2012 Roster Keepers... and departures that wouldn't make me cry.
by SwankTheTank on Dec 18, 2011 6:05 PM EST
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PrintAs I watched the game today, there are a few players that I think deserve to stay on the roster next season. Now of course, this not about the obvious keepers... the is about the less obvious guys. My information on contract lengths isn't really up to par, but here are my nominees for roster keepers for the 2012 season:
1. Jordan Senn. The last few weeks this guys is always around the ball. Last year his numbers were very pedestrian, but Senn has really progressed. He's easily surpassed his play of last year and helped a rather weak linebacking unit. For what I've seen of Senn in his 5 starts, I'd like to see him back next year. Keep him!
2. Thomas Keiser. Being an un-drafted rookie, you really have to make the best of your playing time, if you even get any. In his 5 appearances (before today), he's accumulated 3 sacks, and 1 INT. I'd love to see Keiser continue to develop and be a stud backup in the DE rotation. Definitely a keeper!!
3. Legedu Naanee. Although some will disagree with me here, Naanee has been much better in the second half of the season. This has been his highest statistical year (40 rec, 439 yds, 1 TD) and he also hasn't committed a single turnover. I realize he hasn't been Mr. Clutch, but I don't really think he's hurt this team as it continues to grow. Naanee's fate will be determined by the return of Gettis and further development of our other guys. He holds more value than AE at this point. If he's cheap, I say keep him!
I know there are a few others to throw in the keeper category. Much will be decided after the draft as I really don't see us fixing too many things through free agency. Either way, I'm already looking forward to next season. I'm sure we're in for some changes in the next 8 months.
Last but not least... these people's departure wouldn't make me cry:
1. Olindo Mare. He's had a terrible year, I'm still pissed off at him and for the money we're paying he hasn't been worth a damned penny of it. If anything, we keep working Kunalic or bring in a guy that's not in his late 30's. We need a franchise kicker again. I miss Kasay and we'll never have him again. Doh, Olindo!
2. Armanti Edwards. I'm on the fence with this one. Maybe I'd feel better if he was a former 6th-round draft pick. He hasn't done anything yet... I mean, I guess he completed a pass today. But when your on-field opportunities are limited, it's because you haven't shown enough in practice to warrant those opportunities. We were told, "AE is looking like a WR!" right as the season was about to begin and I'd just actually like to see that: AE, in a game, where he does something. AE has to earn some time on the field before I move him out of this category. With a returning Gettis, I can't see AE anywhere in the WR mix.
3. Jeff Otah. With Otah, it's time to move on. He's played 4 games in the last two seasons. We can't put faith in someone that is a perennial IR. Every time I heard something about Otah and his health, I feel as if I'm being whispered a hallow lie by my evil and dirty ex-wife. I don't need that. Now, every time I think of Otah, I'm reminded of that horrid excuse of a woman. Damn it, Otah!
4. Mike Goodson. Although he's had a few "spark" moments in his young career, I don't think there's room for him in the backfield. Behind D-Will and Stew, there's Josh Vaughan, a very capable fill-in. Hell, Sutton is still out there. I'd love seeing him re-signed. Goodson's had 2 more fumbles than TD's and that's probably a few too many to keep him on next years roster.
5. Thomas Davis. I hate even thinking this because I really like Davis. Physically though, I don't think his knees can last. Now I am sad. *sniffle*
Honestly, if we keep all these guys and win, I wouldn't be happier. I think I'm simply finding things I don't want to see repeated next season. What do y'all think?!
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Otah is under contract for $1 million next season. it would be stupid to cut him
Thomas Davis will have his contract ripped up and redone in all likelihood. i can see him getting a short term contract that is mainly incentive based. I absolutely think both of those guys should and will be back.
"The way y'all are lollygaggin around here with them picks and them shovels, you'd think it was 120 degrees...can't be more than 114."
by SouthernPanther on Dec 18, 2011 6:10 PM EST reply actions
I do see your point, but...
With Otah, it just seems like a $1,000,000 risk. Either he plays next season and we have faith in his not-so dependable knees, or we eat the $1 million and not depend on him. IF there’s no better or dependable options at RT then sure, it’d be stupid to get rid of him. Now if he stays, kicks ass and stays healthy I’ll gladly call myself I giant douche.. for an entire month! :) We just haven’t had good luck with people returning from two consecutive season-ending knee injuries.
"Buy the ticket, take the ride" ~ Hunter S. Thompson
by SwankTheTank on Dec 18, 2011 6:34 PM EST up reply actions
I can assure you we are not getting a RT at the level of Jeff Otah for 1 million. When Healthy guy is a beast. He isn’t going anywhere..neither if TD he will restructure his deal and try again.
Proud member of the Panthers Mafia!
Saving The Environment One Green Comment at a Time
'We got to learn to stick in the knife and turn it - Ron Rivera aka BAMF
Has Otah been healthy an entire season though?
When his knees, shoulder and back aren’t bothering him, yes, he is a beast.
"Buy the ticket, take the ride" ~ Hunter S. Thompson
by SwankTheTank on Dec 18, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
He played without injury his first 1 3/4 seasons...
its just what has transpired since that sucks; I read somewhere that he’s been working on shedding weight though, which might help out big time considering how much stress his knees are taking carrying around a dude his size
Nobody fucks with the Jesus! -Big Lebowski
$1 million is about .8% of the total salary cap
It’s really a low risk, high reward deal to keep him next year
Yup. Plus...
The front office placing him in IR early in the season in order to give him a good sufficient recovery tells me that they’re really trying to give it full effort at trying to get him healthy.
"Hope for the best plan for the worst"
"They laugh at me because I'm different, I laugh at them because they're all the same"
Like others have mentioned:
He’s healthy enough to play now. They put him on IR cause we aren’t making a run this year anyway and they want to ensure he’s 100% next season.
I'm pretty sure Armanti will stay on the team and finish out his rookie contract.
I think he has the potential to make a few more plays on the offensive side of the ball, and with time it will come, as Chud gains more confidence in him.
Cam Newton, when a reporter asks him who will win the Heisman Trophy on Saturday: "I'll tell you Sunday."
by Son of a Newton on Dec 18, 2011 7:49 PM EST reply actions
Rivera mentioned Armanti in yesterday's Presser!!!
There was a question on Steve Smith answering to which Rivera mentioned something like “Armanti is learning his position, we will see and hope he develops into a valuable WR for us by next year”.
I am pretty sure AE will be on the roster next year. How he does in the preseason next year will decide his future.
Being that he is young and new to the position he will be given more leeway with his production
I think they will keep him along to see how he develops. However next year may be his last chance to show that he can be an asset
Precisely, Next year will probably be his last shot to make an impact on the team
Seeing as its the last year of his contract.
Cam Newton, when a reporter asks him who will win the Heisman Trophy on Saturday: "I'll tell you Sunday."
by Son of a Newton on Dec 20, 2011 7:46 PM EST up reply actions
My bad, I did the math wrong :^)
But I still think next year is his last shot.
Cam Newton, when a reporter asks him who will win the Heisman Trophy on Saturday: "I'll tell you Sunday."
by Son of a Newton on Dec 20, 2011 10:10 PM EST up reply actions
I'm not sure, I was under the impression that he was.
I will require clarification on this.
Cam Newton, when a reporter asks him who will win the Heisman Trophy on Saturday: "I'll tell you Sunday."
by Son of a Newton on Dec 19, 2011 5:41 PM EST up reply actions
Some of these players would be stupid to get rid of
Otah is a great player when he’s healty and i suspect that he was put on IR so he could fully heal up, because he was healthy enough to play at the time. besides, he is only making 1 mil, so it doesnt hurt us to keep him, even if only as a back-up. Edwards is a project player. Most WRs dont break out until their 3rd year plus he is new to the position so it may take longer, at any rate, he isnt getting paid much either so we can hold on to him for a while. Davis does have injuries concerns but he is a great player when healthy, a great leader, and a teacher. He is worth keeping around even if he doesnt play regularly, especially since he is willing toi renegotiate his contract. Goodson is yet another player that isnt being paid much and he is about as good as they come for a #3 RB, plus he is a good returner and a good 3rd down back.
Think the boat has sailed for Goodson!!!
With Pilares handling Kick returns and J.Stew doing a pretty good job of catching on 3rd down, I guess Goodson is expendable now. If I remember correctly, he was benched by Rivera even before going on IR. Out of the 5 mentioned above, I believe Goodson is the least likely to be on the roster next year.
But when your on-field opportunities are limited, it’s because you haven’t shown enough in practice to warrant those opportunities.
Seems kind of contradictory seeing as how the first player you listed only got a chance to play because we have four LB’s on IR (5 if you include Omar Gaither who has been in & out all season). He may not have had many other opportunities yet because LA & Lafell have played well. Maybe next week against TB, maybe not until next August but we’ll get a good opportunity to evaluate AE & if he isn’t good enough than RR has showed us he has no problem with cutting players that don’t produce.
"One step at a time"
Seems kind of contradictory seeing as how the first player you listed only got a chance to play because we have four LB’s on IR
I guess all of our receivers have to get hurt for us to see if AE is worth a damn.
"Buy the ticket, take the ride" ~ Hunter S. Thompson
by SwankTheTank on Dec 18, 2011 11:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Hey, I'm just pointing out
That sometimes depth players don’t get an opportunity not because their not any good but because the guys in front of them have had more game time experience and coaches would rather use what they know than toss something unknown in there. Laurent Robinson & Victor Cruz are other great WR examples (not that I’m insinuating AE’s production will be the same).
No, all of our receivers do not have to get hurt for him to get a chance. AE’s is the #4 WR behind Naanee and Lafell. One guy they brought in to start & the other they drafted just before Armanti who already had several years of playing his position under his belt. It’s going to be tough for him to get some PT when we already know (and are happy) with the production we get out of three guys in front of him and our offense rarely uses 4WR sets….. When they do, our very mobile pass-catching TE Greg Olsen becomes the 4th WR.
I understand it’s frustrating for some people that we spent such a high pick on the guy (though I do wonder why people aren’t consistently trashing Jimmy Clausen… Maybe it’s because his supporters have given up) but he had to switch positions from QB to WR and it’s not like he just tossed his hands up and said F it. He works really hard and the coaches always mention it. Just be fair in your evaluation and give it time. He needs time to learn the position and an opportunity to show what we he can do.
Wow that was a long post. Otherwise, good article. I would agree with what I saw others say that weighing Otah & TD’s contracts (assuming TD restructures) they shouldn’t be cut. The reward is too high for players of their caliber.
"One step at a time"
Yeah i agree with the above..
I’d also cut Omar Gaither he is dirt. To be honest, If we could get a really nice corner out of the draft or through trade or FA, I’d cut Butler as well.
Oh i forgot...
Jordan Pugh. I SMH everytime he comes on the field. Get him out of here. We need a Safety with size, at least 6-3. I wonder who will be the starting LB’s next year?
I'd take Butler over Thomas any day.
I don't always fail, but when I do...
I do it awesomely.
by BusyBeingAwesome on Dec 19, 2011 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
Hmm...
If you’re going to cut a corner, why wouldn’t you cut the 4th stringer or the one that never plays?
I cant tell if he is being sarcastic or dumb
But it doesnt make since to keep Thomas and Stanford and cut Butler. If we get a new CB i would like to have Gamble, New CB, Hogan, Munnerlyn, and Butler.
Gaither was one of the best LB's for Philly two years ago...
He’s dealt with injuries, yet he provides good depth to our LB corps. I say that the FO keeps him around.
Cam Newton, when a reporter asks him who will win the Heisman Trophy on Saturday: "I'll tell you Sunday."
by Son of a Newton on Dec 19, 2011 5:44 PM EST up reply actions
To Me It's Just Crazy To Talk About Cutting Players, When They Might Have Even Minimal Trade Value
Some of the players mintioned have some trade value, and to just cut them is like throwing away money. They may not have high trade value, but anything you could get for them in trade is better than getting nothing by just cutting them.
RB Mike Goodson had a 4.4 YPC, on over 100 rushing attempts, with 40 catches in 2010. He’s a very good 3rd down, and backup RB (he would be a perfect backup for Matt Forte), and might be worth a 4th or 5th round pick in the 2012 draft.
OT Jeff Otah is damaged goods, but for what he once was, he should be worth a conditional draft pick in 2013 (a 6th or 7th round pick that could move up a round or 2).
S Jordan Pugh, he’s only in his 2nd year, still learing, and with only 3 S’s, you really need to add at least 2 more before you start thinking of cutting 1.
This isn’t some small “Mom n Pop” burger joint where you fire a dishwasher, and just grab another off the street people!
Agreed.
Especially on Otah. Hopefully, he can stay healthy in ’12.
by RonnieHawkins97 on Dec 19, 2011 6:30 PM EST up reply actions
Alright... Stupid idea's.
I’ll use the “because I got high” defense in all this.
"Buy the ticket, take the ride" ~ Hunter S. Thompson
Nah man
It was a good idea & good post (I do think some of the departures are a bit premature). I definitely agree with the first 2 guys on your keepers list. It also shows our organizations ability to evaluate talent and find guys who give 110%. I’d say you should add Byron Bell to that list too. Some people aren’t impressed but considering he was an UDFA and his two biggest knocks are speed rushers (getting beat to the outside) & false starts I think he’s been terrific. Both of those things are things he can learn and improve too.
"One step at a time"
I like Byron Bell!!!
I know, he hasn’t been great. However, he has helped us cope as best as possible for the ever injured Otah. I believe he is a keeper, especially because he can also be used at Guard if needed.
He is good for a UDFA
But he isnt a reliable starter at this point. He is a decent back up but thats all that we could fairly expect from someone that went undrafted.
A decent (versatile) backup who is a keeper!!!
With the progress he has gained over this year and the experience he has gained. He has to be a keeper for next year. We can let go of folks like Bernadeau and keep Bell.
He's only a rookie
I think Bell has been playing way above expectations, for any rookie.
Is he a pro-bowler? No, and he may never be.
But to think that he’s already hit his ceiling after one year of playing professional football is really premature.
I'm not saying he's terrible or anything
I’m just saying that you need to manage expectations and realize that he is far below average for a starter at this point
I don't know that I'd say "far" below average.
This time of year many teams have rookies and the like starting in key spots. I’d say he’s in the bottom third of starting RTs.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
For a rookie
without any off-season work I think he’s done well. Definitely still needs a lot of work to be a reliable starter but I guess the point I’m making is that I think that’s an attainable goal. His two biggest faults are false starts & lateral movement (speed rushers). False starts can definitely be worked on and I think he could learn to play smart and play to his strengths to handle those speed rushers.
I agree he is not the ideal RT right now but I think he’s getting better and whether it’s as a back-up or starting G or T he will be important to our team and valuable moving forward.
"One step at a time"
I think Hangartner, Shockey, and Davis will be willing to come back at a discount.
Hangartner loves it here… told his agent to call Hurney as soon as he got released.
Davis is on record as wanting to retire a Panther.
Shockey really wants to be a part of what we all think is a growing powerhouse.
Nanu has helped us a lot, but if he gets a better offer, good for him.
Senn is proving he’s a player to keep. I hope other teams haven’t noticed (yeah, right).
AE and Otah are keepers unless there’s something we don’t know. AE for potential, Otah for pure bulldozing RT (with injury issues, but still cheap)
So much to be done, and so few people willing to do it for me.
I wouldn't be bringing TD back.
I love the guy, but it’s simply time to move on from him. Enough is enough, find a guy that can fill his role and stay healthy in the process.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Dec 20, 2011 8:19 PM EST up reply actions
Nope
Too big of an injury risk. Bring in somebody we can trust to stay healthy.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Dec 20, 2011 8:32 PM EST up reply actions
I think thats dumb
Not only is he a great player but he has added value for being a leader and teacher. I would be trying very hard to bring him back
You're certainly entitled to your opinion
However I think it’s ridiculous to expect him to contribute anything and I wouldn’t pay a guy to sit on IR. If he’s such a good leader and a teacher, offer him a job as an assistant LB coach.
It’s just like Bob Sanders. Sure, he’s a great player when he’s healthy, but when is that? Give me an average player that’ll play 16 games over a great player that’s going to leave you high and dry after a few games.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Dec 20, 2011 9:21 PM EST up reply actions
No, I wouldn't. I just said that.
It’d be throwing away money. He’s torn his ACL THREE TIMES. He’s played in nine games over the past three seasons, and seven of those came in 2009. I love the guy and appreciate the hell out of what he’s done, but I wouldn’t be paying somebody to sit on IR.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Dec 20, 2011 9:19 PM EST up reply actions
Get rid of TD. Im so siiiick of hearing about this dude. Hey he's not that good...
This fool is always broke down. Move on! Get off the sideline. Go Home
Actually, he's a fantastic LB
An absolute playmaker on defense capable of covering from sideline to sideline, and an emotional leader in the locker room.
He just can’t stay healthy.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Dec 21, 2011 10:11 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
I'm sure he's sorry that his presence on the sidleline bothers you so much.
I like to think of myself as a one-man wolfpack.
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