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SI's Trotter Gives Newton #5 QB Midseason Rank

So the amazing rookie season of Panthers QB Cam Newton continues to build with more accolades. This time it's a midseason QB ranking by Sports Illustrated's Jim Trotter:

5. Cam Newton, Panthers: No offseason workouts, no contact with his coaches pre-training camp, no problem. He has thrown for 2,393 yards, 11 touchdowns, nine picks and rushed for seven scores. His team, which threw for just nine TDs last season, has only two wins, but his play has been impressive considering all the things working against him, including an injury-weakened defense.

I pretty good assessment I would say. Trotter places Newton in the same company as Aaron Rodgers (1), Tom Brady (3) and Big Ben (2). That puts Newton above veteran QBs like Drew Brees (7),  Eli Manning (8) and Mike Vick (10).

Do you think he deserves the ranking?

Hat tip to Goose Creek for being the first to post on this via fanshot.

Comment 153 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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Yep he deserves it no doubt. Definitely a top 5 QB

by PantherTrain on Nov 8, 2011 9:33 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

I. don’t. know. but I suppose it does if this is an analogy for yes…right?

Iranian Air Defense Site: 'Unknown aircraft you are in Iranian airspace. Identify yourself.'
Aircraft: 'This is a United States aircraft. I am in Iraqi airspace.'
Air Defense Site: 'You are in Iranian airspace. If you do not depart our airspace we will launch interceptor aircraft!'
Aircraft: 'This is a United States Marine Corps FA-18 fighter. Send 'em up, I'll wait!'
Air Defense Site: (... total silence)

by Tarheel Soldier on Nov 8, 2011 10:58 AM EST up reply actions  

Can't fault you for keepin' it fresh.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:14 AM EST up reply actions  

TWSS

"Nobody wants to cheer for a loser". Cam Newton 2011

by MrBernz on Nov 8, 2011 11:43 AM EST up reply actions  

This would also be an acceptable answer.

And there’s always my personal favorite, which I’ve already used a time or two:

Does a one-legged duck swim in a circle?

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 8, 2011 12:32 PM EST up reply actions  

My favorite (that also rhymes):

Do monkeys fling poo at the zoo?

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 12:37 PM EST up reply actions  

It really is better when it rhymes.

(They also like to m______bate at inappropriate times.)

True, unfortunate story.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 8, 2011 12:41 PM EST up reply actions  

LOL.

So much to be done, and so few people willing to do it for me.

by Rick Bates on Nov 8, 2011 12:54 PM EST up reply actions  

LOL

Perfectly executed.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 8, 2011 12:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed - excellent execution.

I had to rec that, BW. =)

Yep. I'm a female who religiously follows a football blog.

"When you get into coaching, you strive to be a Super Bowl-winning head coach. That’s what my goal is, to come here and become a Super Bowl-winning head coach and to sustain an atmosphere of winning." - Ron Rivera

by jamiedk on Nov 8, 2011 2:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Aww shucks...thanks. :-)

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 3:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Too early to have him as a top 5 QB, would rather have him earn top 5 selection

thru wins. Which hopefully will come in the near future, talk about a waisted year with shitty defense/special teams. Always came a play or 2 from winning.

by adam carter on Nov 8, 2011 9:41 AM EST reply actions  

I think he has earned his ranking.

You can’t place the losses all on his shoulders. He could throw for 500 yards and 5 touchdowns but if our defense cant stop the other team we will still lose. This is a qb ranking not a team ranking.

"Nobody wants to cheer for a loser". Cam Newton 2011

by MrBernz on Nov 8, 2011 9:54 AM EST up reply actions  

There are a couple he deserve partial blame for

But even in those, fact remains that if we had better defense and special teams play, they could have made up for his mistakes.

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by Tater596 on Nov 8, 2011 11:11 AM EST up reply actions  

Experience is NEVER a waste...

she may be brutal, and unfair, but never a waste.

by toonman on Nov 8, 2011 10:12 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

The ranking is not for W/Ls

The ranking is for individual productivity, otherwise people like Dalton and Flacco would appear.

by qdog112 on Nov 8, 2011 2:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes, for all the reasons cited by Trotter... rookie, no off-season with team...

and the new coaching staff impacts the entire team, and therefore also affects Cam. Add that to the fact that the offense sucked last year - YES, he deserves it.

So much to be done, and so few people willing to do it for me.

by Rick Bates on Nov 8, 2011 9:49 AM EST reply actions  

Yes I think he deserves that rating

very good assessment by Trotter. I just think that Brees should be one ahead of Newton though…

by mlrupert on Nov 8, 2011 9:51 AM EST reply actions  

I love Cam, but ahead of Brees? Not yet.

He definitely deserves more credit though.

Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing you will be an idiot in the future and common sense is knowing you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques

I don't always dress like a pirate...but when I do, I do it in this picture.

by Vagus on Nov 8, 2011 9:54 AM EST reply actions  

I'd be inclined to agree...

Personally, I feel like Cam is probably a top 10 QB right now, but if he keeps it up, will easily sneak into the top 5.

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by Tater596 on Nov 8, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions  

Agree with the sentiments above on Brees being ranked too low

How’s Big Ben ranked 2? He’s having a pretty down year it seems, though admittedly, I do not follow the Steelers much.

At least Andy Dalton isn’t in there.

by Beny on Nov 8, 2011 9:59 AM EST reply actions  

Big Ben is having by far his best season yet

One of my roommates is unfortunately a big steelers fan so i get to keep up with them quite a bit more than i would like

by mlrupert on Nov 8, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Not Yet

I love Cam (pause) just like all Panthers fans, but he ain’t better than Drew Brees……yet!

by richyNC83 on Nov 8, 2011 10:06 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

I think some of you are just basing it off this years performance.

 Sure he may not be as good as Brees yet, but for Newton to be a rookie and right there with Brees says a lot. Like this article says, Newton had no contact with the coaches till after the lock out while Brees has been with his offense and coaches for how long? Teams like the Saints got to come off the lock out and back with their team they always had. If you factor in all that, I think it definitely puts Newton up in the top, I wouldn’t try to rank an exact order though.

"Nobody wants to cheer for a loser". Cam Newton 2011

by MrBernz on Nov 8, 2011 10:15 AM EST reply actions  

Deserved and then some

As much bashing as he took prior to being drafted, then all the J. Russell comparisions, etc…Yeah he’s deserved it. He has proven everyone wrong and I’m excited for him. We will be playoff contenders every year starting next year for the next 7-8 years easily. Big names will want to come to Carolina to play with Cam. BAMF is a genius and it’s a matter of time before we win a ring.

Dear Baby Jesus in your golden diaper..thank you for making the number 89. Amen.

by Saul Good on Nov 8, 2011 10:31 AM EST reply actions  

Hells Yeah

I am the WAMMA Light-Heavyweight Champion

Now with more defenses than Fedor

by Reality_Jockey on Nov 8, 2011 10:33 AM EST reply actions  

This article lost all credibility with Ben at 2

http://twitter.com/#!/TheeSteveJohns
https://www.facebook.com/TheeSteveJohnson

by Thee Steve Johnson on Nov 8, 2011 10:41 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

Ben's having a pretty good year though.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 10:43 AM EST up reply actions  

It has to be the Pit win over the Pats

Brady has better QB rating, more TDs, and fewer turnovers then Ben, but has one more loss and it was to Ben. Honestly I’d put those two at 2a and 2b this season.

"I kinda just sling it" -Jake

by bleed_in_blue on Nov 8, 2011 11:01 AM EST up reply actions  

I don't know that it is that far off.

My feelings is the rankings should be Rogers #1 and then Brady #2. Then you have the group of Roethlisberger, Fitzpatrick, Brees, and Newton thrown together at #3 thru #6. They all have defendable reasons to be picked at #3 but they play with different talents so their worth is dependent on the systems and traits being prized.

"I may be old but...eh, I forget the rest!"

by GooseCreek on Nov 8, 2011 11:03 AM EST up reply actions  

Think about this way.

Instead of stats and past history dictating where you fall on the list. Right now, if any given football fan, from any where in the nation was asked , list for me in order of preference , which QB you would like to see play this Sunday, from the comfort of your home in front of your big screen HD tv , I would say he easily is in the top 3 right now. He is exciting and has a lot of national appeal and intrigue around him, and I believe the nation wants to see what he can do and what he will do next.

I like collard greens.

by Bruce Guild on Nov 8, 2011 10:44 AM EST reply actions  

the most exciting player to watch in nfl right now

and he’s chasing history with his performance each week. enough said.

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by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 10:57 AM EST reply actions  

i agree

Cam is by far most exciting, but let’s be real….Drew gotta ring! Cam will be there soon, but let’s not get ahead of ourselves…he a rookie!

by richyNC83 on Nov 8, 2011 11:00 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

What does Drew's SB ring have to do with the first half of THIS season?

This is the 2011 mid-season rankings, not all time rankings of current players.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:16 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

troll, go away

Iranian Air Defense Site: 'Unknown aircraft you are in Iranian airspace. Identify yourself.'
Aircraft: 'This is a United States aircraft. I am in Iraqi airspace.'
Air Defense Site: 'You are in Iranian airspace. If you do not depart our airspace we will launch interceptor aircraft!'
Aircraft: 'This is a United States Marine Corps FA-18 fighter. Send 'em up, I'll wait!'
Air Defense Site: (... total silence)

by Tarheel Soldier on Nov 8, 2011 11:05 AM EST up reply actions  

Sarcasm right? Dalton looks good bc of an amazing defense, doesn't have close to the #s of Cam

I hate your team but you better beat Georgia.

"What up? We're three cool guys looking for other cool guys who wanna hang out in our party mansion. Nothing sexual. Dudes in good shape encouraged. If you're fat, you should be able to find humor in the little things." Again, NOTHING SEXUAL

"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.

you guys are like a bunch of pirahnas
by chop goes da weazel on Mar 31, 2011 12:32 PM PDT

by MikeTrain on Nov 8, 2011 11:06 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I actually hope Georgia wins the East.

I’d rather the ’Cocks win out and go 10-2 than get destroyed by LSU and go 10-3 and lose out on a better bowl game.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:17 AM EST up reply actions  

my brain just exploded

could you explain why you would put red rifle ahead of superman-primetime-cam newton based on quarterback performance? lets take a deep breath and forget that bengals have much better defense than we do. let’s start with how many TDs each QBs have and the yards thrown.

Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
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by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:06 AM EST up reply actions  

If we go by TDs

I guess edge goes to….Dalton.

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 11:19 AM EST up reply actions  

Apparently not...

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:22 AM EST up reply actions  

You're right

I wasn’t thinking about that

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 11:23 AM EST up reply actions  

Dalton has one rushing TD.

But if we look at both their TD totals, Cam leads by five, I believe.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 8, 2011 11:23 AM EST up reply actions  

And not all of them the "1 yard plunge" variety

Cam has had a few of them from distances of 5-20

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by Tater596 on Nov 8, 2011 11:26 AM EST up reply actions  

his kinds aint welcome here...

Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
a.k.a. DeAngelo Williams in the stalking business- agile and elusive

by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:25 AM EST up reply actions  

x

"Nobody wants to cheer for a loser". Cam Newton 2011

by MrBernz on Nov 8, 2011 11:55 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Yes obviously so

My first posting here and I don’t often read many comments. But I feel so welcome…

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 11:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Bad time to put Dalton above Cam

Fresh off the incredible rookie of the month snub

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by Tater596 on Nov 8, 2011 11:27 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

you're welcome to post

but if you post about Dalton playing better than Cam, you have to be ready for war. Not only are there hardcore Panthers fan here, these guys breath football.. so you have to have some solid reasoning behind what you say

Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
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by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:30 AM EST up reply actions  

breathe**

typing on my ipad while having a heart attack this morning

Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
a.k.a. DeAngelo Williams in the stalking business- agile and elusive

by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:33 AM EST up reply actions  

Why?

Dalton is a good fit for what they do. He’s got a quick release and throws the short to intermediate passes well. With a solid D and good run game, he does OK. Not to mention a big fast – go and get it WR, in Green.

Cam and Dalton don’t have a lot in common, outside of being rookies. If you traded spots, Cam throwing to Green might mean crazy records. Some of the passes he threw to Steve, might have been snatched. Maybe he’d have 20 TD passes by now or fewer rushing.

For Chud’s offense, I’ll stick with our rocket launcher.

by qdog112 on Nov 8, 2011 2:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Was this in reply to my comment?

I was talking about the article a couple days ago about Andy Dalton winning Rookie of the month over Cam, and how that is bullshit.

Not sure what you are saying, to be honest.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 8, 2011 2:54 PM EST up reply actions  

so dalton has more TDs than Dalton?

really? i guess someone other than Cam is setting records for rushing TD as well.

Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
a.k.a. DeAngelo Williams in the stalking business- agile and elusive

by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:21 AM EST up reply actions  

wow brain just exploded.. i cant even type anymore

Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
a.k.a. DeAngelo Williams in the stalking business- agile and elusive

by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:22 AM EST up reply actions  

Cam has a higher QB Rating, more passing yards, and more TD's (rushing counts too), than Dalton.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:24 AM EST up reply actions  

You suck actually

"What up? We're three cool guys looking for other cool guys who wanna hang out in our party mansion. Nothing sexual. Dudes in good shape encouraged. If you're fat, you should be able to find humor in the little things." Again, NOTHING SEXUAL

"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.

you guys are like a bunch of pirahnas
by chop goes da weazel on Mar 31, 2011 12:32 PM PDT

by MikeTrain on Nov 8, 2011 11:06 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

sorry but you have a better chance at ROY in AJ Green

but i will put your Dalton ahead of Curtis Painter

Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
a.k.a. DeAngelo Williams in the stalking business- agile and elusive

by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions  

Please use the sarcasm font when making clearly outrageous statements

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by Tater596 on Nov 8, 2011 11:14 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Haha wow I'm not a troll

I’m still just not completely happy with Cam. The interceptions at inopportune times in inopportune places doesn’t make him top 10 for me yet. He has impressed me more and more each week though, so its only a matter of time.

But I guess i’ll save my opinion until it matches up with everyone elses

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 11:15 AM EST up reply actions  

While I can respect your position as stated in the first half of this comment...

You can’t say that he should be ranked below Dalton. Come on man…Dalton is riding the coat tails of a top-5 defense. He’s Trent Dilfer re-born as a ginger. He’s a game manager who will win if he has a good defense to bail him out, which is what he’s got this year.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:18 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

HAHAHAHA "Trent Dilfer re-born as a ginger"

Thanks for making me almost spit out my drink BW

by mlrupert on Nov 8, 2011 12:07 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm glad someone appreciated that. I worked hard on that one-liner.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 12:09 PM EST up reply actions  

For anyone that knows football you understand Cam is fighting a up hill battle...

What team in the HISTORY of the NFL.. the HISTORY has EVER won with a struggling defence and a rookie quarterback?.. if you dont’ understand the depth of that then it is nothing else to be said to those that don’t

Put it this way .. i have watched both closely.. and with the Bengals down 17 to 7 in the 2nd half the Bengels went 3 and out 3 straight times…. Cam Newton can NOT afford that luxury. He can’t not vs the schedule the Panthers have played… if you go 3 and out 3 straight times vs the Packers or the Saints or the Bears down 17 to 7 your gonna get blown out… To Newtons credit even with a defence that is struggling he is playing well.

As a quarterback you know that if your defence is stuggling you have to be perfect… and ONLY a few quarterbacks in the NFL can do it and they are HOF material quarterbacks…

Better yet when it is 3rd and 8 and you have to throw it away and let you defence get the ball back… Is that really a realistic option for Newton after watching this injury riddled defence get rolled in some games?….

No one in their right mind that has any clue about football can tell me a team with a struggling defence and a rookie quarterback is a good formula… and attaching a teams overall success to someone giving them too much credit…. just like attaching a teams overall failure to someone is attaching too much blame…. the truth is Newton himself has played better than Dalton….and Dalton would not be able to carry the Panthers the way Newton is…. further more the Bengals would likely be 8 and 0 with Newton directing them….. Most rookie quarterbacks you hide them with play calling…where is Newton is the center piece…the driving force….Dalton is VERY good yet his greatest skill set is playing within himself….. But no one will admit it till after Dalton plays better teams… i still say that when the best team you have faced is Buffalo you can’t get to high… best quarterback that you have faced is Fitzpatrick…. we will see what happens when he has to match point for point with a team that has a quarterback… …. Titans had 5 drives that net 8 yards or less in the 2nd half Sunday….sigh

by Shankdiddy on Nov 8, 2011 12:41 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

spelling nazi alert

Defense, not Defence

Would have let it slide, but you did it more than once.

by Beny on Nov 8, 2011 12:45 PM EST up reply actions  

I suppose you think color is spelled colour too, Mr. GMT+0

by ppalm on Nov 9, 2011 8:43 AM EST up reply actions  

colour, centre and damn it its an aubergine not an eggplant!!!!

If I knew how to do the sarcasm font I would also add… Stop destroying our language!!!!

Save us Pilares

by LimeyPanther on Nov 9, 2011 12:21 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Only the stuff that is confusing gets changed. Like ‘centre’ for example…

Is it a cent-tree? No, its a cent-ter.

Americans had a chance to take all the weird words that don’t make any frenetic sense and change them. It also makes learning the language easier.

Now, as for all the text message speak and what not…I don’t like it any more than you. The standards for the way people communicate in writing have taken a steep nose-dive with the invention of the interwebs and cell phones. But I’m just hating, and “H8terz got 2 h8!”

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 9, 2011 12:33 PM EST up reply actions  

Phonetic?

"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury

by OldhamA on Nov 9, 2011 3:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Ok that.

Subject line does not spell check.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 9, 2011 3:08 PM EST up reply actions  

Perhaps this software program will help you...

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 9, 2011 3:41 PM EST up reply actions  

LOL

I would buy that if it really existed.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 9, 2011 3:43 PM EST up reply actions  

We won the war...it's our language now, bitch.

(kidding, of course)

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 9, 2011 1:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Get out of my brain Shank. Get out of my brain. :-)

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 12:48 PM EST up reply actions  

I just don't see how you could possible rank Dalton ahead of Cam

That just isn’t even close to right.

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by Tater596 on Nov 8, 2011 11:18 AM EST up reply actions  

There is a really good argument for having Cam above Dalton

And I definitely think Cam will be ROY. Within the next few weeks both of those things will probably be solidified in my mind and Cam will move up in my perception of him

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 11:22 AM EST up reply actions  

You're right....there is.

But there’s not a really good argument for having Dalton above Cam, and that’s the problem.

You can’t say “well Cincy is 6-2 and Carolina is 2-6”. It doesn’t work like that. Cincy has a top-5 defense, and Carolina has a bottom-5 defense. If you switch places b/w the two QB’s, Cincy is 6-2 or better, and Carolina is 2-6 or worse. I don’t think Dalton would have 2 wins with Carolina’s defense, and I think Cam would be undefeated with Cincy’s defense.

Plus, you have to look at strength of schedule. Cincy has played Cleveland, Denver, Seattle, Indianapolis, and Jacksonville. Carolina has played Green Bay, Chicago, New Orleans, and Atlanta. Huge difference in total talent that both teams have faced so far this year.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:28 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Well the wins is where my opinion stems mostly from at this point

But like I said, the second half of the season will settle this

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions  

+1

cincy has 4th best defense in the league. 2nd in run defense last time i checked. their offense is somewhere in the 20s. but to give where the credit is due, marvin lewis has done a fabulous job coaching this youn cincy team

Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
a.k.a. DeAngelo Williams in the stalking business- agile and elusive

by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions  

not to be rude

but would you include alex smith as one of the elite quarterbacks in the league, or let alone being one of the best quarterbacks playing this season bc the 49ers have more wins so far? would you put alex smith ahead of drew brees, tom brady pr big ben?

Cat Scratch Reader's not-so-creepy stalker
a.k.a. DeAngelo Williams in the stalking business- agile and elusive

by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:44 AM EST up reply actions  

Also Note this Auburndawg

The Panthers have had leads vs the Packers and Saints all of which Newton provided and the defence could not hold….

Just in this last game the Bengals down 17 to 7 did not STORM back offensively… they went 3 and out 3 times in a row. The Bengal defence kept it from getting out of hand…. by holding the Titans to 5 drives in the 2nd half of 8 yards of less… ARE YOU KIDDING ME LOL.?!……… That is like a free throw shooter getting 4 extra shots to make 2 free throws.. You provide the offence with chance after chance to get going….a Luxury Newton doesn’t have…. if the Panthers go 3 and out down by 10 at ANY POINT during this season they are gonna get behind by alot more…..

by Shankdiddy on Nov 8, 2011 12:50 PM EST up reply actions  

He's a rookie

They tend to make inopportune turnovers. That’s how it is. It’s the incredible amount of good that Cam has produced that’s so incredible.

"Excuses are a disease." -Cam Newton

by Smitty89 on Nov 8, 2011 11:32 AM EST up reply actions  

AubDawg,

You’re gonna get called a troll for saying “Dalton’s better than Cam”. If you were to say “Dalton’s better than Cam and here’s my legitimate reasoning/stats to explain” you’ll have a debate.

by Swamp Panther on Nov 8, 2011 11:36 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

So if I say I would Cam 1 spot ahead of Dalton

Do I get save myself from being attacked by the masses?

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 11:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Depends on where you put them.

If you say Cam is #1 and Dalton is #2, probably not.

But, if you say Cam is #31 and Dalton is #32, probably so. :-)

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:46 AM EST up reply actions  

I think Swamp P's point is the way you present the statement.

This blog is fair, but in exchange for that fairness it demands supporting arguments for your statements. You’re quite welcome to argue that strawberry milk is better than chocolate milk, but you had better have the stats to prove it, and you’d better be prepared to defend it against the chocolate lovers who’ve been watching the chocolate vs strawberry performance charts for the past decade.

Good luck! I mostly sit back and watch.

by Floods on Nov 8, 2011 12:47 PM EST up reply actions  

I see what you did there.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 12:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Okay so if I could delete a post, I really would. Wow just wow.

But I do have to say that I did have a temporary mental collapse and completely forgot Cam’s rushing stats this year. For that I apologize to all affected peoples on CSR.

With that in mind, I would like to redact my post from everyone’s minds and say I would put Cam at 10 probably, right behind Stafford

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 11:47 AM EST up reply actions  

you're fine

it’s as if i were to go to the cincy forum and letting the fans know that the panthers are better than cincy without solid reasoning. there’s a difference between debating and trolling, and not that you were trolling, it came out that way, but welcome!

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by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 11:57 AM EST up reply actions  

i am a die hard lions fan.. i have not missed a play since 1989

But i am not a homer fan.. and with all honesty Stafford is NOT in the same league as Newton. Stafford had his 422 yard passing game in week 10 of his rookie year… and a few games of 4 int… 20 overall…. and 2 games won.

And skill set wise Newton is superior (homer fans will argue that)

I can honestly say if Newton played With Megatron this year the Lions bet Green Bay and have a real chance to win the Superbowl…..Not saying Stafford is bad. Because i think he is great.. but if you can’t tell what is happening in Carolina i dunno what to say.. i am a bit Jealous in that regard because i know Detroit needs to have pieces to really help Stafford … Stafford is a 40 TD year type quarterback…But Newton is special… and the Panthers players sense it… right down to how calm he is in the pocket..and every offensive player can sense that and feeds off of it… his physical condition is the level of skill position players.. You never see his name on a injury report… I love Stafford but Newton is past him from what i see.

by Shankdiddy on Nov 8, 2011 1:13 PM EST up reply actions  

I am not as big into the NFL as most people here

And I haven’t gotten to watch all of the Panther’s games this season. So I guess most of my opinion of Cam is just my residual feelings of him left over from college.

He really is a great player this season so far, and far better than I ever could have imagined him being. He could be the next “great one,” for all I know. A couple of things count against him in my mind though: 1) I am still not a fan of running QBs (although he is obviously producing as well, yardage and TD-wise, as any strictly passing quaterback), 2) He makes really poor decisions throwing the ball quite often. Now anyone can look at those 2 arguments and pick them apart.

Say for #1- “Look at his rushing stats, they’re so high, no one can find an answer for him, plus he is throwing at a record-rate! You can’t beat that.” I just prefer pocket-passers is all I can say. My main gripe with him is my 2nd point, at which point you might say- “He’s only a rookie, he’ll get better.” To which I would respond, well yes but so far this year I just think Cam has made really poor decisions. Most of his interceptions are very clearly horrible decisions by him and I think he just terribly overthrows a lot of balls, which has been a problem of his since college. Avoiding those mistakes keeps our horrible D off the field as much, which is what he excelled at in college. At Auburn, he would step into a game and dominate the field, his defense wasn’t good at stepping up, but it was okay because Cam would keep his offense on the field. I just don’t think has that ability in the NFL yet.

I’ll give it to everyone, he has been better than Dalton, and me saying otherwise probably had more to do with my feelings toward Cam the person than him as a player. So I would have to say that I agree that Cam as a player really is a top 10 QB so far, I would probably put him right at #10, right ahead of Dalton. Cam will probably continue to develop, and I don’t doubt that he could still move up a few slots in my mental rankings as the season progressed.

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 2:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Well, honestly AD...

When I read this:

And I haven’t gotten to watch all of the Panther’s games this season.

I kinda matches up with the rest of your comment. Because Cam has been very accurate, particularly down-field. And he has made good decisions with the ball. Several of his INTs could have gone either way, and two were just barely tipped, and looked to be completed if not for the tip (one would have been a TD to Smith.)

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 8, 2011 2:29 PM EST up reply actions  

I was just about to comment on the same thing.

Three of his INTs were great plays by GB’s defense, and two others were great plays by ATL’s defense. That’s 5 of his picks right there that were great plays by the defense. Also, at least one of his INT’s was on a hail mary (which IMO should count separately).

I’ll admit he’s made some bad decisions and bad throws, but it’s not as bad as the stats show.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 2:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Alright

Your right. I have no idea what I’m talking about

by AuburnDawg on Nov 8, 2011 3:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Now don't do that.

Aw. C’mon, man.

If you haven’t had a chance to watch all the Panthers’ games because of geographical reasons, I would strongly advise you to invest in NFL.com’s Game Rewind. Its totally worth it.

War damn Eagle.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 8, 2011 3:52 PM EST up reply actions  

) I am still not a fan of running QBs (although he is obviously producing as well, yardage and TD-wise, as any strictly passing quaterback), 2) He makes really poor decisions throwing the ball quite often. Now anyone can look at those 2 arguments and pick them apart.

for one AuburnDawg your another person that falls prey to perception and NOT REALITY!!!!

1. You call Newton a running quarterback (the very context of that kinda makes me >> sigh). But like most fans that don’t look at facts (something i had to break down over and over and over) check out these UNDENIABLE FACTS!!!!!

- A Cam Newton has rush 63 times this year…. of those 63 attempts 24 of them are scrambles. The rest of his 39 rushes this year are designed run plays. The very context of why people refer to quarterbacks as running quarterbacks is to accociate decision making…. to frame him as a “i don’t see anything i am out of here.”… and in that regard he has done that 24 times…. YET the guy who won the SUPER BOWL last year has only 37 rushes through 8 games yet 36 of his 37 rushes are SCRAMBLES!!!!!!!…..Now wrap your brain around that for a moment. AuburnDawg so you mean to say you don’t like Aaron Rodgeres because as you can see through 8 games he has scrambled 13 MORE times than Cam Newton….. sigh perception doesn’t meet reality

- Through 9 games Cam Newton has 9 interceptions… 6 of them have been in 2 games vs Green bay and Atlanta….. 3 games he has had zero interceptions (not bad learning curve for a rookie)… And by the way with any down field passing game you will have more int than a dink and dunk west coast style offence. ….considering he has a 60% comp % You can’t really measure a rookie right now and frame them as having a “questionable decision making” after 8 games…. the Newton you see now is likely NOT the same player you will see later in the season and moving forward…. i don’t see trends that cause me to believe that it is nothing more than acclimation to the pro game.

so this thought that he is a “running quarterback” in the sense that many try to frame it….is not accurate. As his career moves forward likely alot of the designed run plays will be reduced. And anyone that says that a quarterback that has the ability to run is a bad things needs to realize the difference. You gonna take your Truck back too the dealer because it can go off road. …. your not gonna ask for your money back if your product has more features for the price lol.. Being “able to run” is NOT a negative. That is a separate issue from not being able to pass.

by Shankdiddy on Nov 8, 2011 4:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Again, diddy, you are an excellent evaluator.

Great point about Rodgers taking off and running more than Cam.

Cam already looks like a polished pocket passer. And no one throws deep more often or more successfully than Newton. And only Rodgers, Brady and Manning have a higher yards per attempt—which some think is the ultimate measure of a QB.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 8, 2011 4:39 PM EST up reply actions  

which some think is the ultimate measure of a QB.

We all know this isn't true. It's all about the wins baby.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 5:21 PM EST up reply actions  

cam is not a "running qb" you accuse him to be

again, like what ERL said, watch the games cam has played and you will change your perception of him. cam’s got more poise in the pocket than 10yr veterans. we will leave your opinion of cam as your “residual feelings of him left in college” because what you say about cam’s decision making is simply not true. even if you havent watched films, stats dont lie.

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by Shockers on Nov 8, 2011 5:52 PM EST up reply actions  

It looks to me like you are repeating what you hear from fans of other teams.

 Nobody that has seen Cam playing can say he doesn’t stand in the pocket and make passes on the regular basis. Is it now a bad thing when no receivers are open and the qb avoids a sack and picks up 15 yards? He has played a couple of games with no interceptions so I wouldn’t say he makes bad decisions a lot, but he does make a few and he is learning from them. All the things you are saying just look to me like you don’t watch the games and have friends that are fans of other teams.

"Nobody wants to cheer for a loser". Cam Newton 2011

by MrBernz on Nov 9, 2011 12:35 PM EST up reply actions  

It looks to me like you are repeating what everyone else has already said to me

So I will repeat what I said to them to you…

“Your right. I have no idea what I’m talking about”

by AuburnDawg on Nov 10, 2011 1:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Again, don't take it so hard, AD.

We don’t mean to be rude, we’re just sensitive towards any Cam criticism because there was/is so much of it out there stemming from misinformation.

Give us a pass here. Stick around.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 10, 2011 10:55 AM EST up reply actions  

Top 5? Hmmm.

I will say this, he is a top 2 or 3 rookie QB of all time ,no doubt.

Is he the 5th best QB in the NFL right now? No. I honestly don’t think so. Top 10 for sure, but top 5? That’s a little too high.

Iranian Air Defense Site: 'Unknown aircraft you are in Iranian airspace. Identify yourself.'
Aircraft: 'This is a United States aircraft. I am in Iraqi airspace.'
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Aircraft: 'This is a United States Marine Corps FA-18 fighter. Send 'em up, I'll wait!'
Air Defense Site: (... total silence)

by Tarheel Soldier on Nov 8, 2011 11:11 AM EST reply actions  

I do think the #5 ranking is a little high. I'd put him at #7.

My top 10:

1. Rodgers
2. Brady
3. Roethlisberger
4. Brees
5. Stafford
6. Vick
7. Newton
8. Manning
9. Schaub
10. Fitzpatrick

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:21 AM EST up reply actions  

I'd flip Manning and Vick, but otherwise I totally agree with your rankings here.

I also think that Trotter has valued Fitzpatrick to highly. Yes, he came out of the gates on fire, but has significantly cooled off over the past few weeks.

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by Tater596 on Nov 8, 2011 11:28 AM EST up reply actions  

My ranking of Manning is purely subjective.

I can’t stand the guy, lol. I could buy an argument that those two should be switched, but I just couldn’t bring myself to rank the little troll #6 overall.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:30 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I don't like him either

But pulling off that 4th quarter win over the Pats sold me on his play this season.

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by Tater596 on Nov 8, 2011 11:33 AM EST up reply actions  

Meh...I give more credit to NYG's defense for that win.

Sure, Eli drove them down the field at the end of the game (and even I must admit it was a hell of a drive), but the defense made it possible by keeping Brady out of the end zone for most of the game.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 8, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions  

Manning???

Come on man he aint even playing this year because of his neck! How can he be better……………..ok that sounded a lot funnier in my head, then reading it.

Dear Baby Jesus in your golden diaper..thank you for making the number 89. Amen.

by Saul Good on Nov 8, 2011 1:19 PM EST up reply actions  

mine would be slightly different :)
1. Rodgers
 2. Brady
 3. Roethlisberger
 4. Brees
 5. Stafford
 6. Vick
 7. Newton
 8. Manning
9. Schaub
 10. Fitzpatrick

1. Rodgers
2. Brady
3. Roethlisberger
4. Brees
5. Eli Manning
6. Newton
7. Stafford
8. Vick
9. Schaub
10. Fitzpatrick

I feel like those top 7 quarterbacks are my top 7 because even when their man isn’t open they give their recievers a chance.

by Shankdiddy on Nov 8, 2011 1:20 PM EST up reply actions  

'tis true...

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 9, 2011 10:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Disagree

"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury

by OldhamA on Nov 9, 2011 3:11 PM EST up reply actions  

Rodgers QB rating so far: 129.1. Manning’s single season QB rating high is 121.1.

Rodgers has a 72.5 completion percentage, which would be a single season NFL record. Manning has never completed more than 68.8% of his passes in a season.

Rodgers is averaging 9.88 yards per attempt. Manning never averaged more than 8.21 yards per attempt in a season.

Rodgers TD/INT ratio is 8/1. Manning’s best ration is 4.9/1.

Rodgers is averaging 327.38 passing yards per game. Manning’s best season yardage-wise was a 284.81 yard average.

Rodgers has 9 rushing first downs in half a season. Manning’s season high is 11—in 16 games.

I can’t find a measurable that supports your opinion…and I’m mixing and matching favorable stats from different years in Manning’s career.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 9, 2011 3:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Keep in mind, Oldy hates Aaron Rodgers.

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 9, 2011 3:42 PM EST up reply actions  

What's to hate?

He seems like an okay dude?

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 9, 2011 3:44 PM EST up reply actions  

Discount Double Check

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 9, 2011 3:52 PM EST up reply actions  

Manning has a bigger head than Rogers.

That’s one advantage he has.

(But for serial, Aaron Rodgers is playing out of this world this season.)

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 9, 2011 3:43 PM EST up reply actions  

I think Manning is a first ballot HOFer. But he has never played as well as Rodgers is now.

And that’s not a slight to Manning…NO ONE has played the QB position as well as Rodgers is right now.

And Manning, even at his best, has been prone to throw crucial INTs. He has had several 6 INT games. He has been largely disappointing in the playoffs of late. I think his best football is behind him at this point—even if he were healthy.

The fact is, older QBs don’t win SBs. The only QB 31 or older to win a SB in the last 20-some years was Elway.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 9, 2011 3:49 PM EST up reply actions  

Keep this in perspective

At one time, the best talent Peyton Manning had around him was Marvin Harrison at the end of his career and Reggie Wayne at the start and basically a mediocre slot receiver in Dallas Clark (will never consider him a TE). Manning has never played with any talent around him (look at the Colts this season if you want to argue). Rodgers on the other hand has Greg Jennings, James Jones, Jordy Nelson, and Jermichael Finley to catch the ball. All, including that monster of a Tight End, could start receiver on another team. So while yes, Rodgers is outperforming Manning in almost all stats compared to Manning at the peak of his career, I don’t believe Rodgers is better.

"So! T'all you fine dandies so proud, so cock-sure, prancin' aboot with your heads full of eyeballs! Come and get me I say! I'll be waiting on ya with a whiff of the 'ol brimstone. I'm a grim bloody fable, with an unhappy bloody end!" - Demoman

by Thaddeus_Griffin on Nov 9, 2011 9:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Jennings, Jones, Nelson and Finley is = or < Harrison, Wayne and Clark.

Its all about the QB. The best WR in the NFL looked like a 3rd or 4th string WR last season with an insufficient QB at the helm.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 10, 2011 10:59 AM EST up reply actions  

And the head cheerleader led the NFL in receptions

The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you. ~David Foster Wallace

I may not always be right, but even a blind nut finds a squirrel every once in a while.

Follow me on Twitter! @bdubsmitty

by BW Smith on Nov 10, 2011 11:06 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Ugh.

I have no recollection of that

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 10, 2011 11:29 AM EST up reply actions  

Because Manning carried the Colts for a decade. Rodgers has a fantastic supporting cast.

Plus I think the new rules make it much, much easier for QBs to put up video game stats.

"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury

by OldhamA on Nov 10, 2011 9:30 AM EST up reply actions  

But we're talking about now (if PM were healthy).

The biggest rule change was the ‘hands off after 5 yards’ rule which Manning reaped benefits from, just like every other QB. He may have played three seasons prior to that rule being implemented.

Twaa...

by ERL on Nov 10, 2011 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

As much as I like Cam Newton and his play thus far...

…I think it’s a bit premature to say he’s the #5 QB in the whole league. He’s really only played half a season so far. He’s certainly dazzled in that time and he’s put up nice stats, too. Even against some pretty stout defenses (e.g., Green Bay). But we’ve yet to see him really take command and will his team to a victory in pressure-filled situations. I’m not saying he’s incapable of that. Given his pedigree in college, I suspect he is. Those situations just haven’t come up enough for him yet to definitively elevate him ahead of other QBs who already have a track record of that kind of thing. Drew Brees is the primary example of that. And much of what might elevate Brees past Cam right now is the kind of stuff that comes with experience. Cam just needs time to accumulate that same experience and show he can shine just as brightly.

For the time being, we have some really gaudy (as in good!) numbers from Cam in his rookie season. He’s definitely going to break some more records for a first-year player. And he continues to make HUGE strides in learning and adapting to the pro game. As everyone said during the initial pre-draft analysis of him, his upside is tremendous. And he still hasn’t peaked yet.

For me, though, the funny thing is that we can put aside any concerns about Cam’s ability to put up numbers. That capability has been on full display since the first regular season game. So, we don’t have to question his ability or mechanics at all anymore. Instead, the stuff that’ll be scrutinized now when comparing Cam to other QBs will be in the arena of his consistency, his decision-making (and avoidance of turnovers), his ability to lead come-from-behind wins, his performance in really big, playoff-impacting games, etc. He’ll reach unquestioned elite status once he demonstrates those things on the field.

And I think he has a really good chance of reaching that plateau as well, given his swift development, his obvious work ethic, and his inner drive to compete and be something special. In the meantime, let’s just enjoy this rookie season and the early performances of his career so we can compare them down the road when he’s taking this team places. He can’t do that part alone, though. Rivera and Hurney still need to put some more pieces in place to complete the remodeling of this team. Once that happens, there’ll be no more “yes, he has great stats, but very little wins” arguments which people want to use when comparing him to other successful QBs (i.e., Andy Dalton, etc.).

Just my two cents,
—Neil

by NSpicer on Nov 8, 2011 11:16 AM EST reply actions  

Very deserving

Cam is probably the most exciting AND successful QB to play the game. Experts point to Luck as being a once in a lifetime QB…well, perhaps Cam fits that bill too.

You get what you put in and people get what they deserve.

by Disciple of Carolina on Nov 8, 2011 11:20 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

I think Trotter has samples a little too much of the Cammy Cam juice

Not just because of his high ranking of Cam, but as I look down the list I see plenty of other names out of place. Even if we are just talking about this season’s rankings and attempting to throw out the preconceived notions of who is better than who all-time.

Putting Alex Smith ahead of Eli Manning at this juncture is just not right at all. I’m no Eli fan, but he is having his best season as a pro, and has single handedly bailed his team out of several games this season… most notably Sunday’s win over the Pats (granted, this article was written prior to that). He is doing this with a revolving door of receivers that can’t stay healthy, and a dearth of talent at the TE position.

Matthew Stafford should be much higher than he is, he has that Detroit O clicking on all cylinders, and has an incredible TD to INT ration of almost 5:1.

My point is, there is no way Cam should be 5, when you look at some of the guys below him in the rankings.

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by Tater596 on Nov 8, 2011 11:25 AM EST reply actions  

Newton is ranked 6 with yards so far.

That with his rushing yards, and rushing tds should rank him slightly higher than 6. I don’t see any Cam juice evidence.

"Nobody wants to cheer for a loser". Cam Newton 2011

by MrBernz on Nov 8, 2011 12:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Okay I can't resist...my top 10

1. Rodgers
2. Brady
3. Roethlisberger
4. Brees
5. Manning
6. Newton
7. Vick
8. Stafford
9. Schaub
10. Fitzpatrick

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by Jaxon on Nov 8, 2011 3:08 PM EST reply actions  

I agree with this one..

Except I’d probably through Eli above Newton for now

CAM....CAAAAAAAAM

by CamNewtonSBMVP on Nov 8, 2011 3:34 PM EST up reply actions  

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