Thoughts on Matt Moore
by The Earl on Dec 25, 2011 10:20 PM EST
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PrintHello Panthers fans. Allow myself to introduce... myself. I'm a Miami Dolphins fan and a regular member of The Phinsider blog. I'm a North Carolina native and a graduate of Appalachian State University. While I'm a Dolphins fan, I still keep up with the Panthers and always hope they play well (especially Armanti Edwards for obvious reasons).
I am writing this post to get some feedback and thoughts on current Miami Dolphins quarterback Matt Moore. Moore stepped into the starting role when former starter Chad Henne injured his shoulder against the Chargers in week 4. He started out pretty rough, but played very well over the past few weeks. During Miami's little stretch of wins, he has posted some great numbers, in terms of QB rating, completion percentage, and yards per attempt. These numbers have been comparable to some of the best QBs in the game.
Moore's recent play has led to a rip-roaring debate on The Phinsider about the potential of Matt Moore to be an answer for Miami at the QB position. Miami has trotted out a plethora of forgettable quarterbacks since Dan Marino hung up the cleats. And at first, Moore looked like one of them. But in the last few games, he has produced some of the best numbers that Miami has had since Marino (sad commentary in and of itself).
There is a growing rift between fans on our site. There are those who think we should go forward with Moore as our starting QB. There are those who say draft a first round QB at all costs and don't care what happens to Moore. Then there are those like me, who think that we should draft a QB, even if we have to trade up, but are still intrigued with Moore because of what he has shown. Personally, I never thought he had a real chance to succeed here in Carolina due to the coaching situation with Fox and other reasons.
That's where you guys come in. I read this site daily and comment occasionally. I know you guys are just as passionate about the Panthers as those on The Phinsider are about theDolphins. So I want to get some inside information from you. The main thing I would like to know is: what are your general thoughts on Matt Moore? What did you think of how he played and how he led the team? Another thing I would like to know is how the situation in Carolina affected him last year. I read bits and pieces about what was going on, but you folks would know much more than I would. Do you think Moore's play was affected by the coaching issues? Was he ever really given a chance to develop as a QB?
I hope this isn't a total waste of your time but I would really appreciate any constructive thoughts and opinions on Matt Moore and the overall situation from last year. I really want to know what this fan base has dealt with so that I can present a more accurate case concerning Moore amongst Dolphins fans. The lack of a true franchise QB for the Dolphins is a sore point for just about every fan and any time QBs are brought up, the fan base becomes divided. This off-season, debates about Chad Henne drove people mad and I'm afraid that Matt Moore debates will end up the same way. I'm just looking for a little insight. Thank you.
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Ironic that Moore caused a similar rift here...
He had some good games here as well but also had some stinkers. It was that inconsistency that drove us nuts. I would call it risky to go into TC 2012 with him as your starting QB without at least a legitimate FA starter to compete with him. Maybe he finally puts it all together with the fins and becomes a consistent QB…but I’m not feeling that at the moment. We all remember the Eagles game to start the 2010 season and he threw 4 picks, 3 in the end zone. The season never got better.
He does struggle with consistency
he has never held a position foir long so it is hard to judge, he shows flashes but also is terrible at times. Overall I like him, he’s definitely better than any back up your going to get. If i were you I would let him and Henne battle it out next year and go from there.
It was the Giants he threw four picks against.
Eagles was the prior year with Delhomme, who threw five I think.
Yes I'm a dude.
by Flowing Willow on Dec 25, 2011 11:49 PM EST up reply actions
It was the Giants he threw 3 TDs against. And whipped them in their house, when they needed the win to make the playoffs.
http://www.nfl.com/player/mattmoore/2507282/gamelogs?season=2009
But then, you always were a little confused about Moore. :-)
As others did, you minimized that game, saying it was “meaningless.”
Season opener in 2010, in their new stadium.
He beat their ass in the old one…at the end of the season. You did always have the Moore soft spot haha.
Yes I'm a dude.
by Flowing Willow on Dec 25, 2011 11:59 PM EST up reply actions
FW's right...it was the opener of 2010 in the new Meadowlands
Or whatever they call it.
That was a bad, bad game.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
He's only off by one...Moore threw 3 picks.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
A 2-3% variance is an acceptable margin of error; however, 25% is not.
I am unable to let such sloppy math go unnoticed. As FW is as particular about facts and numbers as I am, I’m certain he’ll concur.
A final word to our Phinsider friend about Moore: all the talk last year on this board was comparing him to Clausen. There is NO debate, now that we have found our true leader.
I’m sure if this were about another QB, and not Moore, you wouldn’t mind at all.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
Correctamundo.
Old habits die hard.
Just ask Bruce Willis.
Yeah, that's it.
The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace
I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.
That game is on the Steve Smith mic'd up highlights tape.
Unsurprisingly at least three of the interceptions were balls thrown to Smith.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
I'm in agreement with Jaxon.
You’re playing with fire when you go all in with Matt Moore. He’s an excellent back up QB that can win you a few games if your starter is out for a couple of weeks. When you ask him to be “The Guy”, he turns into a totally different player. It seems to be a mental thing for him. Chances are you will be going another direction anyway. Best of luck to you.
"Keep Pounding" -Sam Mills
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+1
He’s a fantastic and capable backup. I’d be very wary of establishing him as the starting QB before the next year. I just don’t think he can be consistently good. Sometimes he looks a lot like the good gunslinging Tony Romo. And then other times, he looks more like the facepalming Jake Delhomme, throwing INTs.
When it’s all said and done, he’s not a franchise QB.
Keep him, but I would definitely go after a top young QB to build around. Matty just can’t be that guy.
I'm happy for him
I think he does well when there’s no pressure on him. The dolphins weren’t expected to make the playoffs and he wasn’t playing to keep his job or anything
CAM....CAAAAAAAAM
by CamNewtonSBMVP on Dec 25, 2011 11:08 PM EST reply actions
Echoing what others have said
He’s inconsistent. He plays very well when there’s no pressure, but he seems to fold under pressure. I think he’s a very good backup, but I wouldn’t feel safe handing him the reigns.
Keep him in a very consistent environment..
And provide him offensive tools & weapons to work with, and he’ll do great for you.
Start changing things up or put him in a less than ideal situation and you’re probably going to get the inconsistent Moore.
He played very well for us at times but played horribly when stuck with a lame duck coach, offensive coordinator that cared more about today’s variety of donuts than forming a game plan, and an all around pretty terrible offense.
He’s not going to be Peyton Manning and make a horrible team look great (not saying the Dolphins are as bad as the Colts, just using an example) but he will bring you W’s if given a fair opportunity.
http://www.facebook.com/dranged1 - Add me on Facebook. Can never have too many CSR/Panther friends.
See what I posted on Phinsider about Moore a few months ago.
It got no response from Miami readers, but it recaps what you need to know – about what he did here, and about the sharply divided opinions we had about him.
Hi hi yikas!
Always good to see another Mountaineer.
But as for your question, Moore is a good stop-gap guy but he’s not a long-term option. If you can feasably replace him, do it. If you’re in position to draft a franchise QB in the draft, do it. For whatever reason he seems to do the best when he’s not expected to be the guy.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Dec 26, 2011 12:03 AM EST via Android app reply actions
I'm a huge Matt Moore fan
The guy has guts, and there’s just something about him. He can be a good started when you need him, and may even be able to sneak into the playoffs with him eventually. But as far as long term franchise QB? He isn’t your guy, if the Phins are in any spot to take a QB in a first round, they should pull the trigger.
"What do want to say to those critics now?"
"Just sit back and watch the show." -Cam Newton
Jeez didn't check typos
good *starter, in *the first round
"What do want to say to those critics now?"
"Just sit back and watch the show." -Cam Newton
My take on Moore:
He’s the next in line to be Jon Kitna- but this I mean the reliable backup QB that every team wishes they had because he can be ready in a moment’s notice to step in a win a few games for you.
However, I wouldn’t feel comfortable as a Dolphins’ fan if my organization was willing to move forward with Moore at QB if it meant passing on a prospect in the draft.
So characterize Moore as ‘inconsistent’ and while that’s true I find there to be a far more reliable pattern than mere inconsistency. To chronicle his tenure in Carolina here’s pretty much how it went:
- Signed off Dallas’ practice squad in 2007
- Started 3 games for us due to injuries, lit it up.. everyone was excited
- Moore given the chance to compete for the backup spot, played terribly in preseason. Failed to win spot, became #3 QB
- Moore given the chance to win the backup spot in 2009, played terribly in preseason and failed to win the job.
- Injury allowed for him to start, Moore lit it up again… everyone was excited
- Named starter, beat Clausen for starting job. Failed as a starter
In short, the pattern is pretty simple: Have him step in with no expectations and he’s great, place expectations on him and he falters. I can’t think of a reason for it, but it is what it is.
This sums it up perfectly.
look no further for your answer.
I don't know as much about Matt Moore ... but
The NFL has turned into “either you have a quarterback or you don’t”. The playoff teams read off most of the top quarterbacks in the NFL (or atleast the ones that are playing the best). I always ask myself this. If your team needed to win on the road in the AFC championship game can you drive it 90 yards with your current qb? (and i mean that feeling you get in your gutt that says “we got this” or does that feeling tell you “crap”)
Give him a year.
Matt Moore has been screwed his entire career and I’m tired of it. He’s been treated bad by his head coach and he’s had bad luck with injuries. You may not know Matt Moore’s history with the Panthers so I’ll go ahead and talk to you about it.
Matt Moore has needed and deserved a starting spot on a team for a long time now. I was the saddest man around when he left the Carolina Panthers because I believed he always got a bad rap here. There is no other way to say it: Matt Moore got screwed. The Panthers let him start in 2009 after giving Jake Delhomme the game to throw away for 11 straight games. We were 4-7. We had just finished losing to the Jets and we didn’t show any signs of life or anything worthy of calling an offense. And EVERYONE hated Jake Delhomme. He was the most unpopular man in town, throwing interceptions left and right like they were presents. Yet somehow, for some stupid reason, the Panthers kept giving him the ball to throw in spite of having two of the best RB’s in the league coming off a career and NFL record highs the year previous.
I’m sure all of the veteran members of this blog remember my irritation during this period. This was in the middle of my "Run the damn ball" era. It was truly a mind boggling thing. An offensive line built to run the ball, two of the best running backs in the league, and we won’t run the damn ball. What the hell? Why do we insist on throwing it so much?
So at 4-7 John Fox FINALLY decides to pull the plug on Jake Delhomme. He didn’t even do it outright. He used the ol ‘Oh! Jake Delhomme hurt his wubby finger and can’t play’ excuse. It was complete bullcrap, but it got us another QB to start so I was fine with it. Matt Moore comes in on day one and he brings a hell of a game with him, winning 4 out of the last 5 games to bring us to 8-8 and even bringing us back into the playoff discussions. It was great. Matt Moore is the most popular guy in Charlotte and his jersey reached #1 sales for a long, long while. I still have his jersey hanging in my closet right now. ((Jimmy Clausen’s has been long since burnt though!))
Fast forward to 2009. After he brings the Panthers from the depths of insignificance and SAVES JOHN FOX’s JOB….he gives him the shortest leash I’ve ever seen given a starting QB in the league. John Fox was in his lame duck year as head coach, part of it inspired by the success of Tom Coughlin during his Super Bowl winning year in his lame duck year, hoping that he would bring the Panthers back to the playoff after a two year absence.
But after winning 4 out of 5 games last year, John Fox makes a gutcheck decision in the NFL Draft by selecting Jimmy Clausen, a dumbass out of Notre Dame, in the 2nd round because the Panthers were surprised he dropped that far. I don’t know why we did it, but the Panthers did. We ignored all of our glowing needs on our team for a airhead that gets beat up in bars for being a bad QB. And after losing just two games in 2009, both of them helped out by the fact we got rid of ALMOST EVERY VETERAN THAT WE HAD the year previous, John Fox pulled the plug on Matt Moore and started Jimmy Clausen because John was hoping that he’d do well and make himself look like a genius.
It didn’t work.
Jimmy Clausen laid a big fat egg and Matt Moore was again turned to in Week 7 in an effort to save this team. And for the first week, it worked. Matt Moore threw a good game against the 49ers, made quick reads and good throws, and the Panthers did well. But we had NO offensive line that year. Not even Peyton Manning could have been successful with an O-Line we had in 2009. Someone was coming free on the defensive line almost every snap. I’m not exaggerating one bit. Matt Moore tried his best, but he got hurt in Week 9 and got thrown on injured reserve.
We stuck the rest of the year. At 2-14, we fired John Fox. With a new head coach in Ron Rivera, Matt Moore’s fate was sealed since Jimmy Clausen and Tony Pike were the fresher faces.
With Matt Moore, the Dolphins have a very streaky QB that can have fits of being excellent and throwing TD after TD in rapid succession. He can also have times where he shuts down when the rest of the team is doing terrible, either going inside his own little world or trying to make plays that are not there and making interceptions in the meantime.
Either way, I think it’s more than worth it to try to give the ball to Matt Moore for the entire year. I understand you guys have had a rough time with Chad Henne. You grabbed him up in the draft thinking that he’s going to be your franchise guy and you were wrong. You guys are looking for the next Dan Marino. That’s fine and dandy.
But it’s obvious that Matt Moore has talent and he’s never really been given a decent shot to be a franchise guy for his entire career. Why don’t you give him 2012 and see if he can lead this team to the playoffs?
On one hand if he implodes, no big deal. The Phins can go after a franchise QB in 2013.
On the other hand if he is a success and his good games can turn into an every game deal, there you have your franchise guy and he was on your roster at the same time.
You don’t know if you try. But please give him a better shot than he had with the Panthers. The way the Panthers cut all their decent veterans and pulled the plug on Matt Moore after 2 games for an untested rookie, that was damn pitiful. Just give the guy a decent chance to succeed. For pity’s sake.
That’s my all of text and I’m sticking to it.
ACC Championship Member Brandon Thompson is the new Jacoby Ford. You better pick him Panthers or you will be doomed to relive the 2010 season over and over again in the Twilight Zone.
Clemson 2011 ACC Champions! Look forward to doing it again next year! :D
by Revshawn on Dec 26, 2011 5:00 AM EST reply actions 4 recs
I agree.
Worst case scenario, The Phins can go after Matt Barkley, Tyler Bray, or Aaron Murray next year.
Cam Newton, when a reporter asks him who will win the Heisman Trophy on Saturday: "I'll tell you Sunday."
by Son of a Newton on Dec 26, 2011 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
heck yes
The only thing I have to disagree with is that last year, Fox and Hurney were obviously not on the same page for much of the year, and Richardson had all the veterans cut. From my observations and from everything I’ve read, It was Hurney, not Fox, that wanted Clausen, and wanted to play Clausen really soon. Richardson and Hurney weren’t going to have Fox back unless he pulled some sort of miracle and everyone knew it. This is one of the reasons Hurney and Fox didn’t work together on the draft picks like they did for all of the rest of Fox’s tenure in NC. Armanti Edwards is another pick Fox wasn’t particularly fond of.
You said all this already but here is where I agree.
The main thing is that Moore came in the games in 07 and 09 and played very well, and had a chance to start in 10, and had some bad games. The whole team played like shit and was coached like shit last year as the management/coaching tension trickled down into the moral of the locker room. Moore deserved a chance to start and deserved the time it takes to develop, and wasn’t given the time before Hurney wanted his boy Clausen in the game. Also, Moore should have never played games while concussed. The back and forth of the QB carousel was clownish and humiliating and did nothing for the developement or confidence of either Moore or Clausen.
Moore is playing very well in Miami with a team that believes in one another and unless they trade up or find another FA, they won’t get a sure fire starting QB anyway. They can get a guy to work with while Moore starts and plays for a shot at a contract extension, but in my opinion, Moore is still young enough and with a little work, can be better than half the current QBs in the league now if he isn’t already. He needs to work on his fumbling. One thing I’ve noticed from his time in Carolina to his time in Miami now is that he’s improved on his pocket poise. That’s something he’s always kept in mind in improving and I see it’s getting better. He’ll still get shaken under pressure but he’s improving. I think he’ll improve even more and hope he gets a chance next year in Miami.
by IsaidgoodDAY! on Dec 26, 2011 4:27 PM EST up reply actions
THE CONCUSSIONS!
I completely forgot about the concussions. That was bullcrap too. Thanks for reminding me.
Megadittos on what you’re saying.
ACC Championship Member Brandon Thompson is the new Jacoby Ford. You better pick him Panthers or you will be doomed to relive the 2010 season over and over again in the Twilight Zone.
Clemson 2011 ACC Champions! Look forward to doing it again next year! :D
Moore
I’ve always liked Matt. He never really got good chance when he was here. No qb would have been good in our off. last year. Worst in nfl. Phins have a huge decision to make in offseason. With Barkley staying in school, makes decision that much harder. If they do decide to grab a top qb, its going to cost them dearly and i’am talking about RG3. Luck will go first and if STL. gets 1st. pick, you could have him but to me it would destroy your draft for next 3 years. You’re still going to have to give up a lot to move up for RG2 but not as much. If i was phins, I would go with Moore and maybe bring in somebody like Orton to compete on short term basis. Then maybe grab your qb in 2013 or 2014. Really, not many good options.
If you guys have a shot at either Luck, Griffin, or Jones
you should jump on it. If not, draft/sign another QB later to compete with Moore and hope it works out better than what we did.
Yes I'm a dude.
by Flowing Willow on Dec 26, 2011 12:19 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
I think there's something off with him as well.
He threw far too many INT’s this year. But he still is a legit first round QB prospect, who I think has more raw talent than Moore. He reminds me of Mark Sanchez, who has had quite a bit of success so far in his young career, albeit with plenty of problems.
Yes I'm a dude.
by Flowing Willow on Dec 26, 2011 2:05 PM EST up reply actions
Rumour has it he's going to lose his starting job to his backup in the Spring.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Kellen Moore would be a better option to draft.
Get him late in the Draft, have him compete with Matt.
my two cents
Draft a QB if one is bettter than Moore, or worth the shot. I’m not sure where the Dolphins are gonna pick, but if I was them, I would probably trade up to get RG3. Brees played well at times for SD, but they drafted Rivers anyway to be safe. They didn’t know Brees was gonna be so good, but Rivers is pretty good too. RG3 is faster than CAM, and a better passer than Tebow. He led Baylor to their best season in 25 years. I would take him in the 1st, cut Henne’s sorry ass, and then draft BPA after that. I’d also look at making a splash in FA – not so much big names and big checks, but competitive players and depth. IMO, RG3 is clearly the best QB in the draft, and whoever gets Luck will be happy about it, but missing out. If the Rams have the 1st pick, they’ll trade out of it and have a good draft.
by usana_gaines on Dec 26, 2011 12:37 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Moore has never had a real chance for the fans to evaluate him.
We only got to see what the coaches wanted us to see. In preseason I don’t think he played with the first string team. When he got the start he was injured early in the season and knocked out with a concussion I believe, and brought back too soon and ended up getting pulled for Clausen. After he came back, near mid season, he was starting to play well when he had his shoulder injury and was lost for the season. No1 knows really how he will do as a starter when healthy. I would say, you have to have faith in what ever decision your coaches make. If you can’t trust the coaches to make that call, you are in worse trouble than the QB position.
STICK THE KNIFE IN AND TURN IT!!!!!
While I can understand most of the reasoning provided for MM's failings while he was here,
can’t argue his horrible preseason performances. Sure, he wasn’t playing with the first string, but that also means he wasn’t playing against the other teams first string.
"If ya ain't first, you're last."
- Ricky Bobby's Dad
"There is no evidence that the tongue is connected to the brain."
-Frank Tyger
by KaiserBromley on Dec 27, 2011 4:09 AM EST up reply actions
What does that matter?
Judge him by his most recent performance – what he’s do this year.
For those numbers, see my post below.
What happened in preseason years ago is like saying Aaron Rodgers sat on the bench behind Favre, so he can’t play.
Way to twist my words around.
Not even close to what I said. All I was commenting on was the fact that he played like crap in the preseason. Jeez man.
"If ya ain't first, you're last."
- Ricky Bobby's Dad
"There is no evidence that the tongue is connected to the brain."
-Frank Tyger
by KaiserBromley on Dec 29, 2011 1:33 AM EST up reply actions
Josh Johnson
I remember when Gruden drafted Josh Johnson. He runs a 4.40 40, or something like that, is 6’3 and threw 43 TDs to 1 INT as a senior at University of San Diego (A D-II school). Gruden got fired and the new coach wanted a new QB, and went with Freeman. I could see the same thing in Miami as the new coach wants his own guy. However, if I was the Dolphins and didn’t draft a QB in the 1st rd, I’d go after a couple other back-ups like Josh Johnson, Brian Hoyer, Matt Flynn, Ryan Mallett or Dennis Dixon. They would compete with Moore.
No way for them to get Mallet
Patriots won’t let him go after just one season for anything less than a 2nd and I still don’t think they’d let him go regardless. They want to wait and let his value increase like Cassell’s did.
i still think Josh Johnson can play.
He can acturally throw it. He looks like a qb that hasn’t had much playing time.
Moore has done a good job for Miami this year. He's a gamer.
He came back from a concussion, and a shoulder injury that has ended many a career.
He’s thrown 15 TD passes, vs 7 INTs, and his 6 lost fumbles are mostly from blind-side hits. He’s presently got a QB rating of 89.8, 11th best in the league. His numbers are better than Joe Flacco, Mark Sanchez, Carson Palmer, Philip Rivers, Jay Cutler, Michael Vick, Matt Hasselback, Kevin Kolb (how many people on this blog slobbered over HIM?), Fitzpatrick, Grossman, Tebow, McCoy, and a host of others. (Oh, and better than Cam Newton’s, too, though he’s the only one of that whole group I wouldn’t trade for Moore.) Check the link and see for yourselves. The guy’s got heart and talent. he’s just not flamboyant, and gets absolutely no press or fanfare. If, for example, he were QBing the Jets, they’d be in the playoffs.
Moore haters ought to admit when they’ve been wrong. You know who you are.
http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=0&statisticCategory=PASSING&season=2011&seasonType=REG
i dont think the phins should feel good about moore starting for 2012
he has shown a pattern:
play well without pressure (season already tanked)
play awful when needed (start of the season)
he CAN play well, but he’s not THE GUY
The extent of his injury last year is the subject of some debate
He got his bell rung pretty good to start the season. Had it been this year, they probably would have pulled him and sat him at least a game or two. He was rookie of the month when he came in for an injured Delhomme late in his first season. Then he had an injury that put him on IR in his 2nd. Late in his 3rd, he gets another late season try and does well again. He is the starter in his 4th and tanks, but that is where the details are murky about whether his fog was self induced (the pressure of being the starter?) or not (the result of a concussion).
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