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Super Bowl Championship in 2011 for Panthers? It could happen...

 

WOW!!! It feels so good to see the kind of game we had against the Vikings. The game we know we are capable of. Steve Smith showed the nation why he is one of the elite, and Julius Peppers showed why he should get paid like one of the elite. The defense did their job all-around in stopping the great Peterson and “Old Man River” Brett Favre. The offense played its usual way in the first three quarters, but in the end many key players made great plays when needed. Did anyone know who Gary Barnidge was before the fourth quarter? Didn’t think so. But if you are a Panthers fan, you can’t help but to feel a sense of excitement. Yeah we know our season this year is done, but we have a feeling of excitement for the 2010-2011 season.  People think we are so far away from hoisting up a Lombardi trophy, but we know it’s ever so close.  This is indeed a bold claim. Winning an NFL championship is one of the hardest things to do in sports, so that is why I believe right now is so important.  I will tell you the moves that I feel would catapult Carolina to a promise land of football. Each action will lead to another action, until our championship team is finally complete. Some of these moves you may completely disagree with, and I will not blame you for doing so; just remember that great risks are needed for great reward, a statement you will hear many times throughout this article. So these are the ways I feel that we can finally put it together, here’s how…

HAVE FOX RESIGN. It is sad that we have gotten here to this point, but this is only for the best. People may say that I am being too harsh to a great coach, a coach that has brought many of us to love Carolina in the first place. Fox will always be loved in Carolina, and it will be hard to let him go. But there comes a time where change is necessary, for the betterment of the team. Right now, John Fox is in the same situation that Bobby Bowden is in at Florida State. No, Fox did not have the championships and the tenure of Bowden, but he brought Carolina from the ground-up, something Bowden will always be remembered for. Ask a Seminole fan why they want Bobby to leave and they will tell you that they love Bobby to death, but change is necessary to propel a team forward instead of staying complacent or even moving backwards.

People in Carolina (including the players) need to see that a change is coming, and we need to see that our team is as important to Jerry Richardson as it is to us.  Outside of the emotions, the football facts are that we need consistent winning and we need more variety with our football philosophies. We are becoming predictable, something that warns danger in the NFL. And many say get Bill Cowher, who I may indeed be a fan of. But I think our team can be so good that paying a Head Coach a monumental salary may not be necessary. If he wants to join the organization for the right price and is totally committed, then join aboard; but we will be fine either way. We have a solid foundation here, and any good coach would jump for this job. I am not asking for a Hall-of-fame coach, I only ask for change. This resignation will be the start of a great chain of events, so let’s look at how we can follow this one-year rebuilding process up. Oh yeah, Jeff Davidson and Matt Hurney, clean out your desks in the morning.

RE-SIGN JULIUS PEPPERS. The child prodigy has returned to us. At moments this year, you were the scorned player who was sometimes despised by his own. It looked like the Panther’s Superman joined forces with the Lex Luthor of pro football, cash-money.  But tonight you have shown me something that I was blind to see Peppers, and something that I have just now realized…that I don’t blame you for tanking this season. You, just like us, wanted change. And instead of doing so, we franchised you and trapped you into staying with us.  Again, I don’t blame you. But my fellow fans, I feel like if we do what I explained above, that we can sign a good long-term deal with Julius. And let’s look at it this way, if we extend a long-term deal to Peppers, then the more cap space we have to sign other players and make even more moves…

SIGN A QB, AT LEAST AN AVERAGE QB. Steve Smith has to now be a favorite of all real football fans. Don’t mind Carolina’s love for this guy, because you do not know how much he means to us. Our record last year said 12-4, but 7 or 8 of those belong to Steve. Can you imagine Steve’s numbers if he had a good QB? If you watched us last year, then you know what I mean. He is the reason why Jake is now on the bench. Its not anything Steve did, but it was because our opponents took the option of “Lob it to Steve” out of our passing game. And without Steve, there is no passing game. Jake simply is not good enough to make other receivers better, and turnovers is something a team cannot afford. Matt Moore is not the answer either. Moore had a Jake experience in the Vikings game, and that’s having Steve Smith gas your stats. I like the kid, but he’s not a starting quarterback.

Moving from him though, a QB is needed just to keep us in the game. Nothing special like a Brady or a Brees, but someone who can hit open receivers and not throw the ball to players in the other jerseys. But who? A rookie QB from the second round of the draft would still be a need (no need to trade up); but I'm impatient. With a lot of our star guys getting older, we may not have time for a Colt McCoy to learn the speed and timing of the NFL. So let’s look at some experienced possibly free-agent QB's. Sage Rosenfeld could easily be traded for. Jason Campbell has shown to be a strong QB and he may be available. Hell, maybe even our former nemesis, Mike Vick (definite stretch here) could suffice. But just someone who can manage while our run-game carries the load. Steve Smith has already showed that you don’t need to be great to get him the ball. And if this season has showed us anything, it has showed us that giving Steve any kind of talent to throw him the ball will do wonders. And most importantly people, we better do this now in the glory years of #89, because time is not on our side.

This season has also showed us that we are in great need of a #2 receiver. We know going into every game that the defense is going to stick 8 or 9 players in the box, and roll all coverage towards Steve. Who else is going to make a play? Jarrett has already shown that he is not that guy, and Muhammad is sadly over-the-hill.  So Carolina needs another star to take the heat off of Steve. A player not too expensive (have to pay for new coach, Peppers, new QB, and re-sign one of our star RB’s) and a player who will punish one-on-one man-coverage’s. People, one man comes to mind…


SIGN T.O (Terrell Owens). I know about 90 percent of the people reading this article just curled their face up and said, “This guy doesn’t know what he’s talking about.” But I know some of you realize that this is a good idea. Let me break down to everyone why this would be a great addition by giving you a rebuttal your main two responses.

A) “T.O is a cancer and will kill our team.” I will give it to you, Owens’ track record speaks for itself. Getting kicked off of three teams is hard to do. But I believe that after being in the cold hell of Buffalo, after being practically forgotten, the impossible has happened: T.O has been humbled. No one can argue with his skill. He still has it, and he can still strike fear in the eyes of most cornerbacks. Players know that, and he knows that. He will have something to prove and if in Carolina, I believe Owens will be on his best behavior. He will know that this is Steve Smith’s squad, and he is coming only to be a part of a special team. Owens is too old to act a fool and he knows that his window is getting smaller by the year. Let’s give him a chance to have his last hoorah.

B) “Why should Richardson want to do this?” Well Jerry, let’s look at the football facts. He is still a physical specimen, a highly skilled receiver and he is a tall target (to replace Muhammad), which will in turn help an even average QB in the passing game. What is the saying: come great risk comes great reward? Well the reward would be a great #2 receiver who would free up Steve for one-on-one coverage’s, and boom there goes the offense. Great run game with a dangerous pass game. Sounds pretty damn good to me. Oh yeah, the risk. The risk would be losing out on a minimum contract and simply cutting him the next year. Doesn’t sound too bad to me. Ask Billicheck if getting Randy Moss was worth the risk.


THE LAND OF MILK AND GATORADE. I believe these moves will bring the Panthers into the promise land of football. Let me explain to everyone what this promise land is. The promise land is where the Panthers would be one of those teams everyone talks about. One of those teams that would be a sexy story not only for fans but also for the league. Can you imagine the Panthers being looked at like the Patriots, Steelers, and the Colts? Always on Sportscenter, always respected as one of the best. How exciting would that be? And not only this, but it would bring more national exposure to the city of Charlotte. Charlotte has the potential of being one of those household-name cities. When you come here you can’t help but to fall in love with it. A great Carolina Panthers team could help the city not only aesthetically, but economically as well. And hell, after the market crash and all of these bank failures, any breath of life into the city would be well appreciated.  So Mr. Richardson, I beg of you, please follow these simple rules. You can see that it is not that hard.  These moves I have listed are not impossible, and it could very well get you a spot coveted by all NFL Owners, a spot right next to Roger Godell hoisting up the championship trophy in front of all your loyal and true Panthers fans. How exciting would that be…

 

Written By Chris Long. E-mail: Cllong7@gmail.com

The content of these posts are those of the person/idiot making the post only

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did matt moore's game last night mean nothing to you?

he is becoming accustumed to the offensive personel now. give him a our healthy offensive line along with double trouble at their best and we have our 2008 offense. yes we do need to bring in another wide reciever NOT T.O steve smith and T.O would never get along.

by carolinabrave89 on Dec 21, 2009 1:11 PM EST reply actions  

He's been here for three years and was starting his third consecutive game on full practice.

Why wasn’t he “accustumed” to the players on the team already?

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 21, 2009 2:25 PM EST up reply actions  

really

you’re the guy who defended jake when he and smitty weren’t on the same page, and now you have something negative to say about Moore after he leads us to a 4th quarter comeback over the Vikings. last year he didn’t play. these are his first three starts in about two years or so. he’s now 2-1 as our starter and is playing so much better than your beloved jake. i think it’s obvious we’d have a better record if he was named the starter when jake was around interception number 8 or 9.

by usana_gaines on Dec 21, 2009 2:38 PM EST up reply actions  

No, it's hardly obvious at all.

How many games did Jake have where the defense held the other team to seven points?

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 21, 2009 3:01 PM EST up reply actions  

7 pts

it is obvious to everyone but you because you are blinded by your own love for your own made up facts. let’s see, how many points did the defense give up against buffalo? how many did they score off of a jake turnover? how many pts did tampa score from a jake turnover? how about philly? how many pts have been scored on jake’s turnovers or the resulting opponent’s possession? yes, it is obvious. moore does things like throw the ball to panthers receivers. you will never know that because you don’t watch the games or look at stats, you just fantasize about jake doing things he can’t do anymore.

by usana_gaines on Dec 22, 2009 1:03 PM EST up reply actions  

You're right, I certainly don't.

And you’ve never seen a football game in your life. There, I’ve made just as compelling an argument as you did.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 1:32 PM EST up reply actions  

So childish

You sound like, “nanny, nanny, boo boo”

by bigdavis on Dec 22, 2009 3:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Who ever claimed he had a problem with the offense?

I haven’t seen him be unable to line up the offense multiple times in the game at any time this year.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 12:28 AM EST up reply actions  

Certainly a convenient argument for you and your boy.

I figured Jarrett was benched because he just sucks and has never done anything on the field. Shouldn’t a magical QB like Moore finally have unleashed his awe-inspiring potential.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 8:54 PM EST up reply actions  

My boy's better than your boy

My boy’s younger and faster than your boy.
My boy’s has a quicker release and avoids sacks better than your boy.
My boy throws far fewer INT’s than your boy.
My boy’s doesn’t cough it up when he’s touched like your boy.
My boy’s got a higher QB rating than your boy.
My boy’s got a POSITIVE TD/INT ratio, rather than negative, like your boy.

Talkin’ bout ….my boy, my boy. Oh, yeah. My boy!

by bigdavis on Dec 22, 2009 10:47 PM EST up reply actions  

It sure is nice to base statistical comparisons on six games that didn't matter against teams with little to play for.

I hear it’s harder when you have to suit it up for 16 games every year no matter what the situation is.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 23, 2009 1:39 AM EST up reply actions  

I think I'll just save time and just cut and paste the word JERK for every response you make like that

Now of course, you could, with your ego, conclude that I’m talking about you, and take it as a personal affront — but I just happen to like jerk chicken.

JERK

…there…that’s better

by bigdavis on Dec 23, 2009 9:10 AM EST up reply actions  

I'll take a stab at that

Third string after injury, he was getting reps with guys who for the most part will never sniff an NFL roster. Very few starter reps, which are very important for success.

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 22, 2009 5:06 AM EST up reply actions  

Really?

So he just hasn’t been practicing all season? Because I don’t imagine they were running the scout team with Moore and the three or four offensive players on the PS all season.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 8:28 AM EST up reply actions  

you do imagine

you imagine all kinds of garbage. back-up qbs don’t practice with the first team offense during the regular season.

by usana_gaines on Dec 22, 2009 1:04 PM EST up reply actions  

And the year before that he was hurt

It’s foolish to give you’re second teamer reps with the first team, because that’s taking away from reps that you’re starters need. First team reps are critical to success.

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 23, 2009 10:20 AM EST up reply actions  

Thanks for the post Da Kid Long

Disagree about getting rid of Fox…just need a new special teams coach. Not too keen on Owens either. We do need another WR but I’ll pass on TO. Agree we should try and re-sign Pep but cannot franchise him.

I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com

by Jaxon on Dec 21, 2009 1:30 PM EST reply actions  

+1

Thanks for the post, but I disagree on firing Marty Hurney too.

All the players you mention providing us with last night’s win… they are all Carolina Panthers because of Marty Hurney.

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Dec 21, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Thanks

Thanks for the comments guys! This is my first post on this site (and in general) so feel free to tell me what you think. And the +1 means a lot from the resident optimist!

Thanks again guys

by Da Kid Long on Dec 21, 2009 2:55 PM EST up reply actions  

whether or not T.O. has been humbled

i wonder how he and smitty will feel about keeping the #1 WR position… T.O. will have trouble accepting a #2 spot as much as smitty will

by vitzeng on Dec 21, 2009 2:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Who even are you?

I knew precisely who Gary Barnidge was well before last night. He was a mid-round pick who had tons of skill as a receiver, but who doesn’t have the blocking ability to get starter’s snaps at TE in our offense.

As for a new coach, I don’t know how in the hell installing a new coach with a new scheme and a new staff could possibly help get the team to the Super Bowl. We’ve seen just this year how much a team can struggle getting adjusted to a new scheme with the installation of Meeks as DC. Minor things like a pulled hamstring in training camp become magnified when the majority of your starting LB group is missing installations and technique adjustments. And why would you wreck the progress they’ve made?

Don’t give Peppers a pass because he got franchised. If he didn’t want to play by the CBA’s rules, he should find a different job. If he had really wanted to get traded, he should have signed his tender or approved a list bigger than four teams that he’d approve a trade to.

You blame Delhomme for being unable to “make other receivers better,” but you ignore the fact that Muhammad had one of the best seasons for a #2 in Panthers history last year. And when it comes to Dwayne Jarrett, Kenny Moore, and Charly Martin, well, Moore is hardly making them look like studs himself.

And while I thought you had no idea what you were talking about before you mentioned Owens, you only solidified it there. The situation you’re describing is exactly what he was brought to Buffalo to do. A benched former early-round pick and no production whatsoever later, why the hell would you think he could do it again. Guys like Owens don’t ever reserve themselves to being complementary pieces, because they’re all about themselves. See Johnson, Keyshawn for another example.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 21, 2009 2:24 PM EST reply actions  

Wow

My goal here as to only show that the Panthers are not far away from becoming a great team. If you saw the game last night (Proctor), then you would realize that Matt Moore’s stats last night was attributed to Smith and Barnidge making great plays. By the way, of course I knew who Barnidge was, but not everyone knows him so that’s why I made that comment.

So by your comments, we should get rid of Peppers, keep Fox, and have Jake starting. I’m sure we can definitely win a championship then. And I am not coming on here to blast other Panters fans because I think we all want our team to win. However, CHANGE IS OBVIOUS. You may disagree with Owens and that’s fine (just my personal opinion), but if you believe the core we have right now as it stands can reach a Super Bowl then I don’t know what else to tell you.

Love you Panthers, keep working hard.

by Da Kid Long on Dec 21, 2009 2:47 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m fully aware that Moore’s stats were made by his receivers. The passing game plan has been ridiculously simple since he became the starter, and plays like the Rosario and King flareouts into the flats were totally missing earlier in the year. If the playcalling is going to get receivers out into space, anybody can succeed.

As to Barnidge, this was your quote:

Did anyone know who Gary Barnidge was before the fourth quarter? Didn’t think so.

Plenty of people knew who Barnidge was. Hell, he’s been mentioned nearly 300 times on this blog alone.

And yes, I believe this is a team that’s certainly close to the upper end of the NFL. But injuries have far more to do with that than a single player or coach. Every year we’ve stayed relatively healthy, we’ve gotten to the playoffs. But it’s tough to lose the key to your defense and his primary backup (Davis, Johnson), your only reasonably good run-stopping DT and his replacement (Kemoeatu, Leonard), an All-Pro LT (Gross, who went down before we were eliminated.) I’d like you to find another team that has sustained five IR-ed starters by their 10th game of the season. Then we’ll talk about how poorly Fox has done.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 21, 2009 3:10 PM EST up reply actions  

fox

fox has certainly made mistakes, and i think sticking with jake so long is the worst one, but you can’t forget about the injuries, i agree with that. i think that sometimes a coach and players can just be unprepared. there’s no excuse for it, but our 0-3 is comparable to the steelers 4 game skid and the titans 6 game skid, and i think denver had a 3 game losing streak in there. none of those coaches are on the hot seat, and i think fox stays. i mean, what if we played next week with a healthy gross, davis, johnson, d-will, otah, kemo and leonard? fox won’t say it, but we will. add to that how long it took the defense to adjust, and how poorly the o-line played to start the season, and you gotta wonder just how much blame does fox get. he deserves some, but really, professional linemen shouldn’t get so many false starts.

i think next year we have a new qb, and hopefully a new #2 receiver, and we win it all with healthy players. and i want someone who is actually better than moose to be the #2 guy, not just someone who earned the spot based on draft position.

by usana_gaines on Dec 21, 2009 3:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Not my job.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 23, 2009 12:53 PM EST up reply actions  

Procton, I understand it's not your job... but I would personally appreciate it if you went easier on our newer posters.

I know that across the board we have a pretty high standard in terms of level of content, fact checking and overall data… but ultimately it makes for a better community if you help ease people into the CSR style. Part of this is holding newer posters and members to a lower standard that you might otherwise with seasoned vets.

The last thing any of us should want is to turn people off commenting or posting when they could have a valuable point of view and great contributions down the line just because they say something you disagree with.

So, no, it’s not ‘your job’ to make people feel welcome, but it’s also not your role to open up a response to a new member with ‘Who even are you?’. It’s not condusive to a cohesive community.

It’s not a ToS violation, but it is snarkiness that is extremely easily avoided.

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Dec 23, 2009 3:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Thanks again Kid...

don’t let MP scare you away, he carries only a single opinion around here.

I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com

by Jaxon on Dec 22, 2009 3:10 PM EST up reply actions  

procton on haterade

i’m not sure why you’re trying to dog the author as if he said something so outrageous that it hasn’t been said before. he said fox should go, we should sign t.o. and another qb, and we should keep pep. you may not totally agree with all that, but what exactly do you know about him? you say he has no idea what he’s talking about. okay, genius, why don’t you make some suggestions? show everyone how you are so smart and he is so dumb. what could you say, keep fox? saying that doesn’t prove you’re smarter than anyone. you could say we should draft another receiver, or cut pep. again, i don’t see how any of those ideas shows you are smart enough to insult anybody else. in my opinion, moore is good enough to start next year, we should keep fox and pep, and cut jake, and still draft a qb or bring in a vet like campbell to compete. you may agree, or not, but there is no reason to attack the author of this post.

by usana_gaines on Dec 21, 2009 2:47 PM EST reply actions  

Percentage

Moore has a 66.66 % as a rookie, I think that is doing fine for a fill in at the end of the year. Give him a few more games and he will be able to start for any team in the league. I am not saying he is a Brady, Farve or McNabb, but he could be a starter anywhere with a little more experience.

by Cwilly1 on Dec 21, 2009 3:00 PM EST reply actions  

Who's a rookie?

Moore’s been in the league for three years.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 21, 2009 3:11 PM EST up reply actions  

Umm, no.

According to the NFL Players Association Contract:
“… a “rookie” shall be defined as a person who has never before signed an NFL Player Contract…"

That would have been 2007.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 21, 2009 9:59 PM EST up reply actions  

He has less experience than many rookies

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 22, 2009 5:10 AM EST up reply actions  

That doesn't make him a rookie.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 8:30 AM EST up reply actions  

But it doesn't make him a three year vet

He doesn’t have a full season of game experience, when he does he won’t be a rookie.

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 23, 2009 10:21 AM EST up reply actions  

Bull.

If you’re on the roster and you’re not good enough to get on the field, that’s not an excuse.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 23, 2009 12:54 PM EST up reply actions  

If the guy in front of you is playing well, or

the coach is sticking to him out of loyalty, whose fault is that? Was Steve Young crap for not being able to beat out Montana?

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 24, 2009 1:44 AM EST up reply actions  

No, but he was behind a better QB.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 24, 2009 9:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Until he got his turn, and then he came up big.

“not good enough” is highly subjective, and sometimes arbitrary, especially in the Panthers’ QB case — the decisions from game to game as to whom to start has been Fox’s — he’s been on record as saying he thought Delhomme gave the team a better chance to win than the other QBs he had.

That’s not open to a vote of bloggers, writers, or teammates.

A lot of those on this blog disagreed vehemently, as we slowly went down the playoff tubes, as he stuck with Jake too long. Were it not for the thumb injury, we’d STILL be seeing Jake in there. But it happened and Moore’s now getting his real chance to show what he’s got. He’s only been in there as a starter for 3 games, and has 2 more, from the looks of it, this year. So far he’s improved every game of the 3 (not every play, as you detractors insist he do), and maybe now he’s in the position that Steve Young was in. Or — as I said elsewhere, as Brett Favre was in, when he couldn’t get on the field at Green bay, until Dan Majkowski got hurt in 1992 — and even then, Favre didn’t really do squat as the starter until 1994.

Very few QB’s get the start right out of college — you can’t deny that. So how do the good ones otherwise get in their lineups? They wait, they sit, they study — and if they DO turn out to be a good one, when their own career is over — it’s because they then seized the opportunity they finally got. That’s known as the “big picture” and it’s too early to tell where Moore will wind up in that picture. But it’s now revolved around to where he’s getting his chance. So quit sniping and give it to him, and hope for the sake of the team you profess to support, that he does it well.

by bigdavis on Dec 24, 2009 9:57 AM EST up reply actions  

I certainly hope he's done well.

But he hasn’t done so in any forum that matters. For instance, Darin Gantt compared Moore’s first six games against the first six of the rookie starters this year as well as Delhomme and Collins. Would you really say it’s as hard to look good at the end of the year when teams have essentially had their fate for the season wrapped up as it is to start from week one when teams are all fighting for the same goal? In six career starts, Moore has played, at most, three games against teams with something on the line: vs. DAL as a rookie (he was awful), @NE (he was mediocre throughout), and vs. MIN (he was mediocre through three quarters, and good over a whopping seven throws in the fourth.) Are we really to say that he’s “done well,” “arrived,” or established himself as the team’s starter going forward over Delhomme, McCown, or any other QB we may acquire because of seven throws in one game? Sorry, but I just don’t see that.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 24, 2009 10:39 AM EST up reply actions  

Well, that was a well-moderated response, and I thank you for it.

It shows we’ve at least reduced this to a difference of opinions, and I can live with that — you’re certainly entitled to yours,as am I.

Time will tell whether he’s the guy or not. "Mediocre"is your assessment; mine is “getting the feel for the speed of the game, and improving under pressure in crunch time to win the game.”

We’ve all kinda beat it to death for now — let’s revisit the debate about Moore after we see how he fares against the Giants, shall we?

by bigdavis on Dec 24, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions  

Sure.

This will be a game against a team that absolutely needs the game and should give everything they’ve got at their place in a tough place to play, particularly for quarterbacks. It’s supposed to get down to 33°, and there’s even a chance of rain/snow. The Giants, too, could provide a challenge from their defense, with their frequently good pass rush (although it’s slacked a bit lately) and some talent in the secondary (although they’re really banged up there.) If he performs well there, it will certainly say a lot more about his development to me than anything I’ve seen from him so far. That’s not to say, however, that I’ll declare him a success just because the stats say so.

P.S.: As much as people complain about Delhomme’s ball security, how different is the script if the Panthers don’t come up with Moore’s fumble early in the game Sunday? I think we have a much harder time if they get seven points there, and it’s a bad play that was overlooked because we were fortunate enough to recover. Bottom line, it’s another example of how something really fluky and not really based on skill at all (the Revis pick-six, for another example) can totally change a game.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 24, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions  

It was a missed assignment on that

King thought he had help, and while King is a good blocker, he can’t single block Allen.

Your assesment of the Dallas game, which you have stated was meaningless before, is a little harsh. As a passing offense, we aren’t great, but with the run game we have the only thing we need to do is hit Smith deep and convert the occassional third and medium. Jake could not do that this year, Moore can. And while I’m not ready to crown him the starter, he is well on his way there. I expect a good game against the Giants, there defense is nothing to write home about, the real test will come against the Saints. If Sharper, Ellis, Greer, all their starters are in, Moore will be severely tried.

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 25, 2009 1:07 AM EST up reply actions  

disagree

i think moore could be a very good starter in this league for a long time, even for us. i think he could be, but he still has not proven it yet. he’s had more success in his career before being named the permanent starter than jake did, but jake certainly gave us some great years. with the talent on our team, we could win it all with moore, but other guys have to play better more consistently. relying on moore to throw three 4th quarter TDs on a regular basis won’t cut it. i think the best moore could ever be is someone on the same level as tony romo or jason campbell, but we have to wait and see. he’s not there yet. as good as he’s played, he may not have played at all if mccown didn’t get hurt.

by usana_gaines on Dec 21, 2009 3:23 PM EST reply actions  

"he may not have played at all if mccown didn’t get hurt"

And Brett Favre may never have played, if Don Majkowski hadn’t gotten hurt in Green Bay in 1992.

From crisis springs opportunity.

by bigdavis on Dec 21, 2009 5:39 PM EST reply actions  

+2

I like the post, interesting opinions but the staff should stay including Fox. I’ll admit I’ve ranted about Davidson but the panthers are who they are because of their way of thinking. The players just try to execute their schemes and when the player fails, a Fox or Davidson gets blamed. I have even mentioned Vick coming to the panthers but many believe that won’t work (I still believe there’s a chance) and I’ll even agree with you on signing T.O., he now knows what a “good team” really is now. If “Moose” retires he can certainly fill the #2 spot. I would like for Jarrett to break out and become a reliable receiver and before his death I was hoping for Chris Henry to get into the mix since he had family in N.Carolina and was turning his life around, man I liked him a lot as a player. Matt Moore as been in the system for 3 yrs now and I believe with a full camp and preseason he can become our QB from now on, he just needs a full season. We can let go of Freeley and sign a rookie, if Moore fails then we can see what the rookie has but lets give Moore a chance. This reminds me of the Favre, Brady, and even Cassell situations and how they emerged from the shadows.

Die hard Carolina Panther Fan, repren' black and blue from southern Cali

by pantherfan95323 on Dec 22, 2009 2:27 AM EST reply actions  

Moore had a shot with a full preseason and camp to become the QB this year.

But he couldn’t even beat out career journeyman Josh McCown for the backup spot. That doesn’t happen by accident.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 8:32 AM EST up reply actions  

Okay. let's recap your feelings - tell me if I've got this straight...

1) we can’t give Peppers any credit for a great game, because it’s only one game, and shouldn’t be counted — only his lackluster games count.

2) we can’t give Moore any credit for a great game, because it’s only one game, and shouldn’t be counted — only his preseason work counts.

but (and here’s where it gets a little sticky…)

3) we should overlook all the games this year where Jake stunk it up, tossing 18 INT’s (and don’t go off on your tangent claiming how many were tipped; I used to do that, too, in his defense — it doesn’t matter any more; he still threw plenty on his own), and instead count only the games where he played well enough for us to win (2)

…therefore, by your reasoning, good games only count when played by your personal savior (don’t get all affronted; no religious undertones there), but are to be disregarded when recorded by guys you don’t like. Is that about right? I’m sure all here would like to know.

by bigdavis on Dec 22, 2009 3:39 PM EST up reply actions  

You give credit for a career-long body of work.

Peppers is wildly inconsistent (regardless of how good it may be at its infrequent peaks.) Moore’s is adequate at best. Delhomme, on the other hand, has had a direct contribution to his own possession of one of the highest winning percentages of any starter in the league (yes, still) since he won the job.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 8:56 PM EST up reply actions  

What was his record this season?

AFTER he got hurt.

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 23, 2009 10:22 AM EST up reply actions  

He's 16-11. That's still plenty good.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 23, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions  

This season

When he had to provide enough threat of a passing game to offset the nine in the box. 5-7. We were 5-7 with Jake as our QB. Ask the defense why they were willing to put nine in the box even with Steve Smith on the field. It’s because they weren’t scared of Jake Delhomme.

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 24, 2009 1:46 AM EST up reply actions  

So he got hurt again?

Why refer to the injury?

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 24, 2009 9:11 AM EST up reply actions  

I'm talking about the elbow injury

It’s obvious it has hurt his ability to be a starting QB. Before the injury, teams knew we were going to run it and stacked up the box. We were still able to run our scheme because Delhomme and Smith had something special, and there was always the threat of a deep bomb to keep defense’s honest. They lost that this year, and it’s a big reason why I think Delhomme would have been benched after the Jets game.

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 25, 2009 1:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Instead of T.O we should get. . .

Vincent Jackson him and Smitty maybe sign Jason Campbell and draft Golden Tate and a DT or two.

One of South Africa's only Carolina Panthers and fans.

by chinchillas sword on Dec 22, 2009 5:07 AM EST reply actions  

Tate is going to be long gone by the time we pick.

Right now he’s almost a unanimous #2 WR prospect after Dez Bryant.

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Dec 22, 2009 8:07 AM EST up reply actions  

Jackson's likely going to be an RFA.

It’ll be hard to pull him away. Are you willing to give up a second-rounder (the compensation for the lowest tender) or more?

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 8:33 AM EST up reply actions  

Sure.

However, given that they’ll never tag him that low (I’m willing to bet they’ll go to the first and third level), I absolutely wouldn’t sacrifice those picks and the huge contract it’d take to get him away.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 8:58 PM EST up reply actions  

One thing we are missing...

T.O will be cheap!! Of course I would definitely rather have Vincent Jackson or Antonio Bryant, but those guys are going to be very expensive. Getting T.O would cost us nothing

by Da Kid Long on Dec 22, 2009 9:13 AM EST reply actions  

Yeah, Owens will definitely be cheap.

I’m sure he’ll just sign dirt cheap somewhere. Yeah, right.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 10:20 AM EST up reply actions  

Simple Fix

The main problem with this team this year wasnt the coaching (although it played a part in certain situations) it was turnovers, plain and simple. Jake alone gave away 3-4 games this year and thats why this team isnt in the playoffs. Moore may not have done any better but Jake should have been benched after Buffalo. I think Fox was too proud to admit that Jake had past his prime and his arm was weaker than spagetti….Moore may work out, we dont need a flash QB in this offense, they need to draft more O-line for depth, get our players back next year healthy which will feel like extra draft picks, and draft a qb in the 2-4 round we can groom behind Moore. We’ll get a third place schedule next year and probably go 11-5 or 12-4. We do need a #2 receiver desparately, Im a bit tired of these 3 TE sets. Rosario is a keeper, we could trade Barnidge or King for that matter. Keep Moose as your #3 and get a #2 in here, either as a free agent or do like the Giants did and draft 3-4 of them over 2 seasons and see who works out better…So Keep Fox, Start Moore, find help for Smitty, draft O-line…and pay Pep what he wants, he deserves it. No one “takes plays off” in the NFL….those that think Pep does obviously dont notice the 2-3 lineman/TE draped over him every single game….

by Dez_3505 on Dec 22, 2009 10:47 AM EST reply actions  

"those that think Pep does obviously dont notice the 2-3 lineman/TE draped over him every single game…."

This is a lie, plain and simple. He has been shown many times this season getting stood up by single blocking out of TEs and FBs. They spotlighted it several times last week@NE, and in both Atlanta games.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 22, 2009 11:01 AM EST up reply actions  

So now you're calling another poster here...a liar??

Break time for you, MP. Go to the corner for an hour.

by bigdavis on Dec 22, 2009 3:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Resing Peppers? For what? Hes had 13 games this season and he’s dominated in how many? 1?

Not enough in my book. Let the $17million dollar man walk, or better yet, trade him off for what we can get.

by scorpion12 on Dec 23, 2009 12:04 AM EST reply actions  

NO! HE'S THE BEST PLAYER EVER! HE MUST RETIRE A PANTHER BECAUSE OF HIS CONSISTENT DOMINANCE!!!

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 23, 2009 1:40 AM EST up reply actions  

You see the light. :P

To be fair, Peppers has played excellently in at least 3 games, and gotten hurt in a few others. I think he finalyl realizes this is his scheme, and we will sign him long term.

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 23, 2009 10:25 AM EST up reply actions  

I hope so

Its not my cash so hell, lock him up…I’ll take his inconsistency over many other DE’s irrelevancy.

by ERL on Dec 23, 2009 10:49 AM EST up reply actions  

hahaha

Peppers has probably lost some value since last season because of injuries and inconsistency…. seems like his desire to switch to 3-4 D was a call for more money

lock him up long term and make him retire as a panther xD

and how many people are going to have a cooler name than “Peppers”, no one enjoys saying “osi umenyiora”

by vitzeng on Dec 23, 2009 12:26 PM EST up reply actions  

It's not the money in and of itself.

It’s your team’s cap space to be able to afford other players.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 23, 2009 12:56 PM EST up reply actions  

3 out of 14 for a player paid more than any other defender in the league is a pretty shitty ratio.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 23, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions  

There are games

where he is not dominant, but he does things that do not show up on the stat sheet…like force QBs to step up, stop to look at the rush, or force them to throw the ball away, check it down, yada yada. I think we are often guilty of looking at his stat line after a game and making snap judgments.

His value, from game to game, should not be judged on whether he had a sack, as often times sacks have little (or even a negative) bearing on the final score. Ex: He hit Aaron Rodgers late out of bounds for a loss of about a foot last year, but he got a sack for the play…unfortunately he also cost the team 15 yards (and himself 15 grand).

He is also one of the best in the league in going from an all out pass rush into coverage once the ball is out. Would you prefer him to leave, MP? What if we sign him long-term to an average deal of say, 11M a year? Is he still not worth the cap space?

by ERL on Dec 23, 2009 11:03 PM EST up reply actions  

He already turned down a deal worth significantly more than that.

I don’t know why he’d have magically changed his mind.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 24, 2009 1:20 AM EST up reply actions  

Because maybe now he likes the scheme?

The early bird catches the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by Flowing Willow on Dec 24, 2009 1:47 AM EST up reply actions  

+1

It shows in his demeanor and his interaction with his teammates, and his interview quotes about winning, that demonstrate that he has changed his mind.

He likes where he is now — some people do change their minds, you know.

That was a hare-brained scheme by his “agent” anyway, and he saw it didn’t work out. He sees the potential of this defensive unit, and that of the team.

I think he wants to stay, and he’ll work something out to benefit all.

And if you say, “How do I know that?” I answer, “How do you know he won’t.”

by bigdavis on Dec 24, 2009 11:11 AM EST up reply actions  

And I wouldn't have any better of an answer than you would...

But I’d say that actions speak louder than words, and turning down a contract offer that would have made him the highest-paid defensive player ever is a pretty definitive action.

Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE

by MichaelProcton on Dec 24, 2009 11:38 AM EST up reply actions  

Keep in mind that he turned it down before he'd seen how Meeks' new scheme would work out.

As I mentioned, Lance Briggs absolutely said he didn’t want to play in Chi any more, and then he changed his mind.

by bigdavis on Dec 24, 2009 12:04 PM EST up reply actions  

I appreciate your analysis, but....

I have to disagree with you on a few points:

1. T.O. in Carolina will never, ever, ever happen. His most productive playing years are behind him, and Jerry Richardson runs a class organization with a conservative philosophy. T.O. would not fit well in Carolina. He’s too much of a risk.
2. Firing Marty Hurney is not a good idea. He has brought in a number of productive players over the years, and some of them will eventually end up in Canton.
3. Finally, in order to be in the same conversation among the sports talking heads and the media, Carolina has to be consistent over a number of years. We have yet to put together back-to-back winning seasons, so I agree with you about the coaching change. I don’t believe John Fox can get us to the “promised land”, but Ron Meeks has proven to be a good defensive coordinator.

I don’t have the answers, but being a Charlotte native and PSL owner from the very start, I see that Jerry Richardson brings in very conservative coaches that become very predictable and unemotional on the field. I would like to see more emotion and passion from the coaches starting with the head coach. I don’t believe the approach the organization takes inspires the players to win year in and year out.

Thoughts anyone?

Chris196

by Chris196 on Dec 24, 2009 11:31 AM EST reply actions  

Frantic emotions from the HC on the sidelines makes for good TV...

…but it’s the same as having bare-chested idiots in the stands in sub-freezing weather. It adds nothing to the final score, it’s just entertaining.

Pro athletes don’t respond to the rah-rah stuff from their coaches that might’ve worked at their good ol’ alma maters. I think we can see from the performance that our players gave last week, when their playoff hopes were dashed, that the coaches can get them up for a game.

Just because Bill Cowher’s got that jutting chin, and a mean grimace, doesn’t mean he could motivate the guys on our roster any more than Fox can.

I have seen games when they were flat, and wished for more emotion from the players myself. But I don’t believe that necessarily comes directly from a more emotional HC.

by bigdavis on Dec 24, 2009 12:10 PM EST reply actions  

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