The laudings and lamentations of an App-Panther
by Tater596 on Oct 11, 2010 5:34 PM EDT
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Print4/23/10 - It was a cool spring night. I was on my way to Asheville for a weekend trip with my girlfriend. Round 1 of the NFL draft was in the books, and the text had already come in that the Panthers selected Jimmy Clausen with their 2nd round pick in the NFL draft. I was fairly indifferent to the pick, seeing as though my other college team is Tennessee, and we aren't particularly fond of the youngest Clausen boy (he backed out of his commit to UT to attend ND). Nonetheless, I thought it was good value, and though I didn't like him personally, I could not deny his ability at QB. So, after receiving the news, i slid the phone back into my pocket and turned up the tunes, content to wait for the later rounds of the NFL draft the following day.
A short time later, the world turned on its head...
I was bombarded by phone calls and text messages from my Appalachian brethren that the Panthers had moved up in the draft to select the one... the only...
... The Armanti.
"With the 89th pick in the NFL draft, the Carolina Panthers select... Armanti Edwards, Quarterback, Appalachian State"
I cannot put into words the joy I felt! My team... my Carolina Panthers... had just selected my favorite college player of all time to play for them. I didn't need to form a new moderate interest in some other random NFL squad for the sake of following my favorite player, he fell right into my lap. I started dancing with the steering wheel... chanting... (to the beat of Conga line music)
Ar-Man-Ti is a Pan-Ther! Ar-Man-Ti is a Pan-Ther! Ar-Man-Ti is a Pan-Ther!
via media.charlotteobserver.com
*pictured above: Armanti Edwards (center); thousands of App Fans pissing themselves in excitement (out of frame)
That terrified my girlfriend by the way, she is still with me... so I must have SOME endearing qualities...
I spent the rest of the drive as happy as could be, and stayed that way until we settled into bed that night, when in reflection, I may have just mumbled to myself, "Armanti is going to be playing WR for the Panthers? Yikes."
So let me get this straight, my favorite college QB is going to learn a new position at a professional level, from an offensively inept coaching staff, while trying to catch balls from either an inexperienced quarterback or a rookie, with no veterans in place to really learn from (we all know Smitty flies on his own, expecting him to mentor young WRs was never really in the cards), and all the while doing this in front of a fairly fair-weather fan base? Double Yikes. Oh by the way, we traded next years 2nd rounder to get him, so now that fan base is going to have unreasonable expectations about his development cycle. Triple Yikes.
But not one to dwell on such grim points for very long, I decided that I couldn't wait to log onto CSR and share my joy that we had drafted Armanti, and talk about what a great player he would be for us in the future. After all, I had watched him perform miracles with both his arms and his legs on a weekly basis. Game saving touchdown drives, ankle-breaking runs, breadbasket passes, water into wine, division by zero, peace in the middle east...
Okay, maybe I got carried away... but I was pumped that he was going to get to bring some of that raw athleticism and play-making ability to my favorite NFL team.
And then... the season started. Matt Moore fell to pieces right out of the gate and the running game sputtered, thanks in part to an offensive line playing well below its potential. Inserting Jimmy Clausen appeared to make some difference for the better, until Steve Smith went down with a high ankle sprain, and Dwayne Jarrett decided to get his drink on. Of course, this all compounded by the fact that we have a large rotting tree stump as out offensive coordinator, and a lame duck in the pond at head coach. Not exactly the kind of learning environment we want for a project WR conversion. It would really just be great if he could keep his head low and deep in a playbook, and get reps in live action only when every single pass wasn't being surgically dissected by every single member of the fan base. But it was not to be...
Now we hear calls for him to get his chance at QB, then we get counter-calls saying that he isn't capable of being a quarterback, then we get insults and ad hominem posts where people just in general are very angry. Not really at Armanti, but angry at the people who relentlessly support Armanti to an unreasonable point. Then we get the group that is so sick of the whole discussion, that they wish we never drafted him in the first place... and it is that last sentiment that I fear the most. In effect, there are so many people here that love Armanti, that it has made a lot of people hate him. It has made it so that instead of talking with my fellow fans about my favorite player, I have to be very quiet, or choose my words very carefully to avoid accusations of being an unreasonable App State homer. Most of the time, now, i just try and keep my mouth shut and watch as the verbal abuses continue between members.
Well, I am sick of it, and I am asking for people on both sides to calm down, stop with the attacks, and just be Panther fans. We should all want to see him succeed, and there should be absolutely none of us that regret drafting him yet. There should be no division in this fan base.
To the App fans: Trust me, I know what it is like. We have watched Armanti make some amazing plays on the football field, and it can be VERY frustrating watching him ride the pine so much of the time, especially when we are losing. But we also need to acknowledge what he is. He was drafted by the Panthers to be a receiver first and foremost. His potential as a gadget QB and/or as special teams return-man comes second. It is important that he focuses on this role so that he can have a long and prosperous career. Yeah, it is incredibly exciting to watch him get a few shots at QB, but I would take a well run slant pattern where he makes a nice catch and run for a first down way before I would take a rollout run for 8 yards.
To those who have become discouraged: Don't hate the player because of the fan. A lot of these guys have watched this player do some amazing things with the football, and it is a natural reaction for all of them to want to see the ball in Armanti's hands when things aren't going well. He has performed at a high level time and time again when put in that situation. Opinions about the competition he faced, or the talent surrounding him can certainly vary, but when a player proves he can be relied on in a clutch situation at any level, you have to respect that mental toughness no matter where he goes. The App State faithful have watched this man win, time and time again, and want the same thing for the Panthers. They are passionate about seeing Armanti play because they are passionate about seeing the Panthers have a chance to win.
Fans on both sides of this "issue" need to start being more reasonable and accommodating of their fellow fan. We are all in this together. Both sides have their excellent points, and their flaws. But ultimately they can all agree that they want to win, and they want to see all 53 of our players succeed. So please... for the love of football...
Can't we all just get along?
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+1 Dude, Well Said
The anger and insults need to stop. Why is everyone getting so worked up over whether we might speculatively take out Clausen for a few plays and letting Armanti play QB? As an 0-5 team, what could we lose from that?
Anyway, I’m not an App State homer like yourself, but I’d personally love to get a better glimpse at Armanti at QB because he really has the potential to be Michael Vick.
Rec’d dude, good stuff
You got my rec too Tater!
Panther fans should not take their frustrations with the season out on other fans who disagree on how to right the ship.
I bet I know one thing we can all agree on. This offense needs play makers and Edwards has a history of being one. If it’s not ain Wildcat type formations then in some other capacity. He can’t be any worse than what we have seen at WR not named Smith. I’m not trying to take away from David Gettis, he has already exceeded expectations but we need a guy that can make a couple people miss and take it to the house.
I absolutely support Armanti at whatever position our coaching staff plays him. I honestly can’t think of anything outside of unnecessary negativity as a reason why Armanti should not be given a chance at multiple positions. I know that we all like to think we know everything and why he will do this but won’t do that, but until he proves one way or the other, I refuse to cast judgement. I just say give’em the chance.
Overall Panthers Draft Grade: A
These are my feelings on Edwards:
People react strongly one way or another when something they’re passionate about is challenged. For Appalachian State fans that passion is the fervent belief that Armanti Edwards is an NFL caliber QB because if he is it not only justifies their belief in him as a player, but validates their 1-AA program while also proving that small school guys can make it just like the 1-A guys can.
When someone has this fanatical belief (and I use that in the purest sense of the word) they get understandably riled up when somebody challenges their belief.
Now herein lies the other side of the coin. For those who aren’t App State fans, or those who don’t have those same beliefs Armanti Edwards is a 1-AA QB who the Panthers are trying to turn into a WR and have a hard time understanding why the Carolina Panthers would spend what’s tantamount to a 2nd round pick on a very risky prospect, trying to convert a player from QB to WR. The success rate for such an undertaking is rather low, and so is the ceiling. Realistically Hines Ward is the only QB turned WR who’s justified his draft position.
So now we get to the crux of the issue: The QB position. It seems honestly that sometimes rational discussion flies out the window when it comes to discussing the shortcomings of Armanti Edwards as a pure WR.
You bring up his height- It’s countered with allusions to Drew Brees or Doug Flutie
You bring up the competition he faced- One game against Michigan is constantly referenced
I think some people (me included at times) are frustrated with the manor that Edwards is given preferential treatment when it comes to critiquing him. As if referencing a rookie mistake he makes immediately invalidates his entire NFL career, even though it does nothing of the time. When people feel like they’re being accosted for pointing out a shortcoming they nitpick even more and thus a cycle spins out of control.
I wish we could sit down as a community and say “Here are the pros and cons of Armanti Edwards” and come to a conclusion about what he will, or wont be in the NFL. As it stands it appears the Panthers intention was to draft Edwards to be a slot WR, return some kicks and maybe be used in some gadget packages. That could defnitely change with time, and maybe a new head coach decides he’s the second coming of Michael Vick (just the good points). That being said, the obsession with Armanti Edwards as the Panthers starting QB in 2010 is tantamount to belief in the tooth fair, because there is not a single shred of evidence to believe the organization have any intention of using him in such a manor.
From my perspective: I’d rather discuss what Armanti Edwards IS to the Carolina Panthers, not what college fans WANT him to be.
In the brief glimpse yesterday I can safely say he’s a very dangerous weapon who should be active every week and we should run no less than 5 wildcat plays a game with him. I don’t believe he’s ready to be utilized in a receiving role, because he still needs to develop the hands for it.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James Dator on Oct 11, 2010 8:49 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Well said!
and Rec’d!!!
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
I hear all of that
And passion is what its all about. I would assume if this were a Saints board and Brandon LaFell were drafted, there would be a lot of hype for him too because of his LSU affiliation. Armanti gets a little extra hype because he is hands down the greatest athlete to ever come out of Appalachian. It would be like Peyton Manning playing for the Titans… a campus legend stays near the place that made him that way.
I think, and this is from my personal feelings, and watching the reactions of some others… a lot of the preferential treatment you speak of when critiquing him works both ways. App state fans get very defensive, because they possess the only real knowledge of what Armanti is capable of doing with the football (being the only ones who got to watch him play on a consistent basis) and then they get branded as homers when they try to give an honest opinion about his abilities. Sure, some go to far, but others try to give a realistic review of his capabilities… but in doing so get attacked for it. You can’t say something good, because then you’re a homer, but you can’t say something bad because then you’re a hater.
This is made worse by the fact that fans of I-AA teams have had plenty of time to develop a solid argument to address the most common attack on their team or player: “Well… congrats on your national championship in JV football.” aka the lower level of competition argument. They spent 4 years facing it when their player was in college, and now he becomes a professional, and they still are facing it. It’s frustrating, because there are definitely people out there who will not listen to anything you say because your guy didn’t play I-A ball. You can say “Armanti has a great arm” then someone who has no idea about his arm quality will step forward and say “no he doesn’t” and then when challenged to prove it, will go after the I-A vs. I-AA angle. It tends to get personal, because at that point it feels like an insult on your intelligence, that you have watched the guy for 4 years, but someone who hasn’t seen a single pass can dismiss your observations on one principle.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
caveat
Fans of I-AA squads made the choice to put up with this kind of thing when they decided to become a fan of or attend a I-AA school, the good ones in the bunch will make their points then agree to disagree when you come to an impass. Others will defend it to the death.
On that note… App may not be I-AA for long…
Appalachian State officially conductive feasibility study regarding a move to FBS
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
I hope they do go to FBS
They can legitimately compete, and such a move would do great things for their program.
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
I had a chance to speak with ASU Chancellor Ken Peacock over the weekend at homecoming
He stopped by our fraternities tent to have a BBQ sandwich and congratulate us on winning the homecoming crown in the Greek Division (I’m an alumnus of Tau Kappa Epsilon). So naturally I asked him about the study and his thoughts on moving to FBS. In talking to him, early indications are that it would be worth it both financially and competitively as long as they can get into a decent conference such as the Big East or even the ACC (however I don’t see how that ACC dream is going to happen unless someone leaves).
He is worried however, that Coach Jerry Moore would leave the team if they made the move. Everyone knows Coach Moore opposes us moving up, and can you blame him? He is way to old to try and lead a team into FBS competition.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
Re Coach Moore
He’s gonna leave eventually anyway — he’s what, like 127? (I kid)
Now is the best time to make the move, if like you said they can get into a good conference. (IMO, the Big East would be a great fit for them.)
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
Agreed on the Big East. I think that is the best fit.
In the Big East you have enough teams that are above average that you get some good competition, but you also have enough teams that are below average that you can hopefully put together decent seasons in your first few years in FBS. Not to mention, it makes the most sense for proximity to your competition as well as puts you in a position to recruit competitively.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
This statement is true, and revealing:
App state fans get very defensive, because they possess the only real knowledge of what Armanti is capable of doing with the football (being the only ones who got to watch him play on a consistent basis) and then they get branded as homers when they try to give an honest opinion about his abilities.
I think the same can be said for any player who enters the NFL. I’m sure if Notre Dame fans saw some of the things said about Clausen they would pick up their swords and shields and go to bat for him, same goes for Brandon LaFell and the LSU crowd.
People who didn’t watch Edwards regularly don’t know what he’s capable of… all the can do is evaluate what they see. They don’t have fond memories, or a ’c’mon, you can do better!’ blinder but rather they’re going on the assumption he’s nothing special until he shows it to us.
Ultimately it boils down to human nature. We all want to be right, and if someone disagrees with us we want to try and prove them wrong until we finally concede; there’s nothing wrong with that.
Nothing would make be happier than if all the App State fans are right about Edwards. Arguing that he’s going to be a bust is utterly pointless, and unfair. That doesn’t mean the thought that the pick spent on him could end up being between picks 32 and 36… and that does sting just a little bit
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James Dator on Oct 11, 2010 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions
i'm pissed that the Patriots have the greatest owner/GM
since the dawn of man… they keep getting more and more picks and they know what to do with them
Well he showed me a little something in game 5
Yeah it was only two plays, but I literally lost track of him on his 7 yd run between the defenders. His first gear is kinda like Smiths, which is great news.
As for the height stuff, App and Panther fans don’t seem to care about height because of both players I just mentioned. Smith is a beast yet a midget for WR, AE was a beast at app and a midget at QB. The two players have a lot of similarities, and I’m hoping AE will be Smith’s replacement in the future.
LOL that's funny I don't care who you are...
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
I agree and disagree
App is 30 minutes from me. I really don’t watch much college football. I went to some App games and yes, Armanti is a hell of a athlete. Yes, lower level players can succeed. Jerry Rice, Joe Flacco, Steve McNair, Terrel Owens, etc, just to name a few. Its the talent of the player, not who they play against. I truly believe Armanti will become a Welker like slot receiver, I really do. I think the problem people have and I could be wrong is that App fans speak as if he walks on water and turns water to wine. I saw him play in person several times, he IS a special talent, and with work will be good at slot. He has a strong arm, he has good feet, he makes sound reads, but alas he is 5’ 11" and 185. That is not saying he is horrible, just stating that is a little undersized for a QB considering most lineman OFF and DEF are over 6’ 2". Could he take the hits he will get in the pocket long term. Big difference getting hit by a corner or safety and getting mauled by a 6’6" 300 pound lineman. I’m not saying he has no chance of being a good quarterback in the NFL, simply saying the odds would be strongly stacked against it. Do you risk losing a special talent and athlete like him by throwing him to the monsters, or use his athletic gifts to let him flourish? College level be damned, his physical size and gifts put him at receiver or DB. Remember Flutie took one hell of a beating during his career.
As the great philosopher Yoda said "Try not! Do you must!"
These are the types of sentiments that cause problems
the obsession with Armanti Edwards as the Panthers starting QB in 2010 is tantamount to belief in the tooth fair
Comparing Edwards chances of QBing to a lame fantasy is insulting to Armanti Edwards and App fans.
Sure it’s an attempt at humor. But snarky and disrespectful all the same.
I don’t think ANY ASU fans believe Edwards has a chance to be the starting QB for the Panthers in 2010. Many may think he SHOULD be — and as long as Clausen and Moore are sucking it up, those people are probably right. Because unlike the other QB’s on our roster, Edwards is a proven winner, has a great arm, AND can be effective with his feet.
But to have this abilities constantly questioned by people who nothing about him is more ridiculous than having people who know how talented he is wanting to see him used to help the team.
Disrespectful... give me a frigging break
How does that ‘cause problems’… all I’m saying is that you’re living in a dream world if you think the Panthers have any intention of starting AE at QB in 2010.
Bravo on cherry picking one statement and trying to make an argument about it, it just goes on to prove my point. There are irrational people on both sides of the coin.
So if you want to take me saying it’s foolish to believe he’ll start at QB as some grand insult to the Mountaineer nation… then fine, we can revisit this after week 16 if you like and see if there was any fact to it.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James Dator on Oct 12, 2010 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions
Hell james you could have at least given us Santa Claus!
The tooth fairy is the most pussy fantasy of them all.
Plus, why include that snide remark in your post anyway? Just trying to get dig in obviously.
Pick whatever fantasy you want to believe in...
Santa Claus, the tooth fairy, the easter bunny… go for it.
I’m not trying to get a dig in, or insinuate anything. All I said was believing they intend to start his as QB in 2010 is a fantasy, and a waste of breathe as far as I’m concerned.
If someone said: “You know… Eric Norwood really should be starting at DE because I saw in at South Carolina and he’s a really devastating pass rusher” would it be some grand insult to the Gamecock nation to say “I don’t think he’s big enough to play DE, and besides the Panthers want him to be an OLB”?
I didn’t say “Armanti Edwards is a sissy like the tooth fairy” or “It’s a fantasy if you ever think he’ll be good” but what I did say, in it’s more pure form is “Believing the Panthers will start AE at QB in 2010 is the equivalent of believing in the tooth fairy” two equally impossible scenarios.
I didn’t cherry pick on one word because the rest of your post was yet another tirade on the under appreciation of Armanti Edwards which is pointless to address because it’s both been discussed ad naseum, and I gave him more than enough credit in my initial post.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James Dator on Oct 12, 2010 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions
obviously you only read what you want to read
I didn’t cherry pick on one word because the rest of your post was yet another tirade on the under appreciation of Armanti Edwards
You choose to gloss over this line in my comment
I don’t think ANY ASU fans believe Edwards has a chance to be the starting QB for the Panthers in 2010.
So bravo for cherry picking one word to start an argument.
It’s fine for you to make smart ass comments about the tooth fairy, but when I call you on it i’m the one starting the argument. Give ME a break!
Damn, you really hate the tooth fairy. Did she crap under your pillow when you were a kid or something?
Yeesh… let it go dude and stop being so sensitive over one simple statement.
That’s all I’m going to say because it is absolutely impossible to have a moderate, mild manored conversation about Armanti Edwards with you. Tater is passionate, but I think he has a better grip on the realities of the NFL and the Carolina Panthers than you do on this topic. It makes it impossible to even talk about it because you come to every single statement, and hang on every single word with this giant inferiority complex that is causing you to read everything as some grand attack on Armanti Edwards, and by extension Appalachian State.
So, the ball is in your court. If you want to quote a statement of mine how about this one, and we can see if we can have a normal discussion about it:
In the brief glimpse yesterday I can safely say he’s a very dangerous weapon who should be active every week and we should run no less than 5 wildcat plays a game with him. I don’t believe he’s ready to be utilized in a receiving role, because he still needs to develop the hands for it.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James Dator on Oct 12, 2010 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Look, i read your whole post and it had numerous points that everybody can agree on.
But what was the point in the tooth fairy line if it wasn’t to get a jab in there?
No ASU/Panthers fans came into this season with the expectations that Edwards would even get his shot at the starting QB job. We all know what he was drafted for. But i’ll be damned if i’m gonna read baseless comments on his inabilities by people who obviously don’t know what they’re talking about without correcting them.
Tater is being diplomatic about the situation. But i bet if he was honest with y’all (and himself), deep down he knows that Armanti would almost certainly have performed better under center (if given the chance) than Moore or Clausen has so far in this pathetic season.
C’mon Tater, be honest: Do you honestly believe that Armanti would not have performed just as good (if not better) under center than Matt Moore or Jimmy Clausen has this season?
re the "tooth fairy line"
It’s called a simile.
simile (noun): a figure of speech that indirectly compares two different things by employing conjunctions (like or as)
Let me break it down for you, since you obviously don’t get it.
Believing that AE will start at QB for the 2010 Carolina Panthers is ridiculous, because it is believing in something that WILL NOT happen.
Believing in the tooth fairy is ridiculous, because there is no such thing as the tooth fairy.
James used the tooth fairy line to illustrate just how utterly ridiculous your belief — and subsequent defenses of your belief — that AE should start at QB for the Panthers are.
It’s not going to happen. There’s not a damn thing you, me, or anyone not named John Fox can do about it, so get over it already. If you want to talk about Armanti, how about talk about him in respect to what he is: a good/great college QB who is learning how to play WR in the NFL, instead of what you fantasize for him to be: the starting QB of the Carolina Panthers.
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
Obviously you cannot read or choose not to
So let me make it real easy for you by block quoting myself from the very comment of mine you are attempting a smart ass reply to:
No ASU/Panthers fans came into this season with the expectations that Edwards would even get his shot at the starting QB job. We all know what he was drafted for.
Are you stupid or something? What about this do you no comprehend?
You're honestly going to say that you've never argued that he should play QB?
You’re basing your argument on one quote from this thread?
Are you forgetting all those arguments you’ve started about how he’s the “best qb on the roster” and that he should be the one starting?
And to answer your question: no, I’m not stupid. I’m quite intelligent, actually.
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
i suggest you go back and re-read my comments form various threads
Read them CAREFULLY and use your (supposed) intelligence to try and understand what exactly was said.
You want to argue with me about points that i actually have never made.
Have i said AE has the tools to be a NFL QB? Yes. have i said i would love to see him do that? Yes. Have i said AE has just as good (if not better) arm than other QB’s on our roster? Yes. Have i ever said that Edwards should be the Panthers starting QB? NO.
Do i think he could excel at that position if given the chance? Yes.
But you obviously don’t take the time to fully comprehend my thoughts before trying to argue against them.
And you don't try to comprehend what others are saying about Armanti...
before you defend him to the death and berate others because they don’t think he’s God.
It’s a two way street, pal. If you would argue your points like tater does, no one would have a problem with it, but you choose to be a dick towards anyone who doesn’t like AE.
For the record, this is the last comment I will make to you regarding AE. I’m physically exhausted from talking about him and am tired of wasting my breath on our 5th string WR and what he did in college.
So, if you want the last word, you can have it by responding to this comment, if it means that much to you.
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
I'm still of the belief that Matt Moore at QB gives this team the best chance to win this season
But if we’re forfeiting on 2010 season already, and going with unproven rookie QB’s that aren’t ready to contribute to winning, we might as well give AE his chance too.
I don't think he would, and here is why...
Why should we believe as Panther fans, that our coaching staff could formulate a gameplan to cater to Armanti’s unique skill set?
Giving Armanti the chance to succeed at QB for the Panthers or any team in the NFL takes catering an offense to exploit his particular strengths. Right now, I do not think our coaching staff is capable of doing that. They can’t even craft an offense to the skill sets of a traditional pocket QB. I also do not think that our young wide receivers are capable of the adjustments that are necessary to help a scrambling QB. They cannot even run their routes normally, much less know the appropriate time to break off their route and come back to the ball to give Armanti a target when rolling out of the pocket.
Making Armanti the QB is not a plug and play scenario here, and I feel that if handed the ball in backup duty on any given Sunday, he would be exposed to the same passing woes as Clausen and Moore. The advantage he would have, however, is the ability to pick up more yards with his feet. Does this give him a lot of upside? Hell yes it does. But it will only take a few plays for the defense to adjust to his style of play, and then you make him try to throw the ball in a situation not catered to getting him moving outside the pocket.
I think it is important for the future of the team to develop Clausen as the QB. But I also think it is VERY important right now (and forever hopefully) to show some diversity and creativity on offense. Right now a standard passing game is not working, so we ABSOLUTELY need to be creative in our ways to generate yards through the air. That is where the Mountaineer package comes in. We need to practice more plays involving that formation, because right now it is the only real offensive wrinkle we have. The utility of having a guy who can both throw and run can minimize the impact of bad pass blocking and bad wide receivers.
So overall, do I think that Armanti has his upside as a QB for the Panthers? Yes I do.
Do I think he should start? No way, but he should be involved in our offense to help give the offense some breathing room to work effectively.
Do I think he would have performed just as good or better than Clausen or Moore? Throwing the football… probably not. But generating some offense with his legs, absolutely.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
So... I take it you agree with my statements then Tater:
In the brief glimpse yesterday I can safely say he’s a very dangerous weapon who should be active every week and we should run no less than 5 wildcat plays a game with him. I don’t believe he’s ready to be utilized in a receiving role, because he still needs to develop the hands for it.
and in another thread where I said:
I would much rather us platoon with Clausen and Edwards out of the Mountaineer, because that way you’re truly giving the defense two entirely different looks, two looks that figure to be a staple of the Panthers for years to come. I don’t want people to confuse that statement with ‘Armanti Edwards should split time at QB’ because nothing could be further from the truth, but at least for the rest of the 2010 season it couldn’t hurt to run the wildcat as much as Miami does just to get a feel for how the offense can move with it being utilized.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James Dator on Oct 12, 2010 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree on both accounts.
We need diversity on offense. We need to provide different looks. The wildcat provided a great cushion for Chad Henne down in Miami, who was young and unpolished just like Clausen is now, it also helped out a WR core who had nothing special going on being headlined by guys like Ted Ginn Jr. and Greg Camarillo.
It plays to the strengths of our team. We drafted LaFell for his physical blocking, let’s put it to use on the outside blocking for Armanti or whoever he gives the ball to in the Mountaineer. Devin Thomas is apparently also a really good blocker, excellent, now we have two guys who are a threat to help on of our guys break a big one out of the Mountaineer. We drafted Gettis for his great combination of size and speed, let’s make him the deep threat out of the formation. We have a couple of great pass catching tight ends, they will make excellent 5 yard safety valves should Armanti need them. These are all things that play directly into our strengths and minimize our weaknesses, we just need the coaching staff to WAKE UP and start designing a game plan to make the best use of the players we have, and I don’t know if they are capable of doing so at this point.
We also need to be more creative within the plays where they actually do put Armanti on the field. The end around is something you attempt after you establish Armanti to be the primary threat in a given formation. Had we run the 2 plays in reverse order, we may have gotten a first down, and seen it more. We also need to see Armanti throw a few completions, to drive the point home that you indeed have to worry about his arm. He honest to god has a great arm, and is amazing throwing on the run… we need to exploit it, and fast.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
I grew up so poor that i only heard about the Tooth Fairy from other kids
I still hate that bitch, didn’t even leave me a nickel!
I can cherry pick too
Edwards is a proven winner
Edwards is a proven winner from a small school with little to no competition. The very fact that they beat Michigan proves that this argument doesn’t hold water because the level of competition they faced on a regular basis is questionable. For every “big win” the Mountaineers faced with Edwards, they also lost to a small, no name school.
Being a winner in any college institution does not mean you are a winner in a Pro setting. This argument just doesn’t have any factual backing to it. For every example you try to bring up to defend this position, there are probably 2 or 3 that can be used against it.
Being a winner in any college institution does not mean you are a winner in a Pro setting.
This.
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
Being a winner is about being a competitor.
Some of the most talented people in the world are natural born losers — they just don’t have the heart, mentality, or what ever you want to call it to impose their will on their opponent.
Conversely, winner’s consistently impose their will on superior opponents. Big school, small school, back yard….it doesn’t matter.
Oh you mean when Armanti imposed his will on Michigan...
And they won on that last-second blocked FG? Right…. I get it now, thanks.
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
Michingan was one game
Armanti won over 40X that many games in his App career.
And while Edwards is a winner and a competitor, i’m not speaking just about AE wiht this comment. I’m talking about winners in general.
Look at a guy like Mugsy Bouges. 5’3" with a the heart of a giant. He made a long successful career in the NBA imposing his will on bigger, more pedigreed and talented opposition. He is a true winner and competitor. Winners and competitors make their bread and butter defeating opponents that they are not supposed to defeat.
I met Muggsy sir...
and you don’t have to impose will when you are that damn fast with those kinds of ball handling skills. Jesus Christ he was like a blur at that camp of his I went to many a year ago.
As the great philosopher Yoda said "Try not! Do you must!"
Well, by the numbers, he did impose his will on Michigan...
17/23 for 227 yds, 3 passing TDs, 2 INTs
17 carries for 62 rushing yards and a rushing TD.
Sounds like a pretty good day to me, he certainly did everything he could do to win the game. It’s not like they marched him out there on defense or something. He led the offense in holding up their part of the bargain, defense stuggled a little (as expected) but they still held on and won the game.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
Based on your statistical evidence, I retract my statement.
You have proven, with facts, that my comment above was wrong, so kudos to you, Tater.
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
Then does being a loser in college make you a winner in the pros?
“In only three years in South Bend, Clausen left school as Notre Dame’s record-holder for career losses for a starting quarterback.”
(bleacher report)
The truth is, neither mean anything. It’s a whole different game.
How about some facts to back up your BS?
For every "big win" the Mountaineers faced with Edwards, they also lost to a small, no name school.
Sorry, but isn't this why the guy wrote the article??
So we’d stop bickering over the nothing?? Stop bickering about the tooth fairy and Armanti and how insulting it is or isn’t, or who said what?? Please guys….no mas!
It's exactly why I wrote it.
As John Fox would say…
“We just have to execute better”
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
Nice post Tater!
Rec’d.
By the way, are you planning on going to any more games this season? It would be nice to hang out in more ideal weather conditions. My feet are still wet from the Huddle Flood 2010.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
I actually have tickets to the Saints game
But there is always the random chance that someone offers me free tickets to whatever game is going on in a particular weekend. I have friends in companies that have tickets, and sometimes they go unclaimed and are passed down to me.
I think I have tailgate plans elsewhere for the Saints game, but if not I will swing by the Huddle tailgate again.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
And i was sick as a dog that following Monday too
No big surprise I guess.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
My son was too.
Still made him go to school though. Couldn’t have him missing football practice ya know.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
I have an idea...
…why the hell don’t we sign Lavenius Coles to the squad? He may not make much of an impact on the playing field, but if you saw Hard Knocks, he makes such a positive impact on his team and he would be a great mentor, along with Steve Smith, for our ridiculously young receiving corps (although I’m almost wanting to call them “receiving corpse” right now).
I think it would be a great move…league minimum contract or maybe just a tad more.
Who would we cut to make room?
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
receiving corpse. Hah!
I’ve honestly never looked at it that way… good one.
If he is such a great mentor, why don’t we hire him as an assistant coach… that is if the plan is just to have him teach these young guys.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
Where were you on april 23, 2010? A day that will live in infamy
I got the text that the Panthers drafted Armanti in a mexican restaurant. I won’t ever forget it. I was excited as an ASU alum and a Panthers fan. I believe that Armanti can help the Panthers succeed, and want to see him make the same kind of amazing plays on Sundays in Charlotte as he did on Saturdays in Boone.
But at this point, as an ASU fan, i wish Hurney wasn’t so damned smart for trading up to select Edwards. I wish that the Colts had selected him 9 picks later. That way i wouldn’t have to hear all of ACC/SEC fans hate on the man their teams should have recruited. Plus, if Armanti was a Colt, this year he wouldn’t be A) possibly the best QB on his team or B) stuck on a team in complete rebuilding mode with a lame duck coach. Peyton Manning would have already pegged Armanti as one of his go to guys, and he could be contributing on an offensive minded team and appreciated. Not hated on by the fans of a team that cannot successfully develop young WRs.
Nobody's hating on Armanti...
They’re hating on you. Let it go or reap what you sow!
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Bullshit
There has plenty or ignorant hating on Armanti — Wasted pick nonsense talk and other such bullshit.
You might be spiteful enough to hate him because of me, but you’re giving me too much credit.
In my opinion, the pick we used on Armanti was not wasted.
However, the pick we used to move up in the draft was. This team had/has too many needs to be giving away future picks for a wide receiver project. At least if they would have drafted him as a QB he probably would have gotten a jersey and a clipboard on week one. It sucks that he couldn’t even earn a uniform to start the season. Not his fault but it doesn’t make it better.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
Reap what i sow?
My opinion is that Armanti Edwards is talented athlete with the skills required to be a successful NFL QB. Shame on me for having such an opinion! Everybody should hate on me (and Edwards too) because of it!
Brilliant.
No, not same on you.
You are entitled to your opinion. What I mean is that if you continue to try to force your opinion on others, you can expect resentment and defensive posturing.
I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault. -Jack Tatum
It had to happen
This kind of year will be painful. Yet, it will solve alot of problems for the panthers later. Our youth will bring us success in the future. The lack of wins will allow the fair weather fans to jump ship and start cheering for another team. Of course, they’ll be back when we are winning again. Carolina is a young franchise and will NEED to take it’s lumps to solidify itself in history. We’ve endured a 1-15 record and came out of it with a super bowl appearance 2 years later. We will survive this and loyal fans will be rewarded in the future. Armanti will be a great player regardless of what position he plays…and I’m NOT an app fan.
Armanti throws the ball 70 yards in the air for aTD!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sMfdcCrnTU
I suggest EVERYBODY fast forward this video to the 3:00 mark and watch this ridiculous throw. The commentator says, “There are NFL QB’s that cant make that throw.”
My only comments are...
I kind of wish I had gone to App State now (still love my Graham Harrell & Michael Crabtree duo, of course), and I want to see more Mountaineer.
Anytime there is a question about Armanti's arm...
… that video should be exhibit A to the contrary.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
I will admit -- that is one hell of a throw.
"The truth will set you free. But not until it is finished with you." ~ David Foster Wallace
That throw
was just a tad bit further than the one that pickles left short to Lafell this past Sunday. Yes, that is sarcasm.
Just ask the Richmond Spiders what they think of Armanti
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FQQONgG3Y4
Check out the run at about 1:53
Yeah that wasn't a everyday game either
That was a game against probably the other best team in FCS. It was the FCS semifinals as well, and he made it look like he was playing against high schoolers.
Unofficial Agent for Armanti Edwards, WR #10, Carolina Panthers
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