off field issues aside
Nobody can create more college film on him out of thin air. On QB workout day Brian Billick said an NFL scout told him that he has 900 NFL throws on film to evaluate of Blaine Gabbert and between 20-27 for Cam Newton; yes, that wasn’t a typo- 900 vs. 27.
It’s a product of the offenses both teams ran, and the routes the receivers utilized. It matters not whether you think Gabbert is bad, Cam is amazing or vice versa- there is no doubt in all of those 900 throws you’ll find 200-300 that you really like, and that may be conservative. When it comes to the draft knowledge is power- and a lack of knowledge on Newton because of a lack of tape will be impossible to overcome.
by James Dator
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
by Vagus on Mar 2, 2011 4:34 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
Now that's funny right there, I don't care who you are
Official ABC Fan Club President
Anybody But Clausen
Official ABC Fan Club President
Anybody But Clausen
by Jelly Wedge on Mar 2, 2011 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Last year their systems may have been similar...
this year? Not at all; Chizik definitely altered Auburn’s offense to help accomodate the fact that he had a good running QB and two stud RB’s, to go along with a solid (if sometimes unspectacular) WR corps…
Also, I think the point about College accomplishments has been thoroughly minimized over the past three months of debate on here when you look at the QB prospects throughout the years who did well in college (winning championships and the like), but didn’t translate to the NFL; James put up a good comparison on another recent post detailing why Cam is projected as a shakier passer than Gabbert, mainly revolving around Cam’s ridiculous lack of passing experience compared to Blaine’s….
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
College stats do mean alot...
QB rating means nothing…
Yards per attempt…
Touch down to int ratio…
I can go on and on… it does mean something, but if your comfortable putting an avareage QB back as our franchise QB then fine…
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:03 PM EST up reply actions
College accomplishments was meant as a reply to your insistence on highlighting their records...
No, College stats do mean something…but if we drafted QB’s based solely on collegiate statistics, Timmy Chang would’ve been the #1 pick in the NFL when he came out (and possibly the most hyped prospect ever). Hell, why hasn’t any QB from Texas Tech been a top 10 pick in the past decade?
Plus, what does me critiquing your fandom of Cam newton have to do with “settling” on a QB prospect? Just because I’m not blindly following this year’s version of the “once a decade prospect”, it means I’m advocating mediocrity at the QB position? There’s a good reason that people who get paid exorbitant amounts of money to scout these players have reservations about Cam transforming into a legitimate NFL QB….
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
And why those same people
Are big fans of Blaine Gabbert. But Caro2daheart is all-knowing about the QB position.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
But if we must go off of combine reports...
Gabbert aced his football IQ tests, whereas there a several reports detailing Cam’s struggles with the same tests.
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
And.....
Gabbert proved to be much closer as an athlete than anybody thought he was. It’s going to come down to the pro day, but I think Gabbert is sitting pretty right now.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
Link please
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:15 PM EST up reply actions
to the tests
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:15 PM EST up reply actions
http://rob-rang.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/13682485/27698893?source=rss_blogs_NFL%20Draft
this isn’t the link that was posted up during the open threads, which I’m still trying to find (it was much less vague).
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
You said that not me...
but I’ll take it.
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
about me knowing QB's so well
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:16 PM EST up reply actions
LOL
sarcasm detector needs repair.
by The Duke Dude on Mar 2, 2011 4:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
But that reservation goes both ways good and bad.
but not just for the QB’s but for everyone.
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
Of course...
and although I like Gabbert as a prospect, I’m still anxious to see how his pro day goes…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
What QB has ever had a bad proday???
Your feild, your wideouts…
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
unless you have a bad 40 time that's the worst it can get
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
Like many have pointed out, it's not necessarily the completions you're looking at..
it’s the footwork, the mechanics, the center exchange…things that you can grade regardless of whether or not a pass is completed.
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
I can except that
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
Cam will have a chance at his pro day as well
to show off the same things…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
How can you except that? Accept, maybe?
I’m sorry but you spout drivel and then when called out you call for links for documentation. Earlier you did it about the film on passes by Gabbert vs. Newton. Now again you do it about the report on NFLN on Newton having problems with football knowledge during the interview process.
You are being less of a Newton backer and more of a Newton bully.
I hope you can see I am not trying to denegrate your stance on the subject, but your method of communicating it is less than cordial.
... and Newton "kept missing high on the 10 yd outs" at the combine.
depending on what lens is used, that was a huge deal or unimportant, he threw the WR’s under the bus, or he gets credit for throwing when others did not. Also, human nature tends to exaggerate recent impressions versus old impressions. The novelty of a new proday may be better than a good combine.
Gabbert’s advisers have studied the past situations, and they feel that the positives of throwing at the combine are outweighed by the possibility of the unfamiliar causing a catastrophic fall. After all it is THEIR MONEY that is at stake, so they are going to maximize the return. Gabbert has hired the advisors he thinks are the best for his situation, and he is following their advice.
by panthersnbraves on Mar 2, 2011 5:11 PM EST up reply actions
...
We found out at the combine that Cam can’t read NFL defenses and has trouble at the chalk board. This is a major issue that will take time for Cam to grow into, assuming he’s able to make the leap.
Cam looks very raw at the moment. I for one wouldn’t want Cam at #1 at this point, despite all of his potential. Cam needs to sit for a year or two minimum behind a veteran QB as Rogers did at GB.
there's a big difference in WR's dropping the ball and not throwing to the WRs opting for a run
You can’t take those throws back, you can’t take those drops back. Cam’s run/pass ratio is 50/50, Gabberts is 80/20. Gabbert chose to put faith in his receivers rather than run the ball instead. It significantly improves his projections to the NFL, and is part of the reason Cam is looked at as a project.
And it only cost him a National Championship right!!!
The same guy that chose NOT to throw at the combine.
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
Bradford didn't throw either
Nor did Matt Ryan. Didn’t seem to hurt them too much.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 3:57 PM EST up reply actions
I wanted to see Gabbert throw...
And I give props to Cam for throwing.
Gabbert’s also being represented by the same agency telling their highly-rated QBs not to throw (Bradford, Stafford, etc.)
I’m not closed off to Cam. But I’m not closed off to Gabbert either.
Neither am I... believe it or not.
If we select Blaine I’ll be screaming for him like I did for jimmy. I just haven’t seen or heard anything concrete on Blaine other than his wide recievers kep dropping the ball.
If I were Ponder, Locker, Mallet and the rest of the guys I would say the same thing… its the wideouts fault.
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:12 PM EST up reply actions
How about the fact that he improved his completion percentage
Despite the fact that Mizzou had a historical number of drops this year?
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
Then that means the year before he was hot garbage...
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:18 PM EST up reply actions
So how were Cam's stats the year before in FBS play
oh yeah he didn’t play the year before….
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Won a championship... next question
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
You must have misread the question
What were Cam’s stats the year before in FBS play?
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
I'm not sold on Gabbert until I see him throw
Waiting for 3/13 to make a call. We’ll see how Gabbert and Newton do in their pro days, and based on their footwork/accuracy it will settle the draft QB situation (hopefully).
by ppalm on Mar 2, 2011 3:59 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I can except that...
"Remember the (Cam Newton) bandwagon started here... someone once called it a unicycle. My how time have changed...
by Caro2daheart... on Mar 2, 2011 4:12 PM EST up reply actions
ACCEPT***
January 22, 2004 - February 24, 2011
by KaiserBromley on Mar 2, 2011 8:26 PM EST up reply actions
Poor Chad Pennington...
He’s been the only QB to experience any success with Miami in the past decade (outside of Jay Fiedler having like..1 good season)….
But yet, they hate him lol
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Interesting take...there def are some similarities
However I think this is obvious that this is an argument for BG, and I don’t think it’s a secret that he’s one of your faves to be #1.
In some ways however, I see the 2008 draft. Cam Newton=JaMarcus Russell, Highly touted DB from LSU, AJ Green=Calvin Johnson, productive DE from Clemson, deep DT/DE class, group of WRs that are first round material, Brady Quinn=BG=highly touted since HS however never really got it all together QB.
Nice comparison James (rec'd). I do recall, however, hearing many "experts"
having doubts about Ghoulston, so I’m not sure that’s a true comparison. But, as a CB, most “experts” do agree that its a stretch to take Peterson #1.
And the scariest part of this… the Dolphins still don’t have a QB.
Anybody know what round they got Henne in, and what his rating was?
CSR resident optimist for a full season of football in 2011
2nd round I believe...
He wasn’t an unknown commodity, but I believe the biggest knock on him was accuracy (if there are ANY michigan fans on the site that can confirm this, it’s much appreciated). He obviously has a cannon for an arm though…
Also, IIRC Henne wasn’t as successful at Michigan as many had thought he would be…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
coughcoughAppalachianStatecough
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
by Tater596 on Mar 2, 2011 4:28 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
lmao
that too! God…I honestly had never heard of App state to that point, but man did I rub it in with those damn wolverines fans!
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
My little bro went to ASU
I was screaming and yelling at the TV the whole game. Literally, I was hoarse after that game was over.
by The Duke Dude on Mar 2, 2011 4:37 PM EST up reply actions
Henne's grade:
78/100 per the same scouting company who did the Matt Ryan grade.
He was a 2nd round pick
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
Just wanted to add...
But, as a CB, most "experts" do agree that its a stretch to take Peterson #1.
During coverage at the combine, Deion Sanders himself said that he wouldn’t take a CB at #1 because of how you can gameplan against one – you just do your best to throw away from that CB.
But take away Revis and the Jets would D would have plummeted
Having Gamble and Peterson patrolling the outside would be an amazing luxury and our blitzes would be destructive
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Couldn't have said it better myself Mike... an 'amazing luxury'
Let’s take care of needs, and then we can worry about the luxuries.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
We need our young QB to develop, we need our OL/LB to stay healthy, we need our young WRs to keep progressing, we need a great DT, we need to replace Dick Marshall
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
In the spirit of this article:
No fear Jimmy Clausen will be John Beck 2.0?
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
no b/c Beck seems to fit a WCO best and was 25/26 coming out of college, and took 2 years off before playing coll ftball to do a mission
Jimmy has been trained and around football his whole life, Beck seemed kind of likie Weinkie, not much ceiling or room to grow. I believe Jimmy still has room to grow, as he left for the draft at the age Beck entered college
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Follow up question.
Why would the kid who didn’t play football as much reach his ceiling faster than a kid training his whole life?
Upside is always linked directly to inexperience.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
Beck played football since 8, but he came to the NFL 4 years after Jimmy did
It’s hard to get much better when you are that age and a rookie, Jimmy followed a typical progression of an NFL QB by improving every year in college and leaving early
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
I should add here Mike...
You are aware Jimmy Clausen is a WCO QB also, right?
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
First off, we are throwing WCO around loosely, as it has changed ridiculously since it's advent
But he definitely has all the tools for an ideal WCO, but he can throw the deep ball better than Beck could/can, allowing him to be more vertical and not restricted to success in that one style
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
How are we being ‘loose’ with it? Notre Dame ran a West Coast offense… that’s not ‘loose’ it’s fact.
I agree he throws the deep ball better, but his arm strength is still average. Everything will depend on how important deep passes are to Chudzinski.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
the WCO is very different from what is originally was
Weis has modified it heavily and made it pretty complicated. JC was very vertical at ND, and he was able to pick up an offense Weis used for Tom Brady some. His training in the WCO in college was excellent, but he can do well in other systems. Also, most offenses use some variation of the WCO anyways. Beck seemed to only be able to play in a WCO, nothing else at all.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
I agree that an amazing shutdown CB can change the complexion of the game.
I was simply saying, Deion Sanders – one of the absolute best CBs of all time – said that he would not take a CB at #1 overall.
the game is changing and has changed to a more pass oriented offense
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Sort of...
Although I recall reading an article at the beginning of the season that dispelled this newfound “glory of the passing game” mantra that’s been permeating throughout the league….
It still starts in the trenches; No offense can function properly if their line is getting blown up all day by the D-line no matter how you cut it…whereas you CAN play away from a CB.
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
He said that this past week Mike
Just clarifying jamie’s comment for jamie…
Sorry jamie!
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Yep, that's what I saw as well, Jamie. And Mayock agreed. I like Peterson, but if
there’s a possible franchise QB, even if it takes one season with Volek, then I’m all in. Don’t ask me why I think Gabbert’s so good…. I’ve never seen him play, don’t know his stats - I’m just going with the experts and putting faith in Hurney/Rivera and co. to figure it out.
CSR resident optimist for a full season of football in 2011
by Rick Bates on Mar 2, 2011 3:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I hopped over to Draftboardinders.com and found these nuggets...
I have a hard time not seeing him as the first quarterback off the board, which means a top 3 pick.
There are only a couple of the 5 worst teams that don’t need a QB so him going no.1 overall isn’t out of the question.
Reminds me of: Matt Ryan, Atlanta Falcons-He probably doesn’t have the quite the arm strength if Ryan, but in terms of a skill set and physical stature they are very similar. Also, in terms of leadership and poise, both are very similar.
I couldn’t fine the overall rating, though. Anyway, this is what was said about a quarterback from Notre Dame prior to last year’s draft.
Brain malfunction… must seek alcohol????
CSR resident optimist for a full season of football in 2011
I don't have access to much of his games
but from what I’ve seen there are similarities. He is bigger and more athletic but at the same time his accuracy is probably above average at best. He can get in to trouble in the pocket – a little bit like Big Ben.
I don’t see an upgrade with any of these guys, certainly not enough for a top ten pick.
methinks you may have missed the point above. Those quotes were about Clausen last year.
CSR resident optimist for a full season of football in 2011
Seriously?
Hell let’s stick with Clausen then!
P.S.: my comments were about Gabbert
My diabolilcal plan is to spread the tentacles until every one is using ye olde English
Bwaahhhaaaahaaaaa.
CSR resident optimist for a full season of football in 2011
Regarding the "gap in talent" being referred too
To me, it seems that the positions that have the most gap in talent (from the elite to tier 2 etc), from biggest gap to smallest, omitting OL, TE, S
1. Tied: LB (Von Miller>>>>>>rest), RB (Ingram, then the gap plummets)
2. CB (PP7/Prince compared to those we could take later… “project guys” like Van Dyke. Burney, who was wanted by someone, is 5’6…. even later in the 1st/2nd Jimmy Smith and Brandon Harris have plenty of ?‘s, Harris is 5’10 runs a 4.53 40)
3. DT (Fairley/Dareus are better than the Tier 2 because they can “do it all”, granted Paea and Austin and Jenkins look like they could be solid potential starter pickups, but none of them has the ability to dominate quite like the two Elite)
4. WR (Julio Jones/Green elite, but i like Baldwin and Titus Young etc, definitely some sleepers that could be a Gettis)
5. QB (Cam/Blaine, but I believe Mallet/Kaepernick or even Ponder could have just as bright of careers.. all need to be in the right system, and all will be project type guys)
6. DE (Bowers I feel is overrated, Alton Smith and JJ Watt look just as good, same for Greg Romeus)
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Winners
Patrick Peterson, CB, LSU — The top guy in the Shutdown 40 series came to the combine with momentum based on the knowledge that most experts (and probably most teams) had him as the best player in the 2011 draft class. He bolstered his stock Tuesday after running a 4.34 40-yard dash (the second-fastest time among cornerbacks), tied for third in the shuttle and looked good in the agility drills. The one concern was that he came off the stance a bit high and wide on some drills, but a return to his game tape will confirm that Peterson is the one truly debit-free player in the class of 2011.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
While Newton vs. the world, Part 17 sounds wonderful...
I have other things I need to do. Such as…
Gentlemen, I’m stepping away from this one. Enjoy.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
Is this the "Lights, Motors, Action" Extreme Stunt Show at Hollywood Studios?
I’d recognize that anywhere!
Buy some of these on your way out.
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
Follow me on Twitter!
by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
but there's not really a "safe" pick this time around
And similarly if you look at the two franchises the Falcons are much better off with Ryan than the Dolphins are with Long.
Of course, it’s easy to point at this case where the examples coincide with what we hope. It’s kinda revisionist history, isn’t it?
by aceofsween on Mar 2, 2011 4:23 PM EST via mobile reply actions
I stated it earlier up but...
I don’t envision Ryan having the same success with Miami that he’s had with Atlanta; Long has been an instrumental piece in the repairing of Miami’s O-line, and after the disaster that was Cam Cameron’s 1 year stint in Miami I’m not sure Ryan would’ve been able to have as positive an impact there as he is in atlanta…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Ryan came into a pretty eff'd up situation in Atlanta... but fortunately, they also got
a good coach and an excellent RB. Ryan has been a big part of turning things around for King Blank.
CSR resident optimist for a full season of football in 2011
I mean...not to downplay atlanta's troubles when Ryan was drafted
they were picking #3 for a reason lol but still…I feel like Atlanta was in better position to accommodate a rookie QB than the fins were.
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
So which do we resemble more?
Are we more of the Miami model, with perennial years of issues and problems? Or are we closer to Atlanta’s, with years of up and down success and one past year of we’d all like to forget?
We don’t have the exact problems that Atlanta had, but our situations are very comparable. Certainly, they are better off than Miami, who had been a bottom feeder for years up until very recently.
our situation is unique...
since we’ve, by and large, avoided massive turnover for the past 9 years (there wasn’t that much actual “turnover” with our roster this year, since most of the guys who played were already on the team lol)…I don’t know what to think of it, but I’m gonna say we are much closer to where atlanta was 3 years ago than miami…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
If I remember correctly
Both Atlanta and Miami also had massive turnover that year after hanging on to aging players, so that’s really not a “unique” situation.
Lets take a breather everyone
Simple fact of the matter is that Panthers staff who get paid to do this stuff are going to make evaluations on these QB prospects as well as the ones on our roster, and make a decision. Not only are they significantly better at what they do than we are, they have more information than we do from private interviews/workouts. Trust in their decisions and support your team. I’m getting the impression from a few people here are more a fan of a specific player than of the Panthers. If that’s how you feel, I think you should step back and ask yourself if you’re really a fan of this team.
Whether our team rolls with Clausen/Pike/Gabbert/Newton/Ponder/Null/BSP/Edwards, I will be behind them and trust their decisions, because their future is riding on those players, not mine. Respect your front office and admit that we don’t have all the information or expertise to make these decisions.
It is what it is, we’ll evaluate them day to day and see where we go from there.
by ppalm on Mar 2, 2011 4:24 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Wellllll....I'll be raising a few questions
if BSP is ever taking snaps in a game time situation outside of the preseason lol
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
lol, I was being snarky with a few of those QB items,
but I’m sure you got the point
Just want to point out Kiper released his new Big Board
1. PP7
2. Fairley
3. Bowers
4. Dareus
5. Miller!
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
He's a loose cannon!
With Gary Wichard suspended he doesn’t know who to overrate anymore!
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARGH!
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
In terms of ratings/rankings/skill and not thinking about the teams picking
Those are the top 5, with Bowers being replaced by #6 AJ Green
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
I was being very tongue in cheek… I respect Kiper, but he’s my least favorite of the ‘big 3’
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
by James Dator on Mar 2, 2011 4:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I had a lot of respect for him just purely out of tenure
and for helping to essentially create this arena of speculation. The agents scandals hurt him a lot in my eyes.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
I would rank them
PP7, Miller, Fairley, Dareus, Green
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
About the same for me Mike
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
CBSSports has us taking PP7 at 1
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Also, how do you explain the decrease in production from Gabbert/lack of an elite year, coming from a spread (usually high scoring) offense?
And do not say how bad his supporting cast was etc, an elite QB, especially in college, should be able to put up great stats regardless. He did have two WRs with 90+ catches last year, thats not shabby, their starting RBs each (all 3) averaged 5+ ypc as well.
If you state that JC had better stats due to better players, check this
http://walterfootball.com/jimmyclausenhate.php
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
In defense of Gabbert and I swear I'm not married to the concept of drafting him
at this point almost don’t care who we draft. But he had around 50 drops this past season. Was pretty nuts.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
heard that, but watch this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5nGYHLeB2g
only counted a few good throws… throws a “franchise QB” would make
VS a “decimated” Illinois secondary
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Granted I only saw two games worth of offensive snaps from him (vs. Nebraska and vs. Kansas St.)… but I was not overall impressed either. However, with a good pro day, I still think the Panthers will take him. If he bombs out or doesn’t live up to expectations then obviously we will pick someplace else.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
several times he seems to only look to his first progression and do a "quick throw", forcing it some
Unless he gets flushed and is on the run
Also seems to rarely lead his receivers, they seem to get nailed A LOT.
He does look solid on the intermediate throws, some knockdowns, and has a good game statswise (like he should vs a terrible terrible defense)
One time he had a throw over the middle dropped, but it was below the knees, not higher up like it should have been (the catch still should have been made, but subpar throw)
I just don’t see anything that screams #1 pick or elite QB
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
I just don’t see anything that screams #1 pick or elite QB
The problem is, there’s not really any player in this draft that you CAN say that about.
Given the fact that our biggest needs are to improve the offense and to improve the defensive line, and given the history that new head coaches tend to pick “their guy” as a QB, I will be surprised if Gabbert or Newton isn’t the name called at the podium when we pick.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
I would say PP7 screams elite CB, Von Miller elite LB..
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
But I don't see them as #1 worthy.
I know you do, but I don’t.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
Who do you think is the best player in this draft, regardless of team selecting/position
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
none of the above
trade down and pick up a second-round pick, and take the best of who is left.
by panthersnbraves on Mar 2, 2011 5:28 PM EST up reply actions
that was for bw, but impossible for there to be a none of the above
I don’t care about teams etc, not asking what to do with the #1 pick.. who is the best player
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
I'm not really part of this piece of the covernsation...just butting in. =)
But my gut instinct is that Von Miller is actually the best player – not talking about based on position or what X team with the #1 pick would be likely to take or need to take. I think Von Miller’s probably the best player in the draft – he’s super-versatile. That’s mainly instinct based on limited viewing of film of the various players – so admittedly, I can’t bust out a ton of factoids and film to back it up. Just a plain opinion.
We talked about him on the radio show last night.
James called him the darkhorse to be picked #1.
If only we needed a LB, it would be so much easier, lol.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
Exactly.
If our LB corps was depleted, the Panthers could already have that pretty jersey made up to hand to him on draft day.
Or if Luck had decided to come out, we’d already have his jersey ready.
But the draft, the CBA mess, and the particular state of our team just makes everything so freaking messy and complicated that it’s not even funny.
by jamiedk on Mar 2, 2011 5:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
PP7 is probably the best player...
But I’m taking team selecting, position, and need into account.
DB isn’t our biggest need.
I will definitely agree with you that PP7 is one hell of an athlete, and like I said on the radio show last night I won’t be upset at all if we take him. I just don’t think he fits our biggest need at this time.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
Per above, IMO our biggest needs, in no order
We need our young QB to develop, we need our OL/LB to stay healthy, we need our young WRs to keep progressing, we need a great DT, we need to replace Dick Marshall
PP7 would address that need of replacing Dick… plus he is only 20 years old so he will get bigger and stronger. Going to be hell for opposing WRs. Eventually he could take over for Gamble. We need an elite young CB to develop, save $ for a vet QB/OL/DT/TE
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
You already know how much we disagree on QB.
I don’t think we need to rehash that discussion.
Plus, I’m basing this on what I think Rivera will do, not what I want to do. I think that Rivera will follow the historic pattern of new head coaches and will draft a QB to be “his guy”.
We can replace Marshall in later rounds or by signing Jonathan Joseph in FA.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
+1
To Johnathan Joseph, Plus he’s a Carolina boy at heart
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 5:47 PM EST up reply actions
I do like that part, but I see no need, we should have just kept Dick
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Marshall has shown that he isn't worth the price he's asking...
he’s been an inconsistent (at best) starter, and is a quality nickel…
Joseph is a proven starter, but if we’re going the draft route there are plenty of guys we could draft that could at LEAST do as well as Marshall (at a much lower price)….
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
I do not believe there is a good enough CB in the later rounds to become a #2 or #1 (what PP7 would be)
Also, why would we sign JJ who is the same age and came from the same draft as Dick Marshall? Why wouldn’t we just keep him? We aren’t contending and JJ is not a prospect, so why would we go after him? He is 27, will be 30’s when we are contending… makes no sense to me
If we wanted a 26-27 yr old CB why not just keep Dick? It seems unlikely. I see us getting OLine depth in FA, a vet QB, (also drafting a young DT in the 3rd), I’m hoping for Tommie Harris at DT (even though he his in his late 20’s, he is a RR guy and could provide help for our youth on the DLine), and a vet TE that suits Chudz style. (the offensive FA acquistions are mainly to help the development of whichever young QB we have)
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Even if we don't take a QB...
Let’s just say we have the QB position set and take it out of the equation.
I’d rather sign Joseph in FA and draft Fairley/Dareus than draft PP7.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
Also...
We could get Dareus/Fairley and then get another DT in the 3rd round and really beef up the defense.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
Why do we need to sign JJ? if we were contending I would say yes
But we clearly are a rebuilding team..
PP7, Tommie Harris, DT in the 3rd would be great
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Not a bad 2nd choice
But I’d prefer Fairley/Dareus and JJ. But I’d take your scenario too
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 5:55 PM EST up reply actions
I admit, your scenario is plausible.
And, honestly I won’t complain if that’s what Rivera/Hurney decide to do.
I just don’t see them taking a CB #1 overall. I’ll be surprised if they do.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
This is the year the draft is way different
a CB can be drafted #1, especially since he is the BPA
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
But having JJ over keeping Dick really doesn't change much
Why not get an elite young CB to groom along with our other young guys for the future?
In 3 years PP7 will be 23, JJ will be 30
I see no point in spending the $$ on JJ, since we aren’t contending
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Adding PP7 to our secondary doesn't make us contenders either.
His greatest asset is punt returns, and I don’t want him returning punts if he’s the #1 pick.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
He would be 20 years old
He would immediately be our #2 and learn under Gamble, and be our #1 for 8-10 years
I never said he would make us contenders, nor does he need to
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
But isn't the point of the #1 pick to make us contenders?
Why take a guy who won’t make us contenders?
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
NOONE on the board will make us contenders next year BW come on
PP7 is the most ready IMO and will help make us a contender down the road
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
by MikeTrain on Mar 2, 2011 5:57 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
What?
Don’t count us out too much with a steady QB at helm and a beefed up DL I can see us getting a wildcard spot no problem
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 5:59 PM EST up reply actions
see below for that conversation man
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Will do
But what I’m saying is if Gabbert is as good as hyped and we get Tommie Harris and another decent lineman in the 3rd I can see us contending.
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 6:01 PM EST up reply actions
No, there is not a QB who is ready to come in and play next year, especially not for a contending team man
Plus we need more than that. We need a TE, depth at OL, a vet QB, and help at CB for us to even think about contending.
Only way we contend next year is if we get Palmer or JC has made great strides
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
True
But all those things can be gotten out of FA. And if there is no FA then we probably won’t have a season and we can get all of that in next year’s draft
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 6:10 PM EST up reply actions
I dont care what no ones says Mike but
the Jets won’t win a superbowl until Mark Sanchez(QB) improves having a shutdown corner won’t get us into the playoffs. Last time I checked we are trying to win a superbowl Mike and be great for years to come, not have the best Pass Defense int he league when we have teams pounding us on the ground and our Offense can’t score points.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
What?
We are trying to win a SB yes…
Getting PP7 does not hurt that at all.. look at how the corners of GB dominated the playoffs.
Why not get the BPA who is only 20 years old and can immediately play the #2 CB spot?
Also, we need to shore up the DT for sure, never said we did not and also spoke on the offense.. I clearly stated all of that, yet you declined to notice it seems
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Ok lets say we take PP7
Now where in the hell does that leave us a QB. It seems as if you want to have a stop gap, Band aid QB to come in. We need a Elite-Playmaker at QB to get anywhere in this league. How good as Oakland been in the past few years with Asomaugh at CB huh? How many times have they made the playoffs with him? The fact is stop avoiding the most important position in football and settling for Average and address the Field General position with some real talent.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
I believe Clausen is still the answer
I do not want a stopgap, I want a vet mentor QB to help out JC. He had ZERO help in any fashion last year, a shitty OC/QB coach, a turnstile OL, and no mentor QB.
And Oakland sucks because they do not know how to eval players. Nnamdi has been their only good player
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
+1
I’m not ready to give up on Clausen just yet. With a vet mentor and solid coaching I still think he can be in the second tier of qbs eventually.
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 6:33 PM EST up reply actions
I'll agree there
If we don’t take a Qb I say we build the best team we can around Clausen and hope he develops
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Zach Miller ain't bad
If God came down on Christmas Day/ I know exactly what He'd say/ He'd say "Oi!" to the punks/ and "Oi!" to the skins/ but "Oi!" to the world and everybody wins.
-The Vandals
On Twitter:http://twitter.com/ oi2dwrld
It's not set in stone the Panthers won't be contending in 2011
Miami went from 1-15 to the playoffs, it can be done. the CBA mess is dampening it some, but if there i free agency, the Panthers can be playof contenders immediately.
Official ABC Fan Club President
Anybody But Clausen
If JC develops properly
We sign Harris, draft PP7
or JJ, draft Fairley/Dareus
sign a vet QB
sign Oline depth
sign a vet TE
then yes we would be
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Mike seems to me like you don't want to be a great team for 10+ years
You seem like you would rather settle for being just good enough to get us into the playoffs while signing these stop gap washed up players.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Not sure I follow you DT
I see his way panning out for immediate future and the best way to get the best FA’s to come to town is to win games. No one can guarantee any draft player will be good for 10 years
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 6:13 PM EST up reply actions
No, I am being realistic
I am hoping for us to be contenders in at the most 3 years. I am not about getting stopgap FA players AT ALL
WE NEED TO ADDRESS THE OLINE REGARDLESS, WE NEED A VET QB TO MENTOR REGARDLESS, WE NEED A BETTER TE REGARDLESS
JJ/Tommie harris would be stop gaps, but Tommie will finally give us a Pro Bowl DT that the younger guys can learn from.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
So where does that leave us at QB?
If you say Clausen then you got to put alot of faith in him that he improves.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Also Fairley was 100% the most disruptive DLineman last year
I would classify that as elite
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Everyone is saying that PP7 is the best player in the draft
yet “you can’t draft a CB #1”
This is the draft you can do that, if any
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
by MikeTrain on Mar 2, 2011 5:22 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
+1000000000
the whole draft value chart bible is on its ear this year, so many things are possible this year that never happened before.
by panthersnbraves on Mar 2, 2011 5:25 PM EST up reply actions
anyone watch this?
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Mike, I don't know if you read my comment in another post
But it was about this tape vs. Illinois. I’m just not impressed. Throughout the majority of the game, he really doesn’t complete anything beyond 10-12 yards. Towards the end of the game, he does start to complete 3-4 beyond that range, though I’m not impressed. Not impressed because he’s standing in a 7 yard shotgun CUSHION with a 5-6 receiver set and sometimes staring down his first look. Many of his throws are a little off and lack some touch.
And please don’t compare him to Bradford. Yes they played in similar systems, Mizzou’s is a little more extreme spread O, but Bradford really produced (better comp rate, yards, QB rating, td-int ratio) and just straight dominated throwing all over the field and not just 10-12 yards and in. Must be why Bradford won the Heisman and was up for it another time. Gabbert and Bradford really aren’t comparable, and from the film, Gabbert did not look special enough to be a first rounder in my mind. He’s got measurables: good arm, height, but just hasn’t produced and doesn’t look like an elite QB prospect to me.
I agree, +1, especially since Illinois had straight scrubs playing the secondary that day
I don’t want to rehash your points, but he really just doesn’t seem to have “it” or look like an elite QB.
on a 3 man rush he would leave the pocket too early as well, and rarely went through progressions. His WR’s get crushed, and he struggled on screens at times.
He may have the same 40 as Cam, but he does not look as athletic as he or Locker. He is slow starting off it seems.
You said the rest perfectly
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
I could care less about 40 times for QBs
Tom Brady’s 40 was in the 5.2s or 5.3s if I remember it correctly. Unless we have designed sprinting plays for our QB, I couldn’t care how great Gabbert’s 40 time is. Yes, it was a great 40 time, but that doesn’t make him any better of a QB…
Two straight run plays at 1:30, Horrible fumble on the 2nd as well
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
QBs....
It’s really quite impossible to say which QB is “better.” They’re too different: systems were different, competition was different, style of play is different, talent of supporting cast is different, coaching philosophy was different, media exposure was different (SEC vs whatever conf Mizzou is in) which effects perception (and perception is reality), etc.
Running QBs coming into the NFL level always make me a little nervous. One of the things you have to consider when looking at a “running” QB is why the QB ran so much in college. Were they called runs/draws? Did the O-line break down all the time before the play could progress? Were the WRs unable to get open? Did the QB make one read on pass plays and take off when WR #1 wasn’t open? Was he looking to extend the play and just take what the D gave him? Was he running over smaller/around slower players? If so, that won’t work in the NFL where players are bigger and faster.
Other concerns are things like did he learn over his career to read a defense if he was running half the time? What are his throwing mechanics like if runs so much? Does that give him happy feet? Did he learn how to look off a safety to get his guy open or did he just tuck and run?
As far as Gabbert goes, I’ve never seen the kid play. Ever. But my impression is he’s more of a “pocket” passer. Is he any good? What are his mechanics like? Could he read the defense? Did he do things like look of the DBs? How’s his play action fake look?
Me personally, I have no idea who is a better fit for the Panthers. And that’s what it boils down to. Who do Hurney and Rivera think will fit best in the locker room, in the scheme, on the field making the calls?
For the record, I’m more anti-Newton than pro-Gabbert. I have some issues with Newton’s off field issues. Maybe he’ll grow up and be a moral, ethical upstanding professional, who knows. I’ll pass on Newton, and maybe Gabbert too.
Big 12
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by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 5:13 PM EST up reply actions
Which coach was it that said no matter what you do, there's a 50% QB washout? Belichick?
A team has to do their best evaluation so as to reduce the risk as best the can, and then roll the dice.
Personally, I think that football smarts makes a big different – pre-snap reads, check with me, route adjustments can be taught, but do the Panthers want to teach someone for years?
by panthersnbraves on Mar 2, 2011 5:22 PM EST up reply actions
Packers cut AJ Hawk.
WUT
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Welll
Keep in mind that AJ Hawk had $10.5 million escalator, so Packers wanted to clear it from their books. New deal still could be in line now.
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by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 5:33 PM EST up reply actions
Can you imagine
Our 4-3 linebacker core being Beason at ILB and a healthy TD and AJ Hawk on the outside? Connor and Anderson giving us major depth.
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 5:50 PM EST up reply actions
BW, I was thinking of a series of four words that started with the same letters as yours. =)
All kinds of things will be shaken up with the whole CBA and salary cap mess.
So you got the hidden joke. Nicely done. :-)
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Do I get a cookie?
Or a picture of a certain QB who already looks good and who would look super-good in electric blue who I know am actually intrigued by? LOL.
Sure.
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by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 6:11 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks BW!
Sorry BigD if you’re reading this after your post the other day. I did ask for a picture. But he’s pleasurable for me to look at, and I broke down for a second.
Yep...
He is quite nice to look at! :) I’m definitely a fan already!
by ncarolinagrl94 on Mar 2, 2011 7:44 PM EST up reply actions
I guess they feel they have the depth to justify not re-signing him...
My best friend (whose a major cheesehead) has been predicting this for awhile though, so I’m inclined to believe that this isn’t much of a shock for packer nation…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Definitely cost cutting
No way they’re paying him 10.5 million to be an average linebacker. He’s good but he’s not even the best linebacker on the team.
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 6:09 PM EST up reply actions
No wonder he is being paid so much. I knew he was the Packs 1st round pick back in 06, but I didn’t realize he was the number 5 overall. Hence the huge contract I suppose.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
He was supposed to be the next urlacher (of sorts)...
I mean, he’s been good for the most part…but not #5 in the draft good like they were expecting.
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Yep
He was even pegged as “Wisconsin’s Urlacher” before he even saw a snap
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 6:34 PM EST up reply actions
Two #52's in that draft...
and both are certifiable Beasts! Although, I do wish that whenever people talk about Willis they would mention Beason as well….I feel like sometimes everyone forgets just how close the two are in terms of production and impact!
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Just a thought
But if we had stayed pat and not traded we could have snagged Revis. Would you want the panthers to do it the same way and get Beason or would you rather have Revis with Connor showing flashes? I still say Beason but that’s because I’ve got a man crush going
by Imisshooooooooov on Mar 2, 2011 6:43 PM EST up reply actions
We also wouldn't have Kalil
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by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 6:47 PM EST up reply actions
Beason
We can’t include Connor in this scenario because it’s all hindsight (and Connor wasn’t even close to being in the picture at that point), but if I’m choosing between a potential franchise MLB and shutdown corner, I’m taking MLB everytime….
You GOTTA have that field general on defense!
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
They'll re-sign him
It’s just cutting costs going into a lockout.
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by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 6:34 PM EST up reply actions
Win of sorts
Just received #Panthers RFA Tender for longsnapper JJ JANSEN, who has 3 accrued seasons. Top young LS in the NFL…
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Excellent!
I think it’s funny that of all the positions, we’ve seemed to have the most consistency at LS lol (Kyle was routinely cited as one of the top LS guys in the league when he was here, and Jansen has been quite solid for us as well).
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Well......
They’re tendering most useful and semi-useful FAs with < 6 years. RT @RachelJ833 So, wait, they’ll tender Matt? This is a good thing, right?
From Gantt
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More news.
OK, Panthers tender 14 guys, list to follow: LB Anderson, WR Clowney, S Hudson, LS Jansen, DE Johnson, TE King, DT Landri, K Lloyd, (more).
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by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 6:44 PM EST up reply actions
More news ago lol
Also tendered CB Marshall, QB Moore, TE Rosario LB Senn, RB Williams and CB Wilson.
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by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 6:44 PM EST up reply actions
Ruh roh.
Panthers did not make tender offers to: LBs Jamar Williams, Abdul Hodge, S Gerald Alexander, C Chris Morris and T Rob Petitti.
Also tendered 5 EFAs: QB Keith Null (!), WR Charly Martin, DTs Ed Johnson and Hayden LB Nic Harris and G C.J. Davis.
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by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 6:49 PM EST up reply actions
Which one was Jamar Williams..?
He was the one in the trade from Chicago right? Or was he the one that we picked up from the Cowboys? I can’t remember honestly.
The former was a disappointment. The latter played well, then also sustained an injury…
Chicago, Harris trade...
hindsight? Yea, that sucked lol but at the time? With the TD injury, it seemed like a good pickup (Many Bears fans thought Williams would’ve be a starter if they didn’t already have Briggs)…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Oh I know hindsight is 20/20
I don’t regret the trade at all because at the time it made sense. It doesn’t change the fact that Jamar Williams didn’t amount to squat though.
The good one was Jason Williams from Cowboys.
And I actually really liked him.
Jamar Williams is no big loss.
the Lloyd one is intriguing...
I know we can’t look into the RFA tenders too much right now (since who knows if they’ll even be legitimate come new CBA time?), but it does seem to signal that they feel Lloyd might be Kasay’s heir once he retires (if ever lol…he does seem to get better with age though)!
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
I do remember...
One game where it looked like we were contemplating a SUPER long FG, and the camera showed Lloyd warming up. I think it was going to be close to a 60-yard field goal (remember, Carpenter from Miami got a 60-yard FG this past season). So, when I saw that, I was wondering if the team might be thinking about Lloyd for the inevitable post-Kasay era that we will eventually run into. Of course, they may have just been thinking about using Lloyd for that one FG because he presumably has the stronger leg.
I know we didn’t kick the field goal, and I don’t remember if we went for it on 4th down, but I feel it’s safe to say that Foxy instead went with his favorite play ever – the punt.
I mean, I still think Kasay is going to be around for a couple more years...
his accuracy over 50+ has actually improved with age, so he must be doing SOMETHING right lol but you have to imagine that they must see something in Lloyd that makes them think he can be more than just a KOS 2-3 years down the line….
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
I think it was on one of the pre-game shows this past season...
They showed Kasay’s percentages over the course of his career (I think it was in 5-year increments), and it’s really pretty freaking impressive how they’ve improved.
I'm hoping he keeps it going...
It makes me much happier I kept his rookie card all these years (when he was a seahawk lol)!
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Others news
Packers cut AJ Hawk…
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Look up a little ways :)
Already been said.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 6:47 PM EST up reply actions
Dammit oh well then
how about this: the owners haven’t voted on locking out the players yet..
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Don't be surprised if the deadline is extended tomorrow....
since the NFLPA’s deadline to decertify comes much earlier tomorrow than the actual CBA deadline…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Strangely enough, everyone has been really optimistic lately that there will be no lockout, that if anything, an extension will happen for next season.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
Well, a big key is what happened last time in 2006...
where they extended negotiations an extra week in order to put together a deal; players are going to have to compromise (like the owners did last time), but don’t be surprised if it happens…
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Question for all those who don't think we should draft PP7,
because he is a CB. What if he plays safety and we move Godfrey/Martin to CB to replace Dick?
I would draft an Ed Reed, Ronnie Lott, Troy, Sharper, Sean Taylor (what could have been ugh), Eric Berry (yes he is THAT good) as #1
PP7 would be a crazy prospect at safety… has the size needed (as big as many RBs), more speed than maybe any elite safety (Berry ran a 4.47), elite ball skills, and can jump very high (38inches)
Think about him roaming the field, using his 4.34 speed to cover ground quickly, being a nightmare to QBs who see an opening only to make the throw and have the opening closed shut. Using his size to go up for errant throws or punish WRs.. Also, he would be possibly the best safety blitzer ever, and could be in the backfield in an instant. He would be an elite playmaker at CB or S, but since many claim that picking a CB #1 should never be done because it only fixes one side- he would cover much more as a safety and be used on blitzes.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
That would be a waste of resources
Martin and Godfrey are playing safety for a reason, so no.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Mar 2, 2011 6:56 PM EST up reply actions
Just saying as an alternate to CB, which seems to be the reason why people don't wanna draft him 1st
And as a prospect PP7>>>>Godfrey/Martin…
Both can easily make the transition to CB though
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
No
A safety at #1 overall is worth less than a CB #1 overall.
Furthermore, let’s approach the true topic- he’s never played safety.
It’s this line of thinking that makes Matt Jones or Darius Heyward-Bey ton ten picks because they can run fast.
If you’re willing to take a guy based solely on size, 40 time and because he’s a ‘playmaker’ then why not draft Newton? At that point aren’t you taking just as big a risk trying to move Peterson to a position he’s never played before? Newton’s big, Newton’s fast… and unlike safety we have a need for a quarterback. Even if we justify it by saying “But it solves corner!” why not just do it through free agency?
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
PP7 is not a risk like Newton
I like PP7 for much more than his physical attributes… but when you add those to his ball skills and ability, then it is amazing
there is no reason that PP7 would not project as an elite safety, he has everything you ask for in one, but I still see him as a lockdown CB
Your comparisons with Cam and Bey and Matt Jones are unwarranted. WR is by far the hardest position to go from college to pros, so doing that as a college QB is even harder.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Low risk... low reward
In the long run Peterson wouldn’t help this team get many more Ws on Sunday.
You can keep banging your drum, I’ll bang mine- but neither one of us is going to convince anyone one way or another.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
How is PP7 low reward? just don't get that
Revis is not low reward, neither is Traman Williams or Woodson. What about Champ Bailey?
I do not see how you could say that honestly. Unless you really believe CBs are overrated (ridiculous)
PP7 would do this for “reward”: He would immediately be our #2 CB, he would become our #1 for 8-10 years and potentially be a multi year Pro Bowler.. He would be among the elite at CB for many years, shutting down opposing #1 WRs
How in the world is that low reward? I’m sorry but that is insane to say James.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
by MikeTrain on Mar 2, 2011 8:02 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If you're going to compare Peterson to the best in the NFL, then all prospects should get the same treatment
Ndamukong Suh, Peyton Manning and Aaron Rodgers all do more for their teams on Sunday than Darrelle Revis, Traman Williams, Charles Woodson or Champ Bailey.
It’s only insane when you weight your argument to be Darrelle Revis vs. Alex Smith
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
Peterson is compared to the best because he is actually elite across the board and has very few questions
But no other DB compares to him with his skills or size or speed as a prospect
I was debating your point that PP7 is low risk low reward. That is still ridiculous and a horrible claim to make, one that no “analyst” would ever agree with
He is low risk high reward, there is no way around that. QBs do not have to have all the tools to be successful.. Look at Brady- get him out of the pocket and he is horrible. We do not need to take a gamble on ANOTHER rookie QB as our #1, when there are so many elite prospects out there. If we were to grab a QB, why not later? I honestly believe Ponder is just as good as Gabbert. There is a much less chance that Gabbert becomes an elite QB than PP7 becomes an elite CB
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
No 'analyst' would agree that Ponder is as good as Gabbert...
The knife cuts both ways
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
I personally would love to have PP7 on the Panthers... I don't see any way
(other than injury) that he fails to become a shut down, elite CB for years, then becomes an incredible safety. He’s the most sure thing in the draft.
But here’s my conundrum… Jimmy’s at best a coin flip between decent or bust. The chance that he’s a franchise QB are far slimmer. And right now, he’s the best QB on the team. So, yeah, we could bring in Volek for this year, and I think he’d be an upgrade, but we can’t predict whether Jimmy’s going to get better.
We’re not going to win consistently without a franchise type QB. I see that potential in Gabbert, if he gets to sit for at least a partial season behind Volek. If Jimmy wins the coin toss, and shows franchise potential…. then, hot dog, we’re a winner either way. But having the more athletic, higher upside Gabbert, we’ve more than doubled our chances to find the QB we need.
So, yeah, for me it’s a need-based pick, but I’d take Gabbert today. After pro-days, that could change, but I’m referring back to the whole premise of this post, the comparison to 2008; and I’ll take the QB.
CSR resident optimist for a full season of football in 2011
What you fil to realize Mike is that having a #1 corner has nothing to do with getting W's if we can't score
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
See: Jets defense
they won with a horrible QB.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
What have they won...
It damn sure hasn’t been a superbowl and they woun’t until Sanchez improves and gets better.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
"has nothing to do with getting W's"
Well without Revis that defense would have been much worse
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
And they still had a great season..
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Last time I checked they still won without revis
Lets not forget Revis got “injured” after Moss burned him last year on a TD pass
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Do not underrate Revis
That is just plain stupid. He is the best CB outside of Oakland, and one of the top of this decade
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
I'm not underrating him im just questioning him
Its funny how soon has the “best” CB in the NFL got burned in front of the world he all of a sudden is injured
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Do you really think he faked the injury?
I mean c’mon man, you can say hes not going to change the game, not going to get the W’s but don’t question how hard he plays the game.
And above you said he got burned by Moss. Moss. The best deep receiving threats to ever play the game, and one of the best all around receivers in the NFL. Yea, I’m pretty sure its not that bad if your CB gets burned by him every once in a while, the guy is amazing.
We didn't lose the game; we just ran out of time. ~ Vince Lombardi
No I wouldn't have a prob with it if he just took it like a man.. but he didn't his hamstring was all hurt all of a sudden afterwards
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Well I'm pretty sure most
injuries happen “all of a sudden.”
Hell, TD was running some practice drills and blew out an ACL. Please, don’t question a guys toughness when he plays in the NFL.
And what do you mean he didn’t take it like a man? He wasn’t making excuses in the post-game conference about allowing a TD.
We didn't lose the game; we just ran out of time. ~ Vince Lombardi
I'd agree with Mike here
Revis is one of the best to play the position in years. He’s fantastically good. I’d love to have him on the Panthers.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Considering they couldn't score, no
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Hell they scored more than us
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
..........100x more talented
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Than Clausen.. then yeah
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Mike just admit it the only big diffrence the Jets and us is that they actually have decent QB play
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
No, they DO NOT!
YOU are so wrong man, just stop
Sanchez is not decent QB play
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
WTF man
3000+ yards abd 17 td’s in not decent QB play? Well who’s good then man? Clausen? is he decent? YOU MIKE ARE WRONG AND THE STATS PROVE IT… ADMIT IT MIKE when a team goes 12-4 without a player he is not that big of a deal.. and hell when he came back they still couldn’t win a superbowl so whats your point?
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
What?
He has only missed 3 games in the NFL, explain how they went 12-4 without him and then “still couldn’t win the SB when he came back”?
I don’t just look at stats, only retards do. BSP could put those stats up on the Jets
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
When Darrelle Revis thows 20 td's 3000+ yards and scores 5 defensive TD's and Wins a superbowl
Holla at me but intil then I’m out i’d rather spend my time watching Family Guy than to argue about a CB who hasn’t won shit for his team.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
No one player
will ever win “shit for his team”
Its a team sport for a reason, Aaron Rodgers didn’t win the superbowl, he was playing on the TEAM that won the superbowl. No CB, hell no player, is ever going to win a superbowl for you, but he might win you a few games every once in awhile and is a significant factor quite often.
We didn't lose the game; we just ran out of time. ~ Vince Lombardi
by ThePanthers! on Mar 2, 2011 9:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
True
but the arguements is how significant is darrelle revis to the Jets. When has Darrell Revis single handily won a game. QB’s do it all the time. Hell CB’s do it to like DeAngelo Hall for example. QB is just a far more important position than CB to settle for mediocre. Plain and Simple
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Well you just admit that CB's win games.
The whole root cause of the argument about Revis was to compare him and the Jets to PP7 and us if we get him. Who’s to say PP7 doesn’t win us some games like Deangelo Hall?
And the games he doesn’t win us, he’ll play a significant factor by shutting down the opposing #1 receiver.
And all signs point to PP7 being much better than mediocre, I would not be surprised at all, if he ends up being one of the top 3 best CB’s in the NFL in 3-4 years.
I’m not even in favor of picking Peterson, I like Gabbert, but I just don’t like the argument that he’s not going to help us win, because every player helps a team win. Whens the last time Jake Long scored a TD? Yea, I don’t think the Dolphins are regretting that pick either.
We didn't lose the game; we just ran out of time. ~ Vince Lombardi
Well damn isn't Long protecting the guy that throws the TD's?
Please that was very weak
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Most Dolphins fans don't
but some are questioning whether we should have taken Ryan over Long.
aka "The Duke"
Proponent of I-AA Football
Driving the Roberto Wallace Bandwagon
Newton, Ponder or Locker in 2011
Unofficial Phinsider DJ
Scored 9 vs Balt, lost 10-9
shut out vs GB, lost 9-0
3 vs NE, lost 45-3
6 vs Miami, lost 10-6
With that team, they should never have scored less than 10 in any game
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
3 games out of 16 doesn’t prove a point. they scored on average 22.4 PPG. Like I said, they did score points. Up to you to see that.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
4 games
And their offense did not live up to their potential, anyone knows that. They scored bc the defense gave them the ball back so much
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Right 4 games, didn’t see you put one in the header… still 1/4 of games. So I guess if we draft Peterson, we can have the same type of results then?
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
Honestly we could
With two top CBs and one of the best NB’s in the game, we could open up our new blitzing schemes and terrorize offenses. Our DE’s/LBs don’t have to worry about getting to the QB ultra fast either
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
In that scenario we would be the same as the the Jets: amazing D, crap ass O.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
I disagree because I think JC>Sanchez
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
No way dude, even if you can convince yourself that Clausen has better mechanics than Sanchez, Jimmy’s leadership ability is in the toilet. He had the chance to be the number one guy and blew it. Hell, if he just looked like he was enjoying getting to be a starting NFL QB he would have gotten some slack, but he failed. He got beat up and spit out, and that never happened to Sanchez.
If God came down on Christmas Day/ I know exactly what He'd say/ He'd say "Oi!" to the punks/ and "Oi!" to the skins/ but "Oi!" to the world and everybody wins.
-The Vandals
On Twitter:http://twitter.com/ oi2dwrld
their offense sucked in those games because their QB played like ass in those games
You really aren’t helping your point that a great CB is more important than a quality QB
well bc of that great D, especially Revis
they almost made the SB with a mediocre QB. That’s pretty damn good
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
I used "In those games" as a descriptor for a reason
Sanchez played great at other times. He is not mediocre at all considering his time in the NFL.
Yes, he is a marginal starting QB
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Jets record without Revis under Rex Ryan 12-4
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
More info from a Jets blog - I was curious
Jets record with Revis and with REX 13-3
Jets record without Revis and with REX 12-4
Jets record with Revis and without REX 8-8
Jets record witout Revis and without REX 7-9
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
My point exactly Revis is not that big of a deal
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
WTF Mike the stats say so there self.. HTF can you argue this?
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
those are not solid stats, those are insanely weak
They do not tell us anything.
I’m done explaining shit to you though, at least James or BDub or Ivan know what they are talking about
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Wins and losses are now officially
meaningless stats! Yay! We didn’t suck in anything but offense last year now!
:-D
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
You have to see what other players were there
the Raiders suck with/out Nnamdi… yet he is the best CB. They literally have noone else. Explain that
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Michael Huff of course!
The 1st team All-Pro safety!
:-)
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
He of the 6'1" frame 215 lbs
and 4.34 40yd dash time, drafted as a CB variety…
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
I meant over the years...
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
They suck with and without so agian whats your point?
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
I call it the Mythbusters argument
aka the Hyneman defense -
I reject your reality and substitute my own! :-)
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
by Vagus on Mar 2, 2011 8:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Those tell us NOTHING
Who else were in those games? what players/coaches were there etc
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Who would our "mediocre" QB be?
imo, it seems they are all “poor” in comparison to Sanchez :)
by ncarolinagrl94 on Mar 2, 2011 8:43 PM EST up reply actions
Just wondering....
did the Chargers make it into the playoffs? I was thinking they had the #1 Defense this past year…
by ncarolinagrl94 on Mar 2, 2011 8:28 PM EST up reply actions
Statistically
they had the #1 offense and #1 defense
and no…
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
best justification of special teams importance, ever
also see: Giants, New York
by ppalm on Mar 2, 2011 8:30 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Any mods present?
Is there someway to do a “human confirmation” for prospective new joinees? I know some blog sites do it, and it really cuts down on the spam!
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
Diner time man.
Mods gotta eat too.
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
Follow me on Twitter!
by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 7:27 PM EST up reply actions
Is it bad...
that when I read 99% of "Caro2daheart"’s posts, it makes me want to spew profanity and throw my laptop against the wall? OMG I’m gonna have to start asking for him to post links proving every little thing HE says from now on…
by ncarolinagrl94 on Mar 2, 2011 7:43 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Bless you...
seriously…bless you.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Don’t worry, he will leave just like most bandwagoners do, when we pass on Holy Newton in the draft.
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
by Ivan459 on Mar 2, 2011 7:53 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I can only hope....
I pretty much just read on here and don’t post much…until something either excites me enough, or irritates me enough that I have no other choice! :)
by ncarolinagrl94 on Mar 2, 2011 7:58 PM EST up reply actions
Do you have a link for that?
:-D
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Good news on Anderson.
Panthers LB James Anderson got the first-round tender. Last year’s was 2.621m for 5s. He made 1.176m on low 4-year tender in ’10.
Keep teams from prying him away, or a good price in return.
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
Follow me on Twitter!
Really good news - thanks for posting
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
In a random draft, Gabbert is not the #1 QB or a top 5 pick... he would go late 1st to early 2nd
PP7 would be the #1 DB in almost any other draft, and would be a top 5 pick…
That is another reason, I really feel people want a QB to be the face of the draft, not some CB or DT, and we are overrating Gabbert/Cam to compensate
Gabbert is not bad, I just do not believe he is an elite franchise QB or a #1 pick, especially considering he doesn’t seem to be top 5 on many overall player boards
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
by MikeTrain on Mar 2, 2011 7:53 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Mike I'm at the point where I almost don't care who we pick
I just want to get it over with.
I am all for taking the best player available regardless of need or position, but the lack of free agency makes that a very risky proposition.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
by Vagus on Mar 2, 2011 8:00 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I wonder...
if you guys were all standing around in person talking about this if a fight would break out? lol…gets pretty heated sometimes with the whole “my guy is better than your guy” stuff!! :)
by ncarolinagrl94 on Mar 2, 2011 8:14 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Nah, it is the internet
People get brave behind a keyboard.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Lol!
Unless someone threatens my loved one, my fightin’ days are over!
If someone wants to scrap nowadays, I’d just tell them they are right and offer to buy them a beer.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
If I promise not to fight you will you buy me a beer?
I could just really use a beer right now.
If God came down on Christmas Day/ I know exactly what He'd say/ He'd say "Oi!" to the punks/ and "Oi!" to the skins/ but "Oi!" to the world and everybody wins.
-The Vandals
On Twitter:http://twitter.com/ oi2dwrld
Sure thing man
Geography might be a challenge though.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Appreciate it
It is really just the thought that counts.
If God came down on Christmas Day/ I know exactly what He'd say/ He'd say "Oi!" to the punks/ and "Oi!" to the skins/ but "Oi!" to the world and everybody wins.
-The Vandals
On Twitter:http://twitter.com/ oi2dwrld
The internet leads to anonymity, anonymity leads to forget-fullness that there’s a person on the other end.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
There are a number of interesting
psychological studies on that James. Pretty amazing stuff, actually.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
If some people acted the way they do in here, I'd go with a "possibly".
Of course, I hope to god a few specific individuals on here don’t act like this in person.
I been watching the NFL.com vids lately and it seems as if all there anaylsts think we are taking a DE
I just can’t understand for the life of me why in the Hell would we take a DE with the first pick when we have Johnson and Hardy and the crew. Its obvious they haven’t done there homework and automatically assume we need to replace Julius Peppers which is not the case. But if we did go DE then I’d rather take Quinn over Bowers anyday. Quinn has far better technique and hands. Kinda reminds me of a young osi.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Going DE is ridiculous… I don’t get it either why people think that is an option for us…
Proud Member of Cat Scratch Reader
I got a good laugh out of that. Someone said we were taking Bowers because our DEs weren’t that good. Apparently the writer didn’t watch Charles Johnson have a better season than Peppers put up. God deliver me from such a bane as an inept media.
Chris Chase did lol
jk
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
Follow me on Twitter!
by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 10:21 PM EST up reply actions
Well...
Actually, I think it was some article from National Football Post or something like that, but it was listed in Yahoo! Sports.
Plus, I know better than to think any of those hacks at Yahoo! Sports are actually reliable at telling the news.
Wait, I just insulted the hacks, didn’t I? Darn it… headshakes
Echoing all above.
I mean…do we take a DE with only 1 year of good tape (Bowers) or who was suspended for a year (Quinn) when CJ was far more productive than his insanely well-compensated predecessor? And with a Kraken who is 1st round talent? (And then we have Brown and Norwood.)
It just makes no sense.
by jamiedk on Mar 2, 2011 8:35 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Preach it sister
I’ve been ringing that bell for weeks. Makes no sense at all.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
Watch this monster(Quinn) and then watch Bowers tell me who's better
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
both are overrated, so JJ Watts
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNoYxbvKxXE"
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
vs Virginia... wow.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Quite the elite teams in Duke, Virginia, and the like?
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
Follow me on Twitter!
by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 8:39 PM EST up reply actions
Don't you know RJ?
Only SEC teams count?
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
See you guys look at the team instead of looking at the damn Tackle but I want to see you argue this
Robert Quinn vs Anthony Castonzo… one of the best OT’s in College Football and future NFL prospect
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqJrjwjf55c&feature=related
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Good comparisons up until Gholston/PP7
if anything he would be the “safe” pick and the jake long of the draft. Not the bust. Julio Jones and Von Miller were the athletes who ’wow’ed the scouts.
by Martin LatinFire Gonzalez on Mar 2, 2011 10:44 PM EST reply actions
Let me give you some advice from a Dolphins fan perspective regarding the draft
All you need to do is go visit The Phinsider blog and see what we are going through. The 2008 draft gave us the option of taking a young franchise QB in Matt Ryan or a young franchise LT in Jake Long. We chose the left tackle. Now we love Jake Long. He’s the best LT in the NFL. But we missed out on Ryan who has taken his Falcons to the playoffs and will likely continue to do so for many years. Meanwhile, the endless QB carousel in Miami continues. We haven’t had a QB since Marino left and we’ve tried every option: trades, later rounders, 2nd rounders, free agents, and nothing has worked. Chad Henne showed some promise in 2009, but regressed in 2010. So we are stuck in the quagmire of mediocrity yet again because we do not have a franchise QB. Oh when we get one, he’ll be protected by a great All Pro LT, but right now, that pick, as great as Long has been, doesn’t look nearly as good.
My point with all of this is let the Dolphins be an example. If you don’t have a franchise QB, then you aren’t going to win games. It will not matter how good Fairley, Dareus, Green, Peterson, or whoever will become. Those guys could become the GOATs at their position and all that will mean is you have a great player on your team. I’m not saying the Panthers should draft a QB first overall. But if your coaches and FO believe that Newton or Gabbert or whoever can become an elite franchise QB, then you should take him, no matter what. With a true franchise QB, you will be competitive and contenders. Without one, you’ll be coming here season after season arguing about who we should draft at QB, where we should draft him, the FA QB we should pick up, the QB we should trade for, or whether or not you give your incumbent QB another chance to prove just how bad he sucks. That’s life on The Phinsider and life for every Dolphins fan. That’s not an argument we would be having had we drafted Ryan over Long. You have been warned Panthers fans!
aka "The Duke"
Proponent of I-AA Football
Driving the Roberto Wallace Bandwagon
Newton, Ponder or Locker in 2011
Unofficial Phinsider DJ
by The Earl on Mar 2, 2011 11:18 PM EST reply actions 5 recs
So beat Gabbert into JR's head?
Will do.
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
Follow me on Twitter!
by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 11:21 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks for providing your perspective.
I kinda like the Dolphins, so I do hope that you guys get a franchise QB in the near future.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
I like them too.
My entire family was ’Phins or Redskins fans pretty much, my uncle is still a diehard fan for the ’Phins.
RELEASE THE KRAKEN! (Greg Hardy)
The Official Blaine Gabbert Bandwagon Starts Here!™
Follow me on Twitter!
by RjTheMetalhead on Mar 2, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
You're welcome
Just don’t become like us, where you draft everything BUT a QB. Our D-line is led by a FA pickup, a 3rd round pick, and a 4th round NT who was a flop until last season. Our best pass rusher was an undrafted FA who played in the CFL before he came to the NFL. Before we traded for Brandon Marshall, our best WRs were Camarillo (undrafted), Bess (undrafted) and Hartline (4th rounder).
My point is that while the players that most people are projecting to you guys look like stud prospects, nothing beats having a franchise QB. you can easily find quality players, even Pro Bowl caliber players in other places. When you have a QB, everything else just seems to work out better.
aka "The Duke"
Proponent of I-AA Football
Driving the Roberto Wallace Bandwagon
Newton, Ponder or Locker in 2011
Unofficial Phinsider DJ
by The Earl on Mar 2, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Should I remind you that we went to the Superbowl and had great seasons without a franchise QB?
And please don’t compare Matt Ryan and Blaine Gabbert. They’re largely different prospects and Ryan was a lot more complete and assured thing than Gabbert is now…
4 playoff appearances in 15 years
1996: Solely on the Defense, allowing 218 pts for the entire year.
2003: Just one of those miraculous seasons with come from behind last minute wins
2005: Tremendous individual effort by Steve Smith
2008: Tremendous individual effort by DeAngelo Williams
His premise is absolutely correct, you don’t win consistently without a franchise QB.
Official ABC Fan Club President
Anybody But Clausen
First of all, I didn't compare Gabbert to Ryan
Who knows where you got that from. What I ACTUALLY said was that if your coaches and FO feel that Gabbert or Newton or whoever they like best, will become a franchise QB, then you should take them.
As far as your Super Bowl run, you wouldn’t have gotten there without Delhomme. Maybe he’s not your definition of a franchise QB, but stick, I don’t know… Jason Campbell in there and see how far you would have gotten. Most likely, nowhere.
But that’s fine. Ignore my warnings. If the Panthers end up 7-9 in a few seasons, stuck in the mire that we Dolphins fans have endured for over a decade, don’t say I didn’t tell you. Come visit the Phinsider for a while. Read our posts and articles. See what its like to be a fan of a quarterback starved franchise. We’re not talking about offensive or defensive lines. We aren’t talking that much about RBs or WRs. You know what we are talking about? QUARTERBACKS! Why? Because we don’t have one. It would be a much better place if we didn’t have to argue over QBs so much.
aka "The Duke"
Proponent of I-AA Football
Driving the Roberto Wallace Bandwagon
Newton, Ponder or Locker in 2011
Unofficial Phinsider DJ
I'm not ignoring your warnings
I’d love to have a franchise QB, but I personally don’t see one in Gabbert or Newton or many of these prospects in this weak QB class…
Rather just wait and see how JC develops, and then shoot for Luck/Barkley next year….
heh, you sound really tired of your QB carousel
And I hope you guys find that QB sometime in the very near future. I’d love to see your division rivals, the Pats, sitting at home watching the Playoffs come January as a result of your success.
To The Earl...
Thanks for the thoughtful post! Mediocrity and QB carousels are no fun, so best of luck to the Dolphins and the Panthers on being able to hit the nail on the head with a QB sooner rather than later.
I really appreciate the perspective
Thanks for giving your opinions on the topic. This point rang particularly true:
if your coaches and FO believe that Newton or Gabbert or whoever can become an elite franchise QB, then you should take him, no matter what.
In the end, that’s all the matters. None of us get to hand the envelope to the commish, so I guess in the end I just hope they see franchise potential at #1 overall, because you don’t get to pick there very often.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
I guess the Bears had an elite QB
when they made it to the Superbowl then huh?
by Martin LatinFire Gonzalez on Mar 2, 2011 11:55 PM EST reply actions
I'd prefer to win the Super Bowl...
Not be nationally embarrassed in front of the entire nation during it. But that’s just me.
And the Bears made the playoffs how many times in the 2000s?
I have said this way too many times but…
YOU CANNOT WIN CONSISTENTLY WITHOUT A FRANCHISE QUARTERBACK!!!
If I had a nickel for every time I’ve had to say that to a deluded Dolphins fan, I’d be rich. The Pats, Colts, Steelers, now the Falcons, Saints, Chargers, and Packers are always a threat to win it all because they have great QBs.
The Bears had one good season and then disappeared into obscurity again because they didn’t have a franchise QB. And please don’t even start with the “Trent Dilfer/Brad Johnson” arguments either.
aka "The Duke"
Proponent of I-AA Football
Driving the Roberto Wallace Bandwagon
Newton, Ponder or Locker in 2011
Unofficial Phinsider DJ
Dilfer, Johnson, Delhomme and Grossman.... did I miss anyone?
That’s in the last 10 years 4/20 made it without at elite QB
In the last 5 years? 1/10
Yes, lets rely on that as our marker.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
The argument was
“If you don’t have a franchise QB, then you aren’t going to win games” and it doesn’t matter how great all the other players on the other team are “all it means is that you have a great player on your team”. Rex Grossman is far from elite, yet the Bears still won 13 games in the regular season and made it to the superbowl, granted they lost the one game that mattered most. Devin Hester, Brian Urlacher, Tommie Harris, and Thomas Jones would beg to differ that their presence simply meant that they were just great players on a team with a franchise QB that won games for them. Wrong.
by Martin LatinFire Gonzalez on Mar 3, 2011 12:31 AM EST reply actions
And the Bears didn't do anything until the traded for Cutler
aka "The Duke"
Proponent of I-AA Football
Driving the Roberto Wallace Bandwagon
Newton, Ponder or Locker in 2011
Unofficial Phinsider DJ
? Dont really get what you're saying
didn’t they go 7-9 and 11-5 and lost in the NFC title game? So that’s better than making it to the SuperBowl?
by Martin LatinFire Gonzalez on Mar 3, 2011 12:51 AM EST up reply actions
But you're missing a key point
They will contend next year, and the next, and the next because they have a good QB. They’re not going to be a one hit wonder. They can now build around Cutler. They can draft WRs and RBs and O-linemen and other needs because they are set at QB. Trust me on this… I’ve watched my team for over a decade do everything but the right thing at the QB position and we are stuck in mediocrity because of it. If Carolina can get a franchise QB in this draft, things will start to look up from there. You may not be good for a year or two, but you can stop worrying about the most important position in sports and start getting the auxiliary pieces to complement your QB.
aka "The Duke"
Proponent of I-AA Football
Driving the Roberto Wallace Bandwagon
Newton, Ponder or Locker in 2011
Unofficial Phinsider DJ
And I thought it was pretty obvious
that every fan wants his team to win the Super Bowl rather than just play in it…But that’s just me.
by Martin LatinFire Gonzalez on Mar 3, 2011 12:37 AM EST reply actions
I've discussed this at length with several Dolphins fans
You MIGHT get to the playoffs every few years without a great QB. But you will NEVER EVER contend year in and year out without a great QB. Look at the top teams in the NFL: Pats, Colts, Steelers, Chargers, Saints, Packers, Falcons, Ravens… what’s the one thing they have in common? Franchise QBs. You may catch a break and make the playoffs with a mediocre QB. But you will not be a perennial contender without a top QB.
aka "The Duke"
Proponent of I-AA Football
Driving the Roberto Wallace Bandwagon
Newton, Ponder or Locker in 2011
Unofficial Phinsider DJ
I believe Jimmy was given zero chance to succeed last year, and believe he still has that same potential he had when drafted
Believing that, the best case for the Carolina Panthers would be that Jimmy is that “Franchise QB” everyone keeps clamoring for so we can be able to go out and get an elite young player at a different position to further secure our future.
I do not see anything in Cam/Gabbert that suggests they will be any better than Jimmy Clausen (especially when you consider he was not supposed to start once). Yes people can show me good tape on Gabbert, yet I can do the same with JC.
If the management believes in one of them and gives up faith in Jimmy, I will support whoever represents our future at QB.
I used to HATE Jimmy Clausen, with a passion, at ND. So anyone who thinks I am so “Pro-JC” that is ridiculous. I couldn’t stand the guy a year ago, but my tune has changed as I have witnessed more tape/analysis on him and seeing him suffer through this season in a no-win situation (Gabbert would have done just as bad).
I also believe in the Brass, and they would not have picked JC if they did not feel comfortable with him and did their research.
People talk about how the coach likes to draft “their guy” at QB… If that is so than I am 100% certain that JC was not a pick made with the mindset that Fox + staff were going to stay, so logic says he was picked for the next guy.
I am pro-Panthers and unlike many of the masses, understand that no rookie QB would have succeeded under that situation last year. Lameduck coaching staff, a horrid OC/QB coach, no vet QB mentor, a vet WR who hates losing and bringing a negative attitude at times instilling no confidence, two starting rookie WRs, injuries galore at RB, and a turnstile at OL. Someone please respond to that last bit… it seems like it’s easy to say the rookie QB was at fault even though he was never supposed to start.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Mike - I think I can save you a lot of time
and a great deal of headache.
Just about everyone knows your position on Jimmy Clausen – that the Panthers should commit to him and he will come good. However, I don’t think anybody is going to be convinced by what you or any fan says about JC. In fact, even if Ron Rivera came out and gave JC his vote of confidence (I know this is not going to happen), nobody is going to be convinced that JC has franchise potential.
The only way this is going to happen is if Jimmy Clausen gets a chance and wins games for us. Until then rehashing this topic (and I know it can only come up again) is quite aggravating because it is not like we make decisions here – we just talk about the team we love.
I agree with a lot of your opinions on Clausen except that I’m not as convinced that he is a sure thing and it at this point he is more likely to succeed on another team at this point as much as I would like to be with us.
by pieterzen on Mar 3, 2011 3:28 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Jimmy Clausen had a chance to win games
He could have tried being a leader of the team when it needed one. Instead he sat alone on the bench and moped, or hid behind the leader of the defense. The reason Jimmy won’t be “The Guy” is because he has already lost the locker room. You can’t be the leader if no one will follow you.
The best thing that can happen to Clausen is to be a serviceable back up, get some confidence, and get traded to a team where he can reestablish himself.
If God came down on Christmas Day/ I know exactly what He'd say/ He'd say "Oi!" to the punks/ and "Oi!" to the skins/ but "Oi!" to the world and everybody wins.
-The Vandals
On Twitter:http://twitter.com/ oi2dwrld
On a related note...
A conversation on Bustin’ Loose (from yesterday) addresses this:
The reason Jimmy won’t be "The Guy" is because he has already lost the locker room. You can’t be the leader if no one will follow you.
Leading into the conversation, Frank and Moose are talking about Carson Palmer, the QB situation, and what Brett Jensen said he’d heard from a “high-ranking official” in the organization concerning Clausen (sounds suspiciously like Hurney). Moose says that what he’s heard from current players contradicts what said high-ranking official said.
Take it for what it’s worth. Sometimes I agree with Moose’s opinions. Sometimes I don’t. But this isn’t giving an opinion, this is saying what he’s heard from guys who are currently in the locker room.
This part of the conversation (the lead-in talking about Palmer) starts around the 24:00 mark.
Whatever stock you put into the conversation, I still think it’s interesting to listen to.
I think it can be both, and neither at the same time
Maybe Jimmy hasn’t lost the locker room per se, but if upper management believe he has by talking to an unhappy player or two (read Steve Smith) then it’s going to take a lot to right that ship, even if untrue.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
I guess the questions is?
Is losing one, two, three players on the team equate to losing the locker room? I guess who the players are makes a difference.
"If you see this ugly ass face, that means I scored...again!"
~Stevonne Smith
Oh absolutely...
It’s all about who you ‘lose’. If Matt Moore and David Clowney don’t like him it means nothing… if Steve Smith and Jon Beason don’t there’s a world of difference.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
But how can Beason not like him?
He said he was sorry. :-)
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
Haha!
Yeah, wow. Forgot about that.
Honestly, If I’m a Pro-bowler like Beas, and Jimmy comes up to me with that weak shit…it would really piss me off. I wonder how Beas REALLY felt about it.
"If you see this ugly ass face, that means I scored...again!"
~Stevonne Smith
lol
No kidding.
Disclaimer: BusyBeingAwesome = Irony. And, on a side note. I miss you, Steve Beuerlein.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Mar 3, 2011 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
That's my point
I don’t see how you can be a leader and speak thru an intermediary like that. I can only guess he was apologizing for keeping the D on the field so much, but like Smitty said, he should have been apologizing to the O for not keeping them out there longer.
If God came down on Christmas Day/ I know exactly what He'd say/ He'd say "Oi!" to the punks/ and "Oi!" to the skins/ but "Oi!" to the world and everybody wins.
-The Vandals
On Twitter:http://twitter.com/ oi2dwrld
Yeah
Unfortunately, I think we can say with confidence that Smitty is one of the ‘lost.’
If JC is the best option for next season (eww), at what point does Smitty say “it’s me or him.”
"If you see this ugly ass face, that means I scored...again!"
~Stevonne Smith
I'm pretty sure Smitty and Coach are having that conversation right now.
If God came down on Christmas Day/ I know exactly what He'd say/ He'd say "Oi!" to the punks/ and "Oi!" to the skins/ but "Oi!" to the world and everybody wins.
-The Vandals
On Twitter:http://twitter.com/ oi2dwrld
Thanks for the info jamie
I will check it out when I get home. I admit I am mainly going from rumor and what I saw on the sidelines.
If God came down on Christmas Day/ I know exactly what He'd say/ He'd say "Oi!" to the punks/ and "Oi!" to the skins/ but "Oi!" to the world and everybody wins.
-The Vandals
On Twitter:http://twitter.com/ oi2dwrld
Also...
The conversation spills over and expands and gets into how ridiculously awful the coaching staff was this past year in the next hour of the show.
Still none of the haters answered that statement :( sad
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
Just filter through the archives and read the same responses you would get here.
He didn’t show enough improvement to justify calling him “the future” at the position.
Ivan’s right — no one wants to argue this with you anymore because it goes nowhere. You seem to be blind to the facts that are staring you in the face, and frankly people get tired of wasting their time trying to get you to see the light.
CSR's Sergeant-at-Arms, enforcing the Rules and Regulations.
Lather, rinse and repeat - No More Tears
You’ve made your mind up regardless of the arguments presented to you. Kind of pointless really.
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques
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