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Around SBN: Nevin Shapiro Vows To Bring Down Miami

To FA, or not to FA?. That is the question.

 

I’m sure by now that all true Panthers fans know about "The Purge of 2010". All is not lost, however, but I feel some activity in Free Agency or trade is needed, and soon.

The Matt Moore vs. Jake Delhomme horse has been beaten down to glue, as has the #2 WR debate, so I’m going to focus on the Defense in this article..

As a quick recap, the Panthers lost Julius Peppers when they decided not to place another franchise tag on him. They released DT’s Damione Lewis and Maake Kemoeatu along with LB’s Na’il Diggs and Landon Johnson. They also have not offered a contract to UFA DT Hollis Thomas and decided to not tender S Quinton Teal.

These moves have freed up much needed cash and disposed of long term contracts to older players, and has opened the door for the younger players on the roster to gain experience and get on the field. What we have to consider is the comparison of what was lost, what remains, and what we can expect to gain from the upcoming draft, and if they balance enough to warrant not getting involved in scavengering from other teams.

In my opinion, the secondary is pretty much set as far as personnel is concerned. If the Panthers address depth in the draft, that will be great, but the core for a very solid secondary is already in place. With that said, I’m going to concentrate on DE, DT and LB.

 Defensive End

What we lost:

Player Snaps Tackles QB Hurries QB Hits Sacks
Julius Peppers 805 23 33 10 10



Currently on roster:

Player Snaps Tackles QB Hurries QB Hits Sacks
Tyler Brayton 718 34 24 10 5
Charles Johnson 450 13 22 2 4
Everette Brown 401 14 13 7 3

 

What we can expect from the draft:

 It’s pretty much a consensus that WR is the Panther’s greatest area of need, so the earliest we could expect to address DE is with pick 78. As the league becomes more pass oriented, the need for DE has grown and will continue to grow. Here’s a recap on the number of DE’s taken each of the last 4 years before pick 78: 2006-4; 2007-8; 2008-9; 2009-11.  It’s difficult to imagine much production from the 10th-12th best DE from the 2010 NFL draft class in his first year.

Star-divide

 

 

 

 Conclusion:

We need to address DE through FA or trade or to acquire a player that has been released. As you know, we lost a DE who was on the field for about 90% of the defensive snaps. If you compare Pepper’s production and playing time to Johnson and Brown, we can tell that we’ll be lacking. Will increase in playing time equate to increased production for Johnson and Brown? Obviously. But it’s doubtful Taylor, Moore, and the draft pick can provide enough quality snaps to make up the difference.

Suggestions:

  • Chicago recently released DE Alex Brown (after the acquisition of Peppers) He had similar numbers to Tyler Brayton and should be able to be obtained for a similar contract. Grab him!
  • Put on a band-aid with 34 year old Vonnie Holliday with a 1 year contract to rotate.

 Defensive Tackle

What we lost:

Player Snaps Tackles QB Hurries QB Hits Sacks
Damione Lewis 777 30 19 11 0
Maake Kemoeatu 528 36 9 1 0
Hollis Thomas 411 26 4 1 0

(Ma'ake Kemoeatu stats from 2008)

 Still on Roster

Player Snaps Tackles QB Hurries QB Hits Sacks
Nick Hayden 272 13 3 1 0
Tank Tyler 360 21 3 1 1
Lewis Leonard 370 17 1 1 1

(Tank Tyler's stats reflect approximation of full season based on partial. Leonard's 2008 stats)

What we can expect from draft:

Same situation as with DE. Our first opportunity would be either pick 78 or pick 112.  Here’s a recap on the number of DT’s taken each of the last 4 years before pick 78: 2006-5; 2007-3; 2008-5; 2009-8. The Defensive Tackle class is pretty deep this year. We could be best advised to target DT at 78.

Conclusion:

Again, we lost players who were on the field the majority of the time. Ma'ake Kemoeatu is coming off an Achille's tear, the most difficult injury to come back from effectively. Ed Johnson had pretty good stats with Indy in limited playing time, and Leonard should be more productive than in 2008, if healthy, but we still need help.

Suggestions:

  • Although he's on a 2nd round tender, couldn't hurt to try to talk the Titans into a 3rd and 6th rounder for Kevin Vickerson. No sacks, but good run stopper in rotational role.
  • Maybe offer 2011 5th round pick to Washington for Anthony Montgomery. Hasn't lived up to potential but has starting experience and may need change of scenery.

Linebacker

What we lost:

Player Snaps Tackles QB Hurries QB Hits Sacks
Na'il Diggs 411 27 2 2 0
Landon Johnson 174 13 1 1 0

Currently on roster 

Player Snaps Tackles QB Hurries QB Hits Sacks
Jon Beason 1046 121 2 1 3
Thomas Davis 417 50 2 0 2
James Anderson 525 41 2 2 1
Dan Conner 78 8 1 0 0

(Thomas Davis was off to a monster start before the injury)

What we can expect from the draft:

Based on need, the earliest we could expect to address LB depth would be in round 6. We might get some situational depth at best.

Conclusion:

We are in a better situation with LB than either DE or DT. The two we lost were not particularly effective but we have special teamers among the warm bodies listed as LB, so we could still use at least one LB.

Suggestions:

Carolina has done well in the past with picking up released situational players. We could use a LB via this method this year.

*****

The Panthers have the players to put a very good defense on the field. The problem comes from lack of depth at the key positions. If the offense could sustain 7-8 minute drives for TD every series, giving the defense time to rest, we may be good with what we have. But, of course, that's not going to happen. Hopefully the offense wont be putting the D back on the field as much due to turnovers this year.

I feel like we are about 3 acquisitions away from being very solid.

We've already lost out on several good UFA's, even if they were "old", who went to teams on 2 or 1 year contracts. We also lost out on a few RFA's as well.  If we aren't going to make any further moves in FA, I hope we come up with some gems after the draft when teams are dumping players.

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when did tyler brayton get 10 sacks?

the link to his stats said he only had 5 this year and 15.5 total for career

by vitzeng on Apr 5, 2010 3:10 PM EDT reply actions  

His two years in Carolina have resulted in 9.5 sacks, according to his NFL.com profile..

So, based on the source, I’m sure some could have him listed at 10. (I, for one, don’t agree with half sacks. If you get to the QB, you get to the QB, it should be a sack. The NFL disagrees, though. Imagine that. ha.)

by D-Ranged1 on Apr 5, 2010 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think we only get a DT if it's tremendous value.

Tyler, Leonard, and Irvin we have all spent reasonably high draft picks on. Johnson has experience with Meeks, and Hayden and Landri could be replaced.

DE, I like Brown, then add a rookie, we’re set. We could have Brown bookends. :D

LB, some vets, maybe a late round rookie, Eric Norwood, I’m not concerned.

Jake Delhomme, QB Carolina Panthers, 2003-2009.

120 TDs+16000+ passing yards=Good

89 INT's+27 lost fumbles=Bad

Most comeback wins since 2003=Priceless

by Flowing Willow on Apr 6, 2010 3:33 AM EDT reply actions  

Considering I never know what Fox is going to do

if one of the good LB’s falls, like Spikes he could be the ‘value’ pick just as Conner was 2 drafts ago

I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com

by Jaxon on Apr 6, 2010 8:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

Could be, but I doubt it's Spikes.

Dude couldn’t even crack a five second 40, add in the eye-gouging incident, and that means he’s a terrible fit for us. Expect a 3-4 team to pick him up around the fourth.

Jake Delhomme, QB Carolina Panthers, 2003-2009.

120 TDs+16000+ passing yards=Good

89 INT's+27 lost fumbles=Bad

Most comeback wins since 2003=Priceless

by Flowing Willow on Apr 7, 2010 4:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

why are the Panthers dragging their feet?

I tell you what Will Witherspoon is there and he was a big asset to them a couple years ago. He played all LB positions because of the injure prone Dan Morgan. They should pick him up right now, freshly cut from the Eagles. Javon Walker is another guy that could possibly fit and take some pressure off 89 for the big play. I like our safeties but they all seem like the same player except for Harris. Hamlin is there from the Cowboys. If the Panthers do not make a run for Campbell they are retarded; he would be low risk, not wanted in Washington and not a whole lot of buzz. He has great height and vision, good athlete that can move out of the pocket and make throws. It only makes sense and that’s exactly why it probably will not happen. I am a frustrated Panthers fan right now and I wish they would just make one move to prove that they are at least willing to compete.

by Jacob Robinson on Apr 6, 2010 7:46 PM EDT reply actions  

We signed Moore and cut Jake

That not enough?

Jake Delhomme, QB Carolina Panthers, 2003-2009.

120 TDs+16000+ passing yards=Good

89 INT's+27 lost fumbles=Bad

Most comeback wins since 2003=Priceless

by Flowing Willow on Apr 7, 2010 4:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

????

no thats not enough. we already had Moore signed. all he did was sign a tender for free agency, so he could stay here.

by Jacob Robinson on Apr 7, 2010 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

No, he was a RFA.

Had we not tendered him he would have walked. And we put the high tender on him to insure we kept him. Commiting to a guy who has a 6-2 record against playoff teams in his career seems like a commitment to winning to me, what about you?

Jake Delhomme, QB Carolina Panthers, 2003-2009.

120 TDs+16000+ passing yards=Good

89 INT's+27 lost fumbles=Bad

Most comeback wins since 2003=Priceless

by Flowing Willow on Apr 8, 2010 3:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

I totally disagree with all of these players.

Witherspoon and Walker are pretty much washed up. We’ve already had the Campbell discussion, but to recap……NO THANKS. I’d be ok with them picking him up after the Skins release him, but not for ANY compensation. He would be our BACK UP QB, not the starter as you have suggested before because THAT would be retarded.

by ALAC on Apr 17, 2010 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Too late!

Witherspoon is a Titan. I agree, they should have made a move to bring him back for depth.

by bhwells29 on Apr 6, 2010 9:45 PM EDT reply actions  

no

thats 8 games, half a season. you would be willing to give your kid the keys to the Ferarri just because he passed half the driving test? 6-2 against playoff teams? dude the saints didnt even play their starters. The vikings game was a game our defense got three turnovers and moore ran three drives for short distance TDs. that was the Panthers most complete game of the year. other than those three short TDs he did very little. The Giants were terrible last year and they didnt make the playoffs. Tampa Bay? not a playoff contender. Where is the 6-2 against playoff teams?

by Jacob Robinson on Apr 8, 2010 2:07 PM EDT reply actions  

I wish you were here about a month ago, when this was argued ad nauseum.

The Giants would have been a playoff team, had we NOT beaten them — the Vikes WERE a playoff team, and were playing for home field advantage (however we kicked their asses. Don’t tell me Moore had nothing to do with that win! 299 yds passing, and it would’ve been over 300 but for kneel downs; don’t say they were short passes, two were for 45 and 55 yds, with completions to 9 different receivers.) We would’ve beaten the Patriots, too, but for the fact that the defense couldn’t keep Wes Welker from catching a zillion balls — Moore had a TD and hit 7 receivers in that one.

I’m not gonna keep debating it. You’re entitled to your opinion. but I can’t see where it’s based on facts, just unsupported bias. I think he’s passed more than half the test, as you call it. One good game could just be a fluke, two or three shows great promise, what Moore’s accomplished, with consistency, earns the job, and should get the respect of any Panther fan.

by bigdavis on Apr 8, 2010 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

“you would be willing to give your kid the keys to the Ferarri just because he passed half the driving test?”

Who said anything about a Ferarri? We can’t fit our whole team in a Ferarri. I’d say he’s getting the keys to the van.

“dude the saints didnt even play their starters.”

Blame their coaches for not putting them in the best situation to win. It’s not the Panthers responsibility to make sure opposing coaches do their job adequately. They field their chosen 11, we field ours, after that, it’s a game football.

“The vikings game was a game our defense got three turnovers and moore ran three drives for short distance TDs.”

So he amassed 300 yards and posted his highest number of completions, attempts, and avg. yards/pass attempt of the season all on short fields. Wow! Got’cha.

“The Giants were terrible last year and they didnt make the playoffs.”

And why didn’t they make the play-offs? Anyone? :)

“Tampa Bay? not a playoff contender”

You’re right. How dare we have not thrown him to the wolves in his first start since Dec. of ’07. We should have held him out specifically so he could have his first start of the season again New England. That makes perfect sense.

by D-Ranged1 on Apr 8, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't beat him up too bad D-Ranged

He’s only been here a week or so…

Seems I recall Jake led one come from behind victory and he was given the keys to the Ferrari…which by the way…describes our running game very well!

I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com

by Jaxon on Apr 14, 2010 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ok ... let's prove this fallacy wrong as well.

Re Vikings Game:

Here are the starting field positions for every Panthers scoring drive. (How Carolina got the ball in parentheses)

CAR 29 (Missed FG)
MIN 49 (Punt)
CAR 23 (Punt, with 10 yard holding penalty assessed)
CAR 20 (Punt)

So, the closest the Panthers were to the end zone on any scoring drive was midfield – hardly a “short distance TD” as you like to call it. The other scoring drives were 71, 77, and 80 yards – how in the hell is that a short distance when it is 3/4 or more of the length of the field? Perhaps you went to get a beer or take a leak when Moore hit Smitty and Barnidge for those deep bombs and you just thought he had a short field to work with?

And as for the defense dominating the game? There were two turnovers – 1 fumble and 1 interception by Hitman in the end zone. The Panthers didn’t score on the fumble, and the pick was at the end of the game.

By the way, here is my source: the official box score and stats provided by the NFL. They have this feature where you can click a box and read play-by-play what happened – it’s a great tool to weed out bullshit that makes no sense.

In short: if you want to discredit the accomplishments of Matt Moore, go right ahead, but bring better (and more accurate) ammunition with you. Information on NFL games is widely available and free – why don’t you try looking something up before making a nonsensical argument in the future? Thanks.

As long as the Panthers don't trade for Michael Vick or draft Tim Tebow, my sanity (what's left of it, at least) will remain intact for 2010.

My Panthers Blog | My Twitter Page

by BW Smith on Apr 8, 2010 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

And I'd like to point out that by the Saints game

we weren’t playing all of our starters either. Moore didn’t have Smith, Otah, Gross, or Williams. 3 of our best players on offense were out.

Jake Delhomme, QB Carolina Panthers, 2003-2009.

120 TDs+16000+ passing yards=Good

89 INT's+27 lost fumbles=Bad

Most comeback wins since 2003=Priceless

by Flowing Willow on Apr 9, 2010 3:50 AM EDT reply actions  

saints

The saint were only worried about the playoffs. the panthers at that point were just a getting paid to show up thing. I think I saw drew brees wearing flip flops on the sideline. (before you guys go get all butt hurt and look up film footage to see if you can see the flip flops, it was a joke) stat boy.

by Jacob Robinson on Apr 9, 2010 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

oooo, calling us butt hurt

That’s sure to win you some points. I’ve already stated this, everyone on the roster was playing for their jobs. The Saints backups probably thought this was their chance to make an impression and potentially get a shot either in New Orleans or somewhere else. Every game means something in the NFL, if it doesn’t to you, then you won’t play for much longer.

Jake Delhomme, QB Carolina Panthers, 2003-2009.

120 TDs+16000+ passing yards=Good

89 INT's+27 lost fumbles=Bad

Most comeback wins since 2003=Priceless

by Flowing Willow on Apr 10, 2010 2:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

Jacob....no need to get offended and start the name calling

(Previous offensive name-calling has now been hidden).

This is actually just typical back and forth banter for this site…you made your position clear and others simply presented a counter argument, without name calling. We’re just bored as hell waiting on the draft!

I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com

by Jaxon on Apr 14, 2010 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

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