The pros and cons of Carson Palmer for the Carolina Panthers
by James Dator on Jan 24, 2011 8:55 AM EST
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PrintAs I'm sure everyone knows by now Carson Palmer wants out, he's even willing to play the 'I'll retire' card to get out of Cincinnati. From the perspective of this Panthers fan I think Palmer was waiting and hoping for a regime chance in Cincy that appears wont happen yet due to Marvin Lewis' extension. As a result, Palmer looks on paper to be the best QB option available for trade and someone who could play as a stop-gap for the Panthers while Mike Shula can work with Jimmy Clausen and Tony Pike to see if he believes either are future franchise QBs.
This doesn't mean he's without problems. On a scale of 1-10 with '1' being a player happy to be a mentor and '10' being a guy who wants to remain 'the guy' Palmer rates about an 11, and why shouldn't he? Palmer is still a 31 year old QB with plenty of tread left on the tires, despite what the court of public opinion says. Does he make some ill advised decisions? Yes, he sure does... but he still passed for 3,900 yards, 61.8% completion and 26 TD vs. 20 INT this season.
After the jump we'll look at three pros, and three cons of the Panthers making a run at Carson Palmer.
Pros
1. He's had success in the NFL: There was a time in 2005 and 2006 that Palmer was seen much as Aaron Rodgers is right now. That QB who sits just below Peyton Manning and Tom Brady in that 'Tier 1.5' level. He's a two-time Pro Bowler who definitely has the chops to be regarded as a top 15 QB despite his struggles in 2010.
2. Clausen knows him: If you're a QB from California there's a good chance the Clausen family knows you, and this goes for Jimmy. In an early interview Clausen said that he knew the Palmers (Carson and Jordan) as well as the Moores (Matt and brothers). We're not sure if they have anything more than passing interactions, but if Clausen and Palmer know each other well he could be a very positive influence.
3. It represents a good chance for the Panthers to trade down: Although any machination of trade could happen there's no denying that the Bengals would have interest in several of the players at the top of the draft. Perhaps fearful AJ Green wouldn't make it past Buffalo at #3 could peak the interest of a trade (provided there's a CBA to trade under). My immediate reaction would be the #1 overall pick, the Panthers 3rd rounder and a 6th rounder for Cincinnati's #4 overall, their second rounder and Carson Palmer. This would potentially allow Carolina to grab a very good player at #4 (or try and trade back further) while being able to address the TE position if Rudolph is available in the 2nd and add a QB to the mix.
Cons
1. He is threatening to retire: This represents a degree of narcissism rarely seen in NFL QBs. Do they pout sometimes? Sure... do they complain? Indeed. But threatening to retire doesn't really shed a positive light on someone who you're essentially asking to help mentor your young talent.
2. Could he work with Smitty? Palmer is known for not always having the best relationships with his WRs. His interactions with Chad Ochocinco could best be described as 'love hate'. More often than not this stems from both Palmer and #85 vying to be the top dog on the Bengals offense. How would Palmer deal with coming to a team where Steve Smith is, and has been the top dog on offense?
3. Will he mentor? It remains to be seen if Carson Palmer is the type to 'pay it forward'. Jon Kitna did it for him when he was a rookie, and it seems he's trying to pull his brother Jordan along, but would he be willing to do it for another QB? Much of this would be related to his relationship (or lack thereof) with Jimmy Clausen.
What do the Panther faithful think? As a stopgap do you think Carson Palmer could be a good fit in Carolina provided there's a CBA in place in order to trade for him?
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If the asking price was cheap I'd like it...
but not sure if I’d give up a whole lot to pull him in because there’s a lot of uncertainty surrounding him (the potential narcissism, although I think he just hate cincy; has some major injuries in the past, etc…).
Performance wise though, he’s actually been quite consistent throughout his career; I think he gets a bum rap in cincy…
agree...
this offense needs something…clausen isnt ready right now and it would be useful to have a mentor for the time being. if there is a vet QB that can keep the offense on the field, the defense will benefit from some extra rest. but yes, the price must be cheap.
agreed....+1.5
Hey well he would be a great stop gap guy and the closet thing to a true Franchise QB available for trade. If their is a CBA deal in place I would make the deal. Basically the Panthers have a ton of cap space as we all know and we need a DAMN QB. Clausen I agree with mostly everyone on here is at least another year away if not two and T. Pike is further behind then Clausen and might never be ready. Palmer is the best available for trade but if the CBA deal is not in place don’t look for us to make a play for him.
My trade:
Our #1 Overall pick & one of our third’s (comp pick for J. Peppers would be lower so we keep that one an we cannot trade that one anyway).
for
Palmer, their first round #4 overall and a conditional second round or third round pick the following season in 2012.
by Holty_Panthers_Fan on Jan 24, 2011 4:43 PM EST up reply actions
I've always thought he was a decent QB
It just seems to me he’s a bit gun shy ever since he got injured. Plus, I think he still regards himself in the “elite” category, even if it is unwarranted.
Would he be a good fit in the Panthers organization? Well, I would have taken his stats last year as opposed to Clausen’s, but that’s not really saying anything, is it? As long as he was brought in with the understanding that he is the starting QB with a role in the development of the younger QBs.
I think he still has a lot in the tank and could absolutely boost the Panthes anemic offense. Yeah, I’d pull the trigger if presented the option…
Ron Rivera, the Most Interesting Coach in the World. Stay thirsty my friends!
by Tarheel Soldier on Jan 24, 2011 9:07 AM EST reply actions
I think
for the right price, I’d love to have Palmer in a Panther jersey! I still believe the guy can a be a good QB. He may just need a change of scenery to jump start his return to relevance. I think dealing with morons like Ochocinco and Owens really got to him. And though that doesn’t give him an excuse for playing the way he played throughout the season, he played leaps and bounds better without Ochocinco or Owens. If we can land him for the right price, I say lets get him!
To Many, Many winning seasons under our new coach Ron Rivera! And may we win a few Super Bowls along the way to becoming a Dynasty!!!
by Panther4Life!!! on Jan 24, 2011 9:16 AM EST reply actions
I think it depends on how comfortable Cincy would be rolling with either Jordan Palmer or Dan LeFevour
Seems like they would be taking a serious downgrade at the position… however, this does provide them a chance at an amicable split with Carson and an opportunity to get something in return. Best to try and get rid of a player who doesn’t want to play on your team while you can get some kind of compensation.
As far as him fitting here in Carolina, I think he is a good player and would benefit from this change of scenery. There is no doubt he is not in the best situation in Cincy. There is a lot of ego at wide receiver, and lots of generally bad eggs in the bunch all over that team. Coming here he would instantly improve his situation, and he’d be afforded the chance to start for a couple years while mentoring our young QBs. I think he would be a good teacher because I have never seen anything to indicate that he isn’t a good student of the game.
I think it would be a good move and an instant upgrade. Let’s hope our FO sees it the same way.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
If the bengals let go of Carson they are going to draft Cam Newton....
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
This.
East Carolina Pirates - No Quarter
by RjTheMetalhead on Jan 24, 2011 9:40 AM EST up reply actions
As much as I would hate it...
…he would be the best QB we have ever had. I think there is enough tread to take a chance. We can’t roll with Clausen again this year. My dream of a franchise QB is now lightyears away, so we might as well play the stop gap again. We need a vet, and he looks to be the best available. Just send Stewart or Goodson up there for him. Benson is about done. That way we keep our picks.
I hear that saying a lot
“running backs are a dime a dozen” but if thats the case why are there teams that have no running game at all?
I'm glad you hear it a lot
Every team has a running game…whether it is good or not is a different story. Pretty sure BJGE, Woodhead, Starks, Sutton, Goodson, (the list could go on), are not big time backs, but they get the job done. I think in our case giving up a RB for a pro-bowl caliber QB would be in our best interest. It doesn’t make sense to keep a RB stable, when you need to upgrade in other places. I don’t want to see any of them go, but I do if it meant we as a team got better.
having a running game means a good running game.
Using your logic is like saying the Panthers had a passing game this year. But ok i am not going to go into a debate about it, you win.
See heres the thing about runningbacks
Its 70% blocking… I mean lets be honest.. Chicago can’t run the ball because there line isn’t that good at creating holes and thats why you see guys like James Starks running for a buck 120 against the Bears. When in reality he is not really that good.
10% is vision… It takes a really good runningback to be able to read blocks and find holes to run through.. Thats what makes DeAngelo Williams so good is because when nothing there they can still get yards by finding little creases in the blocks.
20% is just the ability to not just break tackles but when being tackled gain that extra yard or two through steer will strength and determination. Now we know how bad our Oline has been this year but Stewart was still successful particularly at the end of the season because of his ability to break tackles and gain extra yards. I mean Stewart has been the only RB I have seen literally run over a Pittsburgh Steelers Linebacker…
The truth is RB’s are not a dime a dozen… We see RB’s like Adrian Foster, Matt Forte, James Starks,Ryan Torian, Steve Slaton, ect. be good for there teams because the Oline makes them look WAY better than what they really are. The guys like J Stew DeAngelo Williams, Adrian Peterson, Michael Turner, Maurice Jones-Drew, Peyton Hillis, Thomas Jones, Rashard Mendenhall, Steven Jackson and Chris Johnson(vision and speed) are really the only “good” RB’s in this league because they are the guys that break tackles and get that extra yards after contact. Guys that need a hole that you can drive a truck through to get yards and goes down after the first man tackles him are not “good” there average RB’s that look good because of there Olines do such a good job blocking for them
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Where
did you get your percentages? Those are amazing stats, and I would love to see the analysis that shows the 70-10-20 breakdown.
I made that up based off what I see out of runningbacks and my own personal experience playing the HB position
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Could he work with Smitty?
Who cares? :)
I want to know if he can work with LaFell and Gettis, and to a lesser extent guys like Clowney and AE. They’re our future at the position and that’s who he has to forge a relationship with.
One promising thing there, even with Smitty, is that as a group our receivers are WAY less “Me-first!” than Chad Johnson or Terrel Owens. They’re not showboats, and they push each other to get better. They’re also all high character guys off the field, which can’t hurt when it’s time to forge a relationship. I’m not worried about that part at all.
Palmer would be a great addition, he would really improve our QB play. And it would allow Shula the luxury of time where Jimmy Clausen is concerned. I still believe that Clausen can become an excellent QB (yes, excellent), and this would give him time to develop that while someone else took the pressure of starting.
But based on Hurney’s history, I’m not counting on it. I think we’re going to see a young guy like Hanie or Dixon first.
Hanie impressed me.
And he’d come a lot cheaper than Palmer. If we want a future starter type to compete with Clausen, I think Hanie would be the guy.
The main thing about Palmer is that I don’t want to overpay for him. If we can get him relatively cheap, say 1st and 5th for their first, second, Palmer, and a conditional third next year, I’d pull the trigger on that deal. Palmer I believe is a second tier QB at this point, in the David Garrard, Jake Delhomme mold. He can be a decent player for you and win you some games, but he’s not going to be a stud. He’d essentially be a stopgap while we developed Clausen.
"Sometimes the journey is better than the destiny."-John Fox
"Ever noticed that you can say "it is what it is" after anything? It’s the perfect cop-out. Sorry man, I didn’t mean to hit on your girl… But it is what it is!"-Southtunnel (previously El Bacon)
by Flowing Willow on Jan 24, 2011 11:43 AM EST up reply actions
ughhh
Hanie? He played essentially one quarter this year, and now you want him on your team? There is a reason he’s the 3rd string QB on the Bears. If we go into the season with Clausen, Hanie, and Pike as our QBs we better get ready for another last place finish. Clausen is more experienced and talented than Hanie.
I'm saying to show that level of calm in the NFC championship while having almost no time to prepare is impressive.
I don’t want to bet the farm on him, as he is a third stringer for a reason, but he showed something in that game. I’d trade a seventh round pick for him in a heartbeat.
"Sometimes the journey is better than the destiny."-John Fox
"Ever noticed that you can say "it is what it is" after anything? It’s the perfect cop-out. Sorry man, I didn’t mean to hit on your girl… But it is what it is!"-Southtunnel (previously El Bacon)
by Flowing Willow on Jan 25, 2011 5:10 PM EST up reply actions
Trade the #1 pick to Cincy!!!
Trade our #1 pick to Cincinnati for their 1st round and 2nd round pick this year and their 3rd round next year. This way they can select whichever QB they like best in the draft.
The Panthers can gain a second round pick this year and a third round pick next year and still select one of the A J Green/Nick Fairley/Da’Quan Bowers/Patrick Peterson group. I would suspect A J Green would be there at #4.
That won't work unless Cam Newton, Ryan Mallett or Blaine Gabbert really amazes the NFL at the Combine
as of right now there is absolutely no reason for them to move up because all three of them QB’s are probably going to be there when they pick… They would literally be wasting picks when they are a team that needs a pass rusher, and some wide receivers as well as a QB
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Get their 2012 first round pick
As long as we are talking about exchanging picks we should try to get our hands on their 2012 first round pick (instead of later round picks this year). Without Palmer the Bengals QB situtation is worse than the Panthers in 2010. They will probably be picking earlier than 4th in a stronger draft.
The reason to move up is to keep someone else from stepping in.
Of course, as you say, none of this will happen if no QB steps up their draft status. Cincy can stand pat unless ONE particular QB tickles their fancy.
The Bengals are going to ask for way too much, at least at first.
If they entertain offers to trade him, I think they are hoping some desperate team backs the Brinks truck up to their door. If his departure is long and drawn out, then his value will continue to sink, making him far more attainable for say, one of our third round picks (preferably the one at the very end of the round).
Let me hold about tree-fiddy?
that's what I'm afraid of...
somebody like arizona or something swooping in and offering the house for him
Let them have him.
I’d rather take a chance drafting another QB than give up any draft compensation for a washed up version of a once good (not great) quarterback. Not to mention the huge salary he’s carrying with him.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Follow me on Twitter
I agree
to not giving up a draft pick for him but he passed for 1600 more yards, 17 more TD’s and had 1 less pick than all of our QB’s. If we can get him on the cheap I think we do it.
Lol. With all due respect........
Those stats are meaningless compared to our QB’s. I can guarantee you that Palmer wouldn’t have even been able to even post those mediocre stats on our team this season. Our guys haven’t played enough to be judged too harshly.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Follow me on Twitter
if I remember right
the last 3 games he didn’t have t.o or chad and threw for almost 800 yards and 5 td’s to 2 picks.
Again........
I can guarantee you that Palmer wouldn’t have been able to post those mediocre stats on our team last season.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Follow me on Twitter
What is more likely:
An O-line with two pro-bowl caliber players was the worst in the league, the only rushing duo in the history of the NFL to rush for 1100 yards each in a season sucked out loud, superstar Steve Smith halved production solely due to age, and the 4th+5th highest yardage rookie receivers in the NFL weren’t capable of their jobs.
OR
Our QB play sucked so bad that the opposing defenses were not intimidated by the passing game, resulting in overloaded boxes against the run and forcing us to go in the air with someone not capable of pulling it off.
I think the amount of excuses for Clausen is getting rediculous. Smith was on par for a 1,000 yard season i you pro-rated Moore’s starts. I’m not interested in going into next season without someone even as capable as Delhomme in line to play QB, gambling on a potential bust.
Why wasn't Clausen capable of pulling it off?
I’ll flip the tables a bit, what’s more likely, a highly regarded, highly talented, decorated QB comes in to the NFL for a good team in a good situation and all of a sudden forgets how to play entirely, or said rookie comes in, gets few reps to get chemistry with his rookie wideouts due to the fact he’s not expected to play this year, no support from the ground game due to the overloaded boxes, can’t make the defense pay because of the playcalling and offensive line not putting him in a good position, and can’t improve because of a terrible QB coach? Clausen isn’t absolved of all the blame, he needs to learn to step up into the pocket, make his reads, and deliver the ball downfield accurately. But all of this can be fixed by next year. He’s like any other rookie QB, you’re not going to give up on him if he struggles because it’s expected. Now if he can’t put it together next year, you have your veteran behind him to take the reins, and you know for certain. But unless he plays, you’re not ever going to know.
"Sometimes the journey is better than the destiny."-John Fox
"Ever noticed that you can say "it is what it is" after anything? It’s the perfect cop-out. Sorry man, I didn’t mean to hit on your girl… But it is what it is!"-Southtunnel (previously El Bacon)
by Flowing Willow on Jan 24, 2011 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
He's not like every other rookie NFL QB, that's the problem
I’m at work so I can’t dig it up right now, but there was a post on rookie QB ratings a while back. I recall it stating he was the 2nd or 3rd worst in…nfl history? Would appreciate it if the original poster can point out the fanpost.
I do agree that he should ride the pine and not just be tossed after a year, but I do not think it is smart to be expecting him to start within the next two years after his play this season. Good QBs don’t need all the cards in place to perform at at least a satisfactory level.
For sure, hedge your bets.
But I don’t think you can find another QB with a worse situation. Clausen has quite a bit of talent, I don’t doubt that he has flaws, but I also don’t think that talent has gone anywhere. We saw it in the beginning of the year, he looked legit in preseason, and sparked a couple of drives in the Tampa Bay and Cincinnatti games. I’ve seen enough flashes to think that with the right coaching he can put it all together.
"Sometimes the journey is better than the destiny."-John Fox
"Ever noticed that you can say "it is what it is" after anything? It’s the perfect cop-out. Sorry man, I didn’t mean to hit on your girl… But it is what it is!"-Southtunnel (previously El Bacon)
by Flowing Willow on Jan 24, 2011 12:31 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed on bad situations, but here's the thing
We don’t know what Clausen will turn out to be, and those small sparks are buried in a larger pile of dung, instilling a rational fear that he won’t really develop into something adequate. If we pick up a very old QB solely to mentor and Clausen flops, well, now we’re back at the end of 2009 except without the potential bright future of Moore. It could our franchise in a major hole for what amounts to 5 years – 2 years working out Clausen, giving up, then starting the process all over again. If we pick up a QB with at least 5 years left on the treads like Palmer, then it gives us time to get another promising rookie and evaluate them before Palmer is no longer capable of filling in. Now, Palmer isn’t Rivers or Manning, but he’s better than Delhomme and Delhomme was enough to get us within 2 pts of a superbowl. You can use that argument for Clausen, but I don’t think he’s shown enough yet, other than pedigree in college, to say he’ll be better than Delhomme in the long haul.
The wildcard in it all is Pike. If Pike is ends up being starting quality and we opt for an offense where arm strength isn’t a major factor, I would be satisfied with a 1-2 year menor vet. However, I don’t think there’s enough there yet to make that call. Better safe than sorry.
sound logic there.
Can’t really argue with it.
"Sometimes the journey is better than the destiny."-John Fox
"Ever noticed that you can say "it is what it is" after anything? It’s the perfect cop-out. Sorry man, I didn’t mean to hit on your girl… But it is what it is!"-Southtunnel (previously El Bacon)
by Flowing Willow on Jan 25, 2011 5:12 PM EST up reply actions
To clarify
You can’t trade compensatory picks. So if we trade a 3rd rounder it has to be the one at the top of the round.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
You forgot the biggest con of all-his remaining salary!
Big Cat ain’t gonna spring for that kinda bread, not for a 31 year old. $50 mil over the next 4 years. It flies in the face of the penny-pinching youth movement.
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=2550&sport=NFL
Our stop gap veteran QB signing should be someone familiar with Chud’s system. Sign Volek, Bulger or Derek Anderson if he’s released by Arizona. If there is a lockout and there are no summer camps, then we need someone who can hit the ground running in the new system. IMHO.
Derek Anderson can't hit anything
Whether it be the ground running or the broad side of a barn.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
Much less than it seems
Signed a six-year, $118.75 million contract extension through 2014. The deal included a $15 million signing bonus and a third-year option bonus of $9 million. 2011-2012: $11.5 million, 2013: $13 million, 2014: $14 million, 2015: Free Agent
Essentially Palmer is only due $11.5 million in 2011 and 2012 at which point the team can cut him without penalty. If they pick up his option he makes $9 million as a bonus and from there the contract continues.
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
by James Dator on Jan 24, 2011 10:21 AM EST up reply actions
Overated name.
Palmer is done as a true starting QB. Since his injury he hasn’t been the same, and looks just horrible on alot if his passes. The stats don’t do him justice. I think we are all a little desperate for any possibility at QB after the performances of the last few years. Palmer wants to start,not mentor. If we want him as the starter for the next 4 years bring him in. I don’t think he has anyything left. He wont be “the mentor” to Jimmy . We will be in the same place we were with Jake 3 years from know
by sgtx on Jan 24, 2011 10:05 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Yeah I trade for Palmer with a 4th pick at most
I’d rather see what Clausen do in his 2nd year than watch an mediocre QB in Palmer go out there and lead us to a 6-10 season… I would love him as a back-up but not as a starter to sit Clausen… Actually speaking of that, I think its to late to sit Clausen. I mean he has already got through his first rookie season. This is the make or break year for him and we have to play him for the ENTIRE year IF we don’t take a QB with the 1st pick.. Right now I’d rather go 2-14 next year to find out Clausen is not the guy and get a chance at taking Luck again then go with Palmer and go 6-10 and can’t get a Franchise Guy and hoping Clausen gets good.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Why would you think he would come here & be a back up
when he already threatened to retire if he doesnt start there?
Ok well why would we trade for him when he had all the talent in the world at Cincy and couldn't get it done.
I mean it doesn’t matter what he thinks if we trade for him and he can’t beat out Clausen then he doesn’t deserve to start. Honestly it doesn’t matter one way or the other I believe that 2011 is all about finding out can Clausen get it done or not.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
Well if a the CBA isn't done by the draft we won't be able to trade for him
Players can’t be signed or traded if there isn’t a CBA.
I'm not a fan of this idea.
I don’t think Carson Palmer would be a fan of it either. It is doubtful that a CBA agreement will be reached by the draft, so the scenario isn’t likely to play out anyway. My two biggest issues with this are 1. the amount of money owed to Palmer under his current contract and 2. the suggested draft compensation to get him. We hold the #1 pick and we don’t NEED Carson Palmer. We could definitely use him if he fell into our laps, but we needn’t be sweetening the pot by giving up a 3rd and 6th round pick and not getting a future #1. Cincinnati is the one who is facing loosing their “franchise QB” to retirement and getting nothing in return. If anyone should be sweetening the deal, it should be them. IF a CBA is reached, there are other options out there that would cost less and would closer fit our needs than Carson Palmer.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Follow me on Twitter
Yeah, we could go for another team's backup,
but I’d rather go for a proven QB. Sure he hasn’t been the same since his injury, but he’s got one thing most of our team doesn’t…experience. If nothing else he provides a huge upgrade at the QB position for at least 3-4 years. At worst he would allow time for Clausen or Pike to learn how to play QB at the NFL level.
I’m just not sure how much JR is in love with paying his remaining contractural obligation… Not saying he is Mr. El Cheapo like most “fans” call him, but I would it may be a bit too much to pay for a “once promising sub-star” QB.
Honestly, I doubt the Panthers will pull the trigger on this one. I would, but it’s not my money, LOL!
Ron Rivera, the Most Interesting Coach in the World. Stay thirsty my friends!
by Tarheel Soldier on Jan 24, 2011 10:14 AM EST reply actions
I'd be open to trading for Palmer
But his numbers the past two years are very similar to Alex Smith’s, who is a free agent. Of course Palmer plays in a tougher division and has much more experience, but its something to consider nonetheless.
Follow me on Twitter at @jakehbravesfan
+1 I'd take Alex Smith too.
Considering the fact he will put up a 300 yard game every now then… Only thing is if he can get some decent QB coaching then he could still be a Good NFL QB
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
No thanks
1) I don’t like stopgap QBs. I’d rather play with what we have, and if we don’t have anything and we have another terrible season, then we’ll have a chance at Barkley or Luck. If we go stopgap QB, there’s a chance we do well enough to take ourselves out of that picture.
2) Not a fan of CP, just don’t think he’s that good.
3) Trade would cost too much.
4) We have so many other needs in draft, I don’t want to give up a pick for CP.
5) He’ll take up a lot of the payroll we just spent this entire season saving for.
6) You can get other QBs out there like Billy Volek or Matt Moore who’ll probably have the same effect on the team without the monetary or trade compensation owed to CP.
So, no thanks!
+1 I agree on everything
I’d rather see Clausen go out there in a make or break year… I want to 100% sure Clausen isn’t the guy the before we start someone else. If Clausen sucks and we go 3-13 then we take Luck or Barkley.. I want to see what Clausen has this year
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
still think clausen has potential
But he needs to learn from the bench for at least a couple years. Keep him out of the fire for awhile. I could live with CP for his gauranteed period if we got a good trade going.
by wee-vegas cat on Jan 24, 2011 11:48 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Oh Yeah!!!!!
You guys are crazy Carson Palmer would be the best quarterback Carolina has ever had if we just let him go to another team and not at least try to get him that would be the dumbest thing Jerry Richardson has done he would absolutely lose all my respect as an NFL team owner ok so he is owed alot of money i would be willing to take that chance to get a super bowl in Carolina trade the #1 pick and a 2nd and 3rd rounder for him and get smitty some help our defense is already a good unit so why would we need another DT thats stupid and all these people vying for that Luck kid we would be in the same boat with him that we are in with Jimmy now i do believe Jimmy will be a great QB but he still needs to learn how to adapt to the NFL game and that will take a while but i believe that Carson would be a great teacher for Jimmy but o let a QB that good pass would be downright retarded and all the people that think it would be bad would be stupid also and next year be wishing that we signed him i personally want to talk to Mr. Richardson myself about this deal but we still have to wait for the New CBA and if Cincy will actually honor his request iam anxious to see if Mr. Richardson is as dumb or smarter than i think he is!!!!!!!!!!
Lol.
Richardson would spread you on a biscuit and eat you for snack.
Obviously, you hold Palmer in higher regard than most of us. Not sure why, but it’s your opinion so good luck with it.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
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no way
we trade a 1st, 2nd and 3rd. That would be crazy
+1
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Follow me on Twitter
Do you realize this is one sentance?
unless they mean that you ain’t gettin’ any, periods are our friends.
Let me hold about tree-fiddy?
lol
"I think that fits right along with what my vision is, and that is to help build this team into a Super Bowl caliber team, win, and sustain that for a period of time." ~Ron Rivera
I'm glad you aren't in charge...
I would give a 3rd for Palmer at best. And I sure as hell would NEVER EVER give the #1 pick for him.
Yes, it would be stupid.
But that is exactly what you said you would give for him.
trade the #1 pick and a 2nd and 3rd rounder for him
Your words, not ours.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Follow me on Twitter
Highly Unlikely
I will say that it would be great to have Palmer on our team. However, being a Panthers fan since day one, this isn’t a move we’re likely to make.
by pantherdiehard on Jan 24, 2011 11:22 AM EST reply actions
Palmer a good stop gap
Palmer would be nothing more than a placeholder at best. If the price is right, then he is a great pick up. It really depends on how much faith the Panthers have in their young Quaterback talent in Clausen and Pike. Do they want a starter for some time or someone to mentor. So far there has been no indication of their direction on the QB situation. All we know is that it will be addressed aggressively.
Why trade for Palmer
When we can get VY for money only. Way I see it VY is younger and better, for less cost.
Meh...
Vince may be younger, but his head is not screwed on straight by any means, and I don’t know that Rivera and the coaching staff need a headcase of that caliber as not just an on-field, but potentially an off-field challenge as well. To hear Titans fans, Vince was a cancer in the locker room. Do not want.
You cant listen to fans.
Look at the fans of the Panthers, most of them dont even know the shape of a tball much less anything happening with the team.
Maybe so...
But when some of the players are saying the same thing (granted, not many, but I suspect that’s more people worried about what Bud Adams would think at the time than anything else), I kinda have to give pause to that. Personally, though, to see all the news reports, I don’t feel we need that sort of distraction coming into next season. We have more important things to deal with than the prima donna antics Vince has been known for since his Texas days.
No thats not entirely true.
You guys can say what you want about VY but the truth is he was a Probowl QB not to long ago and plays at a high level when he is healthy. Obviously the guy needs a change in scenery and a little better QB coaching. This is a mobile QB that can pass the ball and has made the Probowl with marginal talent at receiver. You don’t knock a guy before he even gets a chance to prove himself
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
No Way
I kinda feel bad for Jimmy cause he never had a chance last year. I mean would anybody have had success in the same situation. Jimmy will be the starter next year, i garauntee it. the year after that is still up in the air, but i highly doubt that after spending a 2nd round pick on him that he gets one year and thats it.
I can't agree with that
If your argument was Clausen was a rookie and deserves another chance ok. But to say that nobody could succeed with our team is incorrect. Clausen deserves to split the blame with the Coaching staff. If you wish to give him a pass because he is a rookie I could see that position (even though I don’t agree). And if Clausen is starting next year I might cry.
I'm saying that
with the coaching situation and lack of experience throughout the entire team, i dont think anybody else would have had much more success. Sure we may have won 2 or 3 other games, but its crazy to think that with all the injuries on the line, and rookies WRs and no running game that another qb would have saved us. I dont personally like Jimmy Clausen but he didnt have a fair chance.
by Matt Hartzog on Jan 24, 2011 11:35 AM EST up reply actions
Right
You can put your 2011 season on the roulette wheel if you want. I’d prefer to compile as many potential QBs as possible. Higher chance of one of those QBs actually getting us back to mediocre.
Let me hold about tree-fiddy?
I don't agree
back to mediocre? I have much higher expectations even for JC, next year
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
What a great fan you are
Actually, he was NOT in a place to succeed, with a lame duck coaching staff who didn’t know how to coach a rookie QB and no mentor. I’m sorry but no rookie QB would have succeeded there. I for one give him a mulligan on the season and at the least he got experience, and look for a breakout Sophomore year. But you don’t want to give our current starting QB that chance. Sad.
GSO
"I'd rather jerk off a tiger in a phone booth than draft Cam"
-Mel Kiper, Jr.
It's not polite to question someone's fanhood, Mike. Why do you (and only you) do it so often?
When people jump on other players you don’t care…just don’t dare say anything negative about The Jimmy.
Ed Johnson sucks so bad I can’t stand it….(waiting for you to swing in like Tarzan and save Ed)………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………..?
Let me hold about tree-fiddy?
As some1 already pointed out,
other teams stacked the line because they knew Clausen wouldnt be able to take the pressure. So yes another qb may have well been able to produce because of the fact that other teams wouldnt be risking stacking all their players at the line.
QB shopping
If we’re gonna go shopping for a QB via the “trade/FA” route then we need to take a good, long look at Vince Young.
1) He’s a proven winner
2) He’s relatively young
3) He’s got a “chip on his shoulder” to prove Coach Fisher was dead wrong.
4) The price should be right
5) Under Rivera/Shula coaching believe he would become an elite status QB
6) The price should be right
Jim
Second Verse, Same As The First...
I’ll just point back up to my previous post about why the Panthers do not need the headache that is Vince Young. No cancer in the locker room, please.
OK
We sure don’t need any more problems – but – I think the guy, VY, at least deserves an interview to see if there is any possibilities. Our coaching staff may get a completely different prospective of the guy and his attitude.
Jim
by goofygolfer on Jan 24, 2011 12:11 PM EST up reply actions
I agree...But...
I’m a little suspect of his mental state.
Other FA / Trade QBs I wouldn’t mind:
T Jackson
A Smith
D McNabb
T Smith
K Kolb
and I’ll say it… M Leinart
Leinart's physically talented...
he just for whatever reason hasn’t put it all together…
by Tomthehomer on Jan 24, 2011 12:19 PM EST up reply actions
not much of upgrades
Only McNabb and maybe Kolb would significant upgrades to the QB’s we already have on the roster in Moore and Clausen.
I can make an arguement for T. Smith and T. Jackson
They are decent but need some QB coaching to become good.
The thing I REALLY hate is that the Bengals will probably end up taking Cam Newton at #2. - SexBengals Fan
1 thing i would have to insist upon if they took Kolb
He would have to tell everyone to pronounce the l in his name. I dont want anyone called “cob” as our qb, i rather have a “coalb”
"Mike Brown says the Bengals won't Trade Carson Palmer"
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/01/24/mike-brown-says-bengals-wont-trade-carson-palmer/
Let me hold about tree-fiddy?
Seems 'bout right.
East Carolina Pirates - No Quarter
by RjTheMetalhead on Jan 24, 2011 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
Do you really think
Do you really think Carson Palmer would even play for the Panthers? It’s clear that he would rather sit at home than play for a losing team, and the Panthers are the only team to do worse than the bengals last year…
Why on earth would he want to play for carolina?
This article was a complete waste.
A waste of what, Jason?
Please tell us what its a waste of…since you couldn’t find anything else to do.
Let me hold about tree-fiddy?
by ERL on Jan 24, 2011 12:38 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
did you not read what i wrote? it’s pointless to speculate on if palmer would be a good fit for carolina… why go from one losing team to another?
by Jason Blanton on Jan 24, 2011 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
what are you talking about? palmer started every game this year? and yes, its because of the 4-12 record.
by Jason Blanton on Jan 24, 2011 12:57 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe i am getting news reports confused, if so my appologies.
Sometimes i can be as stupid as anyone else. I know youre thinking, no way, but yes i too make a mistake sometimes.
Maybe his problem are the people there
And by the way, you are calling the Panthers a “losing team.” What team do you pull for? Because unless you pull for The Steelers, Patriots, Ravens, Giants, Packers, or a couple of other teams, your team has a worse record over the last ten seasons than the Panthers.
Let me hold about tree-fiddy?
ERL dont take my comment out of context and try to distort it. what i said was that the panthers were the worst team in football last year… what i mistaken?
by Jason Blanton on Jan 24, 2011 8:24 PM EST up reply actions
Question
To change the subject for just a second, has anyone heard anything concerning Ricky’s interview for the WR coach????
Jim
I think the 3 cons listed
are why we need someone like Bulger. He covers all the bases on those three. Would be relatively cheap, too.
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." Hanlon's Razor
I keep forgetting about him.
Where is he now anyway?
by The Duke Dude on Jan 24, 2011 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
He just finished a 1 year deal with the Ravens
Either Bulger or Volek works well in order to push and mentor Clausen.
Carson Palmer? mmm, I say Billy Volek.
I still think San Diego Back-up QB Billy Volek makes the most sense for Carolina. One big reason is because Volek has already worked closely with new Carolina offensive coordinator Rob Chudzinski in San Diego the past two years as well as being familiar with Co. Rivera. Billy has also put up some impressive numbers when he has had to step in for Phillip Rivers including leading the Chargers to a come from behind victory in Indy eliminating the Colts from the playoffs on the road.
I believe Volek would be just as effective if not more so than Palmer and he definitely would not come with the huge price tag Palmer would command. No sense in giving so much trade value on a QB that had major knee surgery a few years ago. We can have our cake and eat it too. Look at all the “no-names” that had a major impact on Championship Sunday, especially 3rd QB Hanie for the Bears. You don’t have to have a well known “name” like Cowher or Palmer to win in the NFL. Sometimes it’s the no-names that are the hungriest and have the most to prove on the field.
by chazatlas on Jan 24, 2011 12:47 PM EST reply actions
Well said Sir!
I agree with everything you said
by The Duke Dude on Jan 24, 2011 3:08 PM EST up reply actions
Now that i have made a few replies to other posts
here is my feeling on it. I would like to take him & let Clausen/Pike sit a while. To say his price is too much is not a valid point at all. For 1 the Panthers have plenty of cap space if they keep the same limit in the new cba. @- they have a minimum they have to pay per year, it will be paid anyway just distributed differently. Now that said, i just have a feeling the Panthers will not even try for him. I think they will avoid a bidding war and teams like the Vikings, 49ers will be bidding for him. I still want to wait and see what Moore has when he heals. I lso would not mind VY coming to Carolina. People say he has problems but so far the only problems validated are team problems this season. Mostly due to the coach and VY.
I would be estatic to get Palmer...
he’s looking for a change of scenery and we are looking for veteran leadership at QB and a guy motivated to turn hsi career around. It’s perfect…now get it done Hurney!
My thoughts exactly...
He would be the perfect guy to come in for 3-4 years while Shula works with Clausen. We can also possibly trade first rounders with Cincy and still might be able to get either AJ Green or Nick Fairley at #4 overall.
"I think that fits right along with what my vision is, and that is to help build this team into a Super Bowl caliber team, win, and sustain that for a period of time." ~Ron Rivera
Steve
I think Steve has already said that he wants to step down. But no one arose as the leader. So I think he would be ok with that. IMO Palmer is a step up, but like you said hes not without his flaws. Remember the game he had against us?
We need Billy Volek as QB
Check out this nfl.com video from a couple years ago when the discussion was best free agent QB’s. Billy has already been working with Chud and Rivera for the past two+ years, he’s backed up one of the best in Phillip Rivers, throws a great deep ball, stepped in for Rivers and won a playoff game on the road (vs Indy), would be a great mentor to Clausen & Co. and we could get him at a decent price. It all makes sense.
by chazatlas on Jan 24, 2011 1:25 PM EST reply actions
We talked about Volek a week ago. You can find the archived article here
Follow me on Twitter! @James_Dator
Palmer vs. Volek
That’s cool. I guess I’m trying to add some reality to the conversation. There are pipe-dreamers that are still campaigning for Vince Young or Michael Vick to be signed. Regardless, Carson Palmer wouldn’t want to come to Carolina anymore than McNabb. Older veteran starters don’t want to go to a franchise that is rebuilding with a brand new coaching staff. 30+ yo starters want to go to a situation where “they” alone are the missing piece and not a team starting over like we are here in Carolina.
In addition, while I don’t think Jerry Richardson is “cheap”, he is definitely conservative when it comes to money and/or draft picks. I’m sure even he and Marty are well aware of recent draft busts and pick trades.
by chazatlas on Jan 24, 2011 3:23 PM EST up reply actions
Free agents have the luxury of hand-picking their team, chazatlas. Traded players do not.
I think you have to look at players under contract differently than you look at free agents. Sure, free agents can sign with whoever the heck they want to. And you’re right, most older free agents want to sign somewhere where they can win immediately. But players who are under contract typically don’t have a say as to who the trading partner is…unless their current team tells them to go find a trading partner. Players under contract are more similar to indentured servants.
So whoever ponies up the draft choices gets the player. Throw records out the window.
Let me hold about tree-fiddy?
Not gonna happen
The only way I can see Carson Palmer related to the Panthers, is if Palmer gets traded to ANOTHER team, and the Bengals are subsequently willing to trade for our pick in order to secure a franchise Qb.
Palmer not a bad idea
But that said, I don’t think it would be great. Price would be too much – provided Cincy is even willing to deal. Second, I’m assuming Palmer would want to be the man. I’m not sure how that fits with the philosophy of the franchise. Finally, Palmer really doesn’t impress me that much.
The more I think about it, I’d rather have Volek as QB than Palmer. Like many have said already the cost would simply be to high for a guy who may not be committed to playing anymore.
Member of Canes Country and the Cat Scratch Reader
I've always liked palmer and wish he didn't play for the bungles...
but it seems like my biggest aversion to the whole deal (price) is more than just a concern, and is the reality. It’s unfortunate, because I bet he would do really well down here, and would be a good model for JC ( I know stats aren’t everything, but he’s been the lone consistency in cincy while he’s been up there). At this juncture though, seeing as cincy is being quite adamant about not wanting to trade him (or just driving up the price), volek does seem like the more logical option. Plus, you gotta believe that Volek would sign with us in a heartbeat to a) play for an OC that he is already somewhat familiar with and b) have a legitimate shot at starting for a young but talented team.
James
Found some front page material right here…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNpxcNdpWJ4&feature=player_embedded#!
Let me hold about tree-fiddy?
by ERL on Jan 24, 2011 4:17 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Damn!
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Follow me on Twitter
Get me once shame on you, get me twice shame on me, get me three times...
and I must be cheering for the most incompetent fan base in America! Come on people would you really accept ANOTHER USC Trojan!? We have tried these USC (so called) all stars before. How did that work us? Am I the only one who remembers the Keary Clobert experiment, have we already gotten over the entire Dwayne Jarret experience." Honestly I don’t have anything against the Trojans (defensive players), but their offensive player are nothing but hype in the NFL! Now I could be wrong, and correct em if I’m off, but I live in Cali and if you know anything about football, you know that it is religion on the college level, but around here it’s just something to do if you don’t have prior plans. They don’t take it as serious and they get three times more hype. they really remind me of Football version of the Duke Bluedevils. They make GREAT COLLEGE PLAYERs just not good professionals. If I never see another Trojan in Carolina colors it will be too soon!
Ryan Kalil?
"Sometimes the journey is better than the destiny."-John Fox
"Ever noticed that you can say "it is what it is" after anything? It’s the perfect cop-out. Sorry man, I didn’t mean to hit on your girl… But it is what it is!"-Southtunnel (previously El Bacon)
by Flowing Willow on Jan 25, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
Continuing to beat this drum......
Here’s two players to look at over the past two years.
Player A: 32 games, 61.2% completion, 6.7 YPA, 47 TD, 33 INT
Player B: 22 games, 60.0% completion, 6.6 YPA, 32 TD, 22 INT
Player A has started all 32 games the past two years, while Player B has been in and out of the starting lineup due to coaching decisions. Player B’s TD/INT would be 46/32 if set to 32 games.
Player A is Carson Palmer. Player B is Alex Smith.
Follow me on Twitter at @jakehbravesfan
All I have to say is.......
No thanks to player A
and
Hell no to player B
Stats are for losers -Bill Parcells
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Follow me on Twitter
I think one of the real reasons he wants out of Cincy is...
The big-headed duo of Ocho-Cinco and TO. I’d hate to QB for those assholes.
"Shoulda-Coulda-Woulda"
by Lions & Panthers Fan on Jan 24, 2011 6:09 PM EST reply actions
what we need
is a mentoring back up or a solid starter, secure in his starting spot so he doesnt feel threatened so he can mentor as a starter. Palmer is neither one of those.
by Penn Panther Fan on Jan 24, 2011 6:59 PM EST reply actions
delusional?
swap picks? The author’s smoking some bad weed. The asking price is a 1,2.3, and mike will get it. You would be in a four way bidding war with SF Seattle and Arizona. He was dominant once those morons who were flying home EVERY week at 4 a m Tuesday morning from L A to do their tv show got hurt and absolutely DID not even know the routes irrespective of how many passes T O caught.Those two would ask Shipley what route to run. FREELANCING. It never works. Simpson caught twelve balls in one game after having two receptions in two years and 13 games! To get a franchise QB will cost more than swapping a couple of picks and an exchange of first round draft choices. Be prepared to pay what the Vikings paid for Herschel Walker, give or take. And someone will. Or just give them Julius Peppers straight up. Oh, he’s in Chicago. I forgot.
by melkiperwannabe on Jan 25, 2011 5:09 PM EST reply actions
I would like to trade for Palmer.
He’s 31 and should have 3-5 good years. Think he would do well in Chud’s offense. I doubt Cincy would want #1 overall. I think the top 4 are pretty close (Fairley, Peterson, Bowers, and Green), so not a lot of benefit moving from #4 to # 1. I think a better option would be to dangle DeAngelo Williams or Steve Smith. Don’t get me wrong, I love both guys, but now is the time to get good value for them. We need a GOOD starting QB more than we need to keep either guy. I would still draft Fairley #1 based on what I know now, and pick up a WR, TE, CB and RB in the later rounds. I think Palmer will make Gettis and LaFell look a whole lot better, and with Edwards and another WR, we’ll be fine there, even without Green. I’m sure I’ll here some howls about trading popular players, but face it, we have to rebuild now, starting at QB most importantly.
I think it’s all kinda moot, as I see the Cardinals, Niners, or some other West Coast team being more attractive to Palmer.
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