Panthers Top 5 Players With 2009 Upside
by Jaxon on May 16, 2009 10:12 PM EDT
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We've had some good conversations on position battles to expect in the upcoming training camp. That made me think about who else I'm looking forward to seeing in camp and the preseason. More importantly who is going to lift their game high enough to make a significant impact on the Panthers season? So I think I've got my top 5 players who will exercise their ‘upside' in 2009.
5. TE Gary Barnidge
Barnidge was billed as a ‘downfield threat' when the Panthers drafted him last season. The Panthers could certainly use a weapon like that but Barnidge has to show he can make that play in the preseason. I will be watching to see if the Panthers run those stretch plays up the middle of the field to the TE. Hitting that play keeps the LB's from cheating up to stop the run. Barnidge has the size and speed to be that downfield threat if he can just convince the Panthers of that.
4. Ryne Robinson
We thought we had solved our PR problem when the Panthers drafted Robinson two seasons ago. He flashed potential at times his first season but still needed a little time to adjust to the NFL game. After losing the ‘08 to injury, I'm looking forward to seeing Robinson come back with a vengeance and win the spot outright. We haven't had excitement in the PR game since Steve Smith was back there. If Robinson can regain is speed and move past the injury he could provide some excitement in the return game.
3. FS Charles Godfrey
Godfrey went into the '08 draft labeled a ‘ball hawk'. For a FS he never shies away from run support and looks to deliver a big hit on any WR. But he has a lot of upside in the form of making plays on the ball. If Godfrey can get his head into the game plan and learn Meeks system he could be a big play kid in the secondary. If the Panther pass defense is going be improved this year the Charles Godfrey will need to be one of the reasons for it.
2. WR Dwayne Jarrett
We've been waiting patiently for the past two seasons for this guy to be the #3 receiver in Carolina. What the Panthers really need from Jarrett is for him to assume the #2 role. If anything I think Jarrett has matured and gained some confidence to go along with the impressive resume and athletic ability. We know this guy has soft hands and the ability to go high for a ball. It would be nice to see the Panthers go to Jarrett early and often in preseason. I'll be looking to see if they run some plays for him in the red zone.
1. RB Jonathan Stewart
As good as Stewart was last season I feel like he has just scratched the surface. His combination of power and speed and that devastating stiff arm will make many a highlight video in 2009. Even if he doesn't get more carries in ‘09 he could outshine his backfield mate DeAngelo Williams, though that will be hard to do. This could be the year when the Carolina running game is solidified as the identity of this team.
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That's not a devastating stiff arm.
It’s a “grab you by the chest and slam you to the ground” arm. The one thing JStew has over Deangelo is power. I didn’t think he would be able to drag guys like he did in college. I was wrong! But Deangelo’s strength is being able to make those 30+ yard plays in any game. Plus coming off an incredible, Panther-record setting season, I just can’t see Stewart upstaging him just yet… Maybe next year.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Jarret needs to become a #2 soon
You are right about that. But what would that do to our running game? Moose is one of, if not the, best blocking receiver in the league. That doesn’t show up on receiver highlights… But I don’t think we would have had the the success we did running the ball last year, if Moose hadn’t come back.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
I agree...
And I think Jarrett’s deficiencies in that department relative to Muhammad will keep him out of base formation sets in non-obvious passing situations.
by MichaelProcton on May 17, 2009 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Thats a high bar to set for the young WR
to be as good a blocker as Moose. The bar is there none the less though. Lets see this TC if the Moose’ tutelage makes Jarrett into a complete receiver. But you are right about Moose’s value to the running game. He can block a LB no problem, crush a DB and hold up a DE well enough.
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
It's obviously rubbed off on Smitty
I see him all the time, in the background of a big run replay, smashing into somebody. Jarrett definitely isn’t short of examples in that dept.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
by southtunnel on May 17, 2009 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions
About Jarrett...
The preseason might not tell us too much. He tied for the team lead in receiving with 13 catches with Dominique Thompson last preseason despite playing in only three games (at least 3-40 in each game, including a 6-56 in the finale), and third place was way down at five catches. That was 18% of the team’s completions, but it didn’t amount to much by the time the games mattered. His best game was a pretty pitiful 2-36 in the opener with Smitty suspended. I hope he contributes, but his real production just hasn’t been there.
As for some honorable mentions to this list:
Charles Johnson: A six-sack year out of a backup might imply he’s capable of a double-digit mark in a starting role under Meeks’ direction.
Chris Harris: It might be more of a bounce-back than a breakout, but with the numbers safeties like Bethea and Sanders put up under Meeks, Harris could approach his record-setting marks from his first year here. He didn’t play poorly, but his numbers weren’t really close to his debut campaign.
Jon Beason: Beason showed some prowess in coverage as an MLB last year, tying for the team lead in picks. Three of the last four years, an LB has led or tied for the lead in that category in Indy under Meeks, so he’ll likely be trusted with more chances to show his ball-hawking prowess. For our sakes, we’d hope Gamble is at the top (unless he’s being thrown away from), but Brackett and June have recorded 4- and 5- pick years in that span as MLB and ROLB, respectively.
by MichaelProcton on May 17, 2009 12:30 AM EDT reply actions
Good list for HM
Johnson could be the answer across from Peppers, if he gets the chance. Brown will be given a chance to show what he has.
Harris is more of a bounce-back candidate. He had a great first year but less than exciting second. “Bounce-back” sounds like another post!
After going to the Pro Bowl in his second season he doesn’t seem to have much more room to get better. Or does he? That would be something to see.
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
What I meant about Beason...
Was that with increased coverage opportunities combined with the abilities he’s already shown, he could be a real monster, even when covering the pass.
’07: 7 INTs+PBUs
’08: 11
’09: 15, 18, beyond?
Guys like Urlacher, Kirk Morrison, Thomas Howard, and London Fletcher have put up numbers like these, so it can be done from the LB position in a 4-3.
by MichaelProcton on May 17, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Jarrett
MP, I think you’re being a little harsh on Jarrett in the SD game. He was still the third receiver, behind Moose and Hackett. And Rosario was getting a lot of attention too. Also to Jarrett’s credit, he was only thrown to 4 times that game and had a big catch on that final drive for a first down. Not impressive but not exactly pitiful either.
I also like your HM list.
I didn’t mean that specific game itself as being a pitiful game. But for that game to be his best of the year, that is the pitiful part.
by MichaelProcton on May 18, 2009 3:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Jonathan just keeps getting better
As a Oregon fan living near Charlotte I have seen Jonathan play many times and he just keeps getting better and better. Don’t be surprise if, by the end of his career, he is as good as Emit Smith was.
Jacob Smith
That is high praise
Though Stewart would prefer to run over a DB versus juke him out of his shoes like Smith. For all the focus on Jake his best play this season will be handing off the ball
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
As it should always be...
Our game plan for every game should be to dominate in the run game with the knowledge that Jake can win it for us if we’re within a score at the end of the game like he’s done more than any QB in the NFL since he became the starter.
by MichaelProcton on May 17, 2009 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Are you suggesting Jake has more 4th quarter comebacks than any other QB over the last 5 years? Is that true?
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Yes...
It’s been cited many, many times.
by MichaelProcton on May 17, 2009 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I have heard that, but only from Jake advocates
Wasn’t sure if it was fact. I’m sure Peytons up there somewhere. I’d like to see where Jake falls on the all time 4th quarter comeback list. Post a link if anyone can find one.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
by southtunnel on May 17, 2009 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions
It's been discussed on many a broadcast...
And here’s a link from another board putting it at 18 total at some point last season: http://www.carolinahuddle.com/forum/605-jake-delhomme-18-4th-quarter-come-behind-wins-8.html
by MichaelProcton on May 18, 2009 3:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Went to school with Robinson
Kid was a great athlete, baseball player too…Should be dynamite when healthy
definitely not Steve Smith
If Ryne Robinson has a lot of upside, I have yet to see it. His numbers from two seasons ago were not horrible, but he did not display the ability to break it loose and score every time he touched the ball like Steve Smith. Robinson doesn’t even seem to have the big play ability that Rod “he hate me” Smart had. Now, after a year off from injury i would be very surprised to ever see him excel at the NFL level. Dependable maybe. But never outstanding.
The most important part of PR/KR is not turning the ball over. But wouldn’t be nice to have a scoring threat fielding punts and returning kicks?
During the preseason I’d like to see Mike Goodson & Kenneth Moore get opportunities to touch the ball on special teams and try to make plays.
Robinson's stats over the last two games of his rookie year:
15.5 YPR on punts
33.3 YPR on kickoffs
Personally, I’ll take those numbers from our returner (whoever it is) any day.
by MichaelProcton on May 17, 2009 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Goodsen will take Robinsons job
I just got this feeling that if we are going to see Smith-like PRs again anytime soon, it will be from Goodson. He’s another little guy with a chip on his shoulder, with an average name, who knows how to shake and bake.
I am definitely on the Mike Goodson bandwagon. Remember this come September. I want to hear you were right, or you moron… one way or the other.
Do you need to see it again?…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoZeiAIJKMY
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
by southtunnel on May 17, 2009 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions
What about Charles Johnson??
I cannot believe that this list was made, and did not even reference Charles Johnson. I think he should be at the top of the list behind J Stewart. Johnson was a potential first round pick who slid to us in the 3rd, and has since been a backup. This past season as a backup to Julius and Brayton, he had 6 sack with very limited reps. His physical abilities are just starting to emerge and he is starting to get a grasp on the game. Look for Johnson to replace Brayton as the starter opposite Peppers this year…
Also, I agree that D Jarrett will emerge this year. I think that between Ryne Robinson, Jason Carter, and Dewayne Jarrett, one of these three will emerge as a significant 3rd pass option behind Moose and Smitty. Jarrett really demonstrated that he is ready to take on this role last year, as he caught almost everything that went his way, although he got very few thrown his way. Look for him to be a significant pass option and red zone man…
And thirdly, it would be near impossible for Godfrey to not improve this year. Last year was abysmal for the secondary at times, and I think much of that blame was due to Godfrey and not Lucas so much. Godfrey simply looked lost at times last year. He definitely has room to improve and now has some starting experience to give him confidence. It is possible that he might take on more of a Minter/Leadership role in the secondary, lord knows we need that with a very young and inexperienced group of C-backs
I hear you about Johnson
but will his snaps suffer with Brown on the roster now? I would love to see it but with pep still on the roster and one more player getting snaps he might have less opportunity to make big plays and sacks. I would love nothing better than to see him excel on every down and make Brown wait his turn.
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
As stated above...
I agree with you on Johnson. I do think your commentary on Jarrett is a bit hyperbolic, though. On 19 targets last year, he made 10 catches, and he didn’t go 100% on any game where he saw more than one throw come his way. Finally, I agree with you; I sure HOPE Godfrey can improve in his FS coverage support role.
by MichaelProcton on May 18, 2009 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Not all 19 were catchable
Not every ball Jake threw to Jarrett was catchable. Also, don’t know what you mean about Jarrett not going a 100% when the ball was thrown to him more than once. He made some nice catches and at times while taking some big hits, but still managed to hold on to the ball. Out of his 10 receptions, 9 of them went for 1st downs.
That's a fair point...
But, still, compare Jarrett’s 53% catch rate (10/19) to the guys who caught more balls than him:
Steve Smith: 60% (78/129)
Muhsin Muhammad: 60% (65/108)
DeAngelo Williams: 73% (22/30)
Jeff King: 64% (21/33)
Dante Rosario: 58% (18/31)
DJ Hackett: 46% (13/28)
So we see that there was perhaps a reason the #3 WR wasn’t getting many looks, no matter who it was.
The 100% comment referred to the fact that he never caught all of his targets except in games where he was only thrown to once. Hard to get yourself and the QB in a rhythm if you can’t catch more than one ball in a row.
by MichaelProcton on May 18, 2009 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions
He's just a young lad
He was mere kid at 20 years old when drafted. He couldn’t even go out and celebrate by drinking a beer after he was drafted, at least not legally. He started to catch on last season and I have every reason to believe he’ll progress this season. He has learned a lot from Moose and will continue to learn from him. Have no worries, Jarrett will be making some big plays on a regular basis this season.
“Hard to get yourself and the QB in a rhythm if you can’t catch more than one ball in a row.”
True, but it’s also hard for a WR, a young inexperienced WR, to get in a rhythm when he’s only playing in every other game and then only seeing the ball thrown to him a couple of times. I believe he’ll take a big step forward this season with Hackett gone. I do think Jarrett will be the #3 WR at the beginning of the season and will see more playing time allowing him to get in some type of rhythm with Jake. They’ll do good together, Jake and Jarrett. Jake already stated that Jarrett catches everything thrown to him, but that he needed to learn the other stuff better, which Moose has been a big help with in teaching him.
Again...
I’m with you. I certainly hope he develops, and the third year is typically a big one for wideouts.
by MichaelProcton on May 19, 2009 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Those stats are bogus. You can’t compare a +108 sample vs a 19 sample. And you can’t compare RB, TE, and WR like that. Different positions, different plays, different defenders. Also, how many times did Jarrett go in on obvious passing downs, e.g. third and long? Leave those crazy stats for baseball, not football. Bottom line, Jarrett has excellent hands.
Now if any one wants to start a debate on why our #3 WR’s numbers are low, I am all for it. Is it Jake, the system, or just the #3 position? Hackett and Jarrett sure have enough talent. I just don’t expect big numbers from the #3 WR for the Panthers. Big plays maybe. Jarrett has the size and hands to make big plays like Ricky Proehl back in the day.
"Hackett and Jarrett have enough talent?"
Hackett was hurt for the majority of his stay, and Jarrett has shown nothing to prove that he’s even an average-level #3 WR in this league.
It is interesting, though, that Proehl, a guy at the end of his career, was the most successful #3 we’ve had. And I’ll throw you a bone, too: over 121 targets in his last two years here, he only made 59 catches (49%.) Maybe the #3 really is just looked at as a last resort and those throws are hurried, rushed, or otherwise unlikely to actually get there and allow the receiver to make the play. I doubt it, though. Oh, and if you’re going to call factual information bogus, feel free, but don’t expect to win me over.
by MichaelProcton on May 19, 2009 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Targets vs catches. That’s not a good stat. If anything, you should figure out how many drops Jarrett had. You can throw around stats on here all you want, but if you don’t put them in perspective, don’t expect to win me over.
Good stuff
I just think this was more relevant to what you were trying to say. ^^^^^ I’ll give you credit. You sure dedicate a lot of time to looking stuff up.
Moose 8 drops?
Compared to Smitty’s six who obviously had may more catches. That’s not too good, or Smitty is awesome. I’ll take either one
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
Well...
We’ve seen Moose have focus issues or whatever that have led to drops for a long time. You’re right, though, 8 is high. The only players in the league with more were Braylon (16), Dwayne Bowe (13), Brandon Marshall (12), TO (10), Calvin Johnson (9), and Roddy White (9.) All are the #1s on their team. Marques Colston, though, also had 8 in only 11 games.
by MichaelProcton on May 20, 2009 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions
What's funny about that list
is that Braylon and TO got lambasted for their butterfingers, but Bowe and Brandon Marshall, and certainly Roddy White and Colston, did not.
It’s funny how that happens. I attribute that to a drop at crucial time in a big game, and fans seeing the player’s entire season through the prism of that one dropped pass. That disparity’s just… odd. You don’t hear Lions or Falcons, or even Chiefs fans complaining about their #1. But you sure heard Browns and Cowboys fans.
by r3 on May 20, 2009 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Eh...
Much was talked about Marshall’s drops in fantasy football circles, and he generally has had some ball security issues, too. Colston, too, was discussed, because quite a few of those drops came during his slow start after the injury. Also, it might have to do with the larger-than-life egos and personalities of TO and Braylon. If guys act and talk like they’re the greatest thing since sliced bread, fans expect them to produce to that level, too.
by MichaelProcton on May 20, 2009 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep, I agree...
It’s mostly about expectations…either those set by loudmouths like TO…or the overall expectations that fans have of their teams based on past history.
Marshall fights for every yard
which is why he fumbles a lot. Sometimes it’s better just to go down than lose the ball.
by Flowing Willow on May 21, 2009 3:29 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh and Colston
was dealing with a finger issue, I know, he was on my team. That accounted for most of the drops.
by Flowing Willow on May 21, 2009 3:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh...
and frankly, catch:target is perfectly good stat. Leaders among wideouts included: Anquan Boldin, Wes Welker, TJ Houshmanzadeh, Anthony Gonzalez, Eddie Royal, Steve Breaston, Ike Hilliard, Steve Smith (NYG) Josh Reed, and Davone Bess. Those are some solid receivers.
by MichaelProcton on May 20, 2009 12:55 AM EDT up reply actions
How does this stat account for bad passes?
Not included? Who makes that call, drop versus bad pass?
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
I think...
If it hits you in the hands and don’t catch it, it’s a drop.
by MichaelProcton on May 20, 2009 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Jarrett will improve this year b/c of 2 main reasons.
- - Hackett is gone and so goes his much talked about targets. Jake was coming back from his surgery and was trying to get used to 2 new guys (for him at least) without being able to throw a football to them until tc.
- - It is his 3rd year and as stated by another, it takes many WR about that much experience to really blossom. Jarrett has a lot of untapped talent which is why we drafted him. He was considered a value in the 2nd round and many thought he could go as high as mid 1st.
It seems to be a consensus that Jarrett will improve next year. I see a lot of ability in him and think he will be a good pro. The only thing I see being a limiting factor is the offense we run and talent on it. With D-lo, Stew, Smitty, and Moose being our 4 bell-cows, there are just only so many opportunities to go around. If he can bust his butt in the off-season (in weight room, on the track, on the practice field, and in the playbook) he may start to take passing downs from Moose, especially in the red zone.
Will Parker
Good points on Jarrett
His size should be a weapon in the red zone
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
Agreed
Jarrett’s size and hands will be a commodity this season, hopefully. It’s tough going for a 3rd WR in our offense, but that shouldn’t be used as a crutch. If he can grasp the offense intuitively and react to the football then we’re looking at a good red zone weapon. The x-factor (or x-factors, plural) is going to be the emergence of Robinson/Goodson/Carter and if they’re going to be getting reps at WR. Carter showed some nice flashes of play-making ability in TC and PS last season, until the injury. The same can be said of Robinson until he was injured as well. Goodson…well, we don’t know much about (except for what we see on youtube) but there was discussion of him playing in the slot.
I was pleased when the Panthers took Jarrett, because I expected an immediate impact. However, as it’s been stated over and over—the 3rd year for a WR is usually his ‘maturity year’ or ‘breakout year.’
by boywonderncsu on May 20, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions
The only way I see Jarrett contributing...
…in any significant manner is if he can demonstrate he’s applied himself to learning the playbook and bettering his technique in all the little areas an NFL-caliber receiver needs to do. Can he be a good redzone weapon? Yes. But only inasmuch as he learns how to run his routes, find the open seams, and then use his big body to his advantage by shielding off the defender. It’s got to be more than just relying on raw athleticism and his size. He needs to get more cerebral. And, unfortunately, I’m not 100% sure he has it in him. It’s good that Moose and Smitty are there to push him…and the other receivers who want a shot at being #3. It’s there for Jarrett to win it. The guy’s just got to apply himself to doing so.
I think for this year
expectations should be around Ricky Proehl numbers, clutch grabs on third down kind of stuff. Total season stats, I’d be happy with 25 or so catches, and maybe 2-3 TD’s. That’s realistically all we can expect unless someone gets hurt.
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