Panthers Blame Game Has No Simple Solution
by Jaxon on Nov 23, 2009 3:30 PM EST
52 comments
Darin Gantt is easily my favorite Panthers beat writer at the moment, he is always timely in his topics of choice and gives the insight we crave in most cases. I almost always find myself agreeing with Gantt... but not today. Today I find myself in disagreement with his post that all the Panthers troubles in 2009 are due to franchising DE Julius Peppers:
Where keeping Peppers mostly hurt them this year was in the way it robbed them of their depth...Without funds to adequately fill the backup positions, the Panthers are filling kick coverage and return units with odd parts, and guys who were never good special teamers to begin with. The fact that an undrafted rookie receiver such as Charly Martin can go from practice squad to active roster in a week speaks to special teams coach Danny Crossman's desperation. He essentially is trying to play high stakes poker with Old Maid cards, and not surprisingly, it ain't working.
Let's examine this bit by bit starting with the obvious stuff. I can agree that being cap-starved meant the loss of two key back-ups to the offensive line. The Panthers did not have the cap space to tender C/G Geoff Hangartner and T Frank Omiyale. The problem is that the Panthers were already 4-5 by the time they needed a back-up to start a game, when LT Jordan Gross went down. So would having Frank Omiyale in at LT provide a better alternative? I just checked the Bears depth chart and Omiyale is listed as the back-up LG on what even their fans admit is a horrid offensive line in Chicago. I doubt Omiyale would make much of a difference in this case.
The more obvious depth issue was the glaring need at DT once Maake Kemoeatu was lost for the season. But that didn't happen until training camp meaning that even if the Panthers had King Tut's treason to spend most of the top notch DT's were already signed elsewhere else by the time the need surfaced. I will agree there were a couple guys that might have stopped the bleeding sooner (that Boone guy comes to mind) but the truth is injuries killed the run defense, not Peppers contract. If Kemo and rookie Corvey Irvin had remained healthy we might have performed better against the run (or not). On the bright side the Panthers should be loaded at DT next season.
Would the Panthers have gotten more LB help in the offseason if not for the Peppers tag? It seems unlikely given LB was one of the deepest positions on the team. The Panthers were 6 deep with quality players and let a couple good prospects walk after the preseason because they are so deep. Hardly seems like a weakness created from salary cap problems.
Gantt also blames the poor special teams play on Peppers contract, stating it prevented them from signing top notch special teamers. If he is referring to kick and punt returners I will cede the point. The Panthers could still use an experienced punt and/or kick returner but honestly was there that many good ones available in the offseason? We could have kept Mark Jones but the Panthers obviously thought they could do better (not). If the position was so important could they not have spent a high draft pick on one even with the Peppers tag? Sure they could have.
My biggest beef with special teams though is with kick coverage. Every team does use ‘gunners' on coverage and I would agree the good ones are worth a roster spot just for that specific purpose. Did the Panthers ever mention the need to improve the depth at gunner? Was it ever a priority? They already have David Wesley and could put Richard Marshall back in the spot (didn't they already?) if needed. It hardly seems like ‘skimping' on special teams coverage when you are putting NFL-quality players out there to do something as simple as tackle.
If Danny Crossman is desperate it's because he obviously know it's not working too and simply thinks he can change out some of the parts and get better results. So how many special teams players could the Panthers have really brought in if money was not an issue? LB Donte Curry is one that comes to mind but the Panthers seem uninterested at this point. Would one guy really make that much difference? Keep in mind that in the past three seasons the Panthers unit has been ranked near the bottom in returns and coverage, a span that includes a number of different players using HIS system. So after three seasons of piss poor special teams coverage you're going to tell me the problem is not the scheme, it's not the players in charge of actually tackling the returner, it's the franchised DE on the sideline?
Let's not leave any stone unturned. Did the Peppers tag prevent us getting another WR? At what point have the Panthers ever said they needed another WR prior to Moose getting hurt? Never. Now if you wanted to say the Peppers tag prevented us from signing WR Chris Chambers you might have me on that one. Chambers played well yesterday for the Chiefs and looks like he is still a competent #2 WR. But the Panthers were already 3-5 by the time Chambers hit the market.
Here's another point Gantt could have argued but didn't: Peppers contract prevented the Panthers from signing or trading for a starter quality QB. Bingo! I would agree with that...if the Panthers had actually agreed a QB was needed. But they never thought that and still don't think it to this day. So how can you blame Peppers contract on that, unless you want to blame Delhomme's extension on it? That's an obvious point but not germane to the point of this post. As we look back at the QB's that traded teams this past offseason is there any one of them that we wish we had? Hmmm....
So to summarize my side of the debate and the point I'm trying to make I'm going use Gantt's own words from a tweet he sent out AFTER this post. This is Gantt' response to tweet asking if Special Teams coach Danny Crossman is at fault for the problems on special teams. (It's a tweet where answer to question comes first)
Yes, because scapegoating's always easier than a complicated solution. RT @michaelbfinch I disagree re: ST problems. All on Danny Crossman.
Now that is rich!
I would argue turning these Panthers around this offseason is a complicated effort and will no tbe solved by simply getting rid of a single contract, no matter how large that contract may be.
0 recs |
52 comments
|
Email
Print
Comments
Excellent post Jaxon
I really don’t think the Panthers’ woes can be distilled into one main reason like Pep’s contract. Truth is we returned almost all of our starters in 2009 and they underperformed.
We lost key depth by signing Pep to the enormous tender, but that also means if and when he comes off the books we’ll have alot of free money to snag FA’s from other teams.
I was talking to a buddy of mine over lunch who happens to be a Bears fan. He’s infuriated right now because not only do they look lost to him, they also have no draft picks to fix the situation; they have no first or fourth (from the Cutler trade) now they have no second round pick either (Gaines Adams). Despite this though he’s taking the season well, having a ‘It is what it is’ attitude towards the future, this is because he’s mostly hopeless.
What I’m getting at is the 2009 seasons stings a little more because we’re so close. Sure up a couple of areas and we’re right at the top of the NFC, I truly believe that. It hurts to be sniffing the stratosphere but just missing out; couple this with a couple of embarrasing losses and it makes for a tough season.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Nov 23, 2009 3:56 PM EST reply actions
All or Nothing Blame rarely accurate
When you hear Chris Harris, Jon Beason, and even Pep- they are all saying the same things… “we” are just not executing, getting the job done, “we” have got to do better, “we” all have to step up… etc., and I really believe they mean it. They are the ones leaving their blood and guts on the field. We are witnessing this season more than just the effects of 1 problem.
James you are dead on, underperforming starters, back-ups, injuries, ineffective QB play, inconsistent defensive play, I dont know what to call the effort by special teams, questionable play calling, and incredibly frustrating and inopportune turnovers, etc..etc..
So, No, it’s not the fault of 1 HUMONGOUS contract. The contract doesn’t get between the white lines. There is alot of talent on this team, and they show alot of potential, and at times they dominate, they just cant seem to sustain that for a whole game.
It’s frustrating as a fan to hear Fox say we are a Run dominant team, and then watch
a 20 run/42 pass effort. Especially when the lesser was outperforming the greater. It makes you wonder if anyone on the team really knows what they are doing. Can we at least get some consistency somewhere? (Other than red-zone turn-overs, special teams mediocrity and head scratching play calling- those have all been inconsistently consistent).
On the running plays
is it me or does it seem that as soon as we are trailing if the other team stops a run up the middle for no gain we stop running. Maybe it takes two stops…but it seems we lose hope to run the ball real quick when we are down.
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
Absolutely.
Nevermind the 20+, hell 50+, yard plays our backs are known to do when they get the ball… A single no-gainer for what-ever reason and we’re scared to take it back.
That drives me insane. It’s like we’re playing THEIR game and I just don’t think of it like that. I feel like, when a team plays us, regardless who they are, we need show them exactly where they’re at. That means pounding the rock no matter how many times they stop it. I bet, in the end, the majority of runs will be large gains and a lot of broken tackles.
We need to let teams know they need fear us because we really don’t give a damn what they think they can stop and not the other way around. Make them question their own abilities going into the game, not rest securely knowing D-Will & J-Stew won’t see the ball as soon as they score on us or make 1 good stop.
Davidson would rather submit to them, though.
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
"Davidson would rather submit to them, though."
Submissive IS the opposite of dominant, isn’t it?
Good point you raise, D-Ranged1. As usual.
When you hear Chris Harris, Jon Beason, and even Pep- they are all saying the same things… "we" are just not executing, getting the job done, "we" have got to do better, "we" all have to step up… etc., and I really believe they mean it.
Interesting that you mention those 3 — I’d rather that each would have taken even MORE personal responsibility for inadequate execution — saying “I” have to, not “we.” Small, but subtle, distinction.
And here’s why I say that:
Again citing my favorite new stats site (Pro Football Focus), I note the following:
1) Chris Harris ranks #74 of 87 safeties in the league in effectiveness, and has 8 missed tackles — only Sabby Picatelli of TB has more
2) Jon Beason ranks #31 of 55 ILB’s – he leads the league in missed tackles with 11.
3) Julius Peppers ranks #42 of 70 DE’s playing a 4-3 — Tyler Brayton is #38, Charles Johnson #22.
The numbers speak for themselves — the players should, too.
Wow...that is an eye opener
I want to question it but when I look at the names at the top and can’t argue too much. Mathis & Freeney the top 2 DE’s…does Meeks own that in any sense?
I’m surprised to see both Beason and Harris so low. It validates Harris’ own comments on this blog that they need to execute…make those tackles. I’m surprised to see Pep ranked so low on run support.
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
Indeed it does.
I wonder if our inept offense has inflated those numbers at all? Going back to our offense preferring the bench over the field, it increases the workload of the D.. and also the opportunities for missed tackles. Of course, the numbers still uncover just how, well – badly – we’ve played.
Flipping over to OLB’s in a 4-3, Davis sits right up there @ #2 over-all. Such a shame.
It is extremely surprising to me to see Beason ranked 31st. Interestingly, Witherspoon ranks 29th @ ILB in Philly, which they have him listed as playing week 7-9. Playing OLB in St. Louis, Witherspoon ranked 11th, compared to Diggs and Johnson, 37th and 41st respectively. I echo my sentiment: I sure miss Witherspoon. Now more so than ever.
I think I’m going to have a lot of fun with this site – thanks BigDavis. I believe I remember you referencing it before but I never had the chance to play with it. I’m glad you brought it back up!
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
Where is that site getting their stats?
I didn’t know they even kept stats for “Missed tackles.”
I always question statistics, and the sources that are providing them. I looked at the links you provided, and had a hard time trying to figure out how PFF determined their rankings. Their is no doubt a certain amount of subjectivity involved.
Not sure if it answers your question but...
I stumbled across an explanation of how their grading works.
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
Of course it's subjective...
…but thanks to these guys, at least there’s SOMETHING of its kind to use for our own comparative evaluation. Here’s more on how they got started:
http://www.profootballfocus.com/about.php?tab=about
I would note that they use a LOT of variables, but two that, say, Peppers don’t get credit for are Forced Fumbles and Blocked Kicks — these both contribute greatly to a team’s success. But those, and even Sacks, are not directly giving point value to the DEs’ ranking — rather, the team at PFF watch every play, every player, and grade whether they were positive or negative on that play. There are only 4 factors they use for this position: Pass Rush, Pass Coverage, Run Defense (here’s where Pep suffers), and Penalties. Now I would think Penalties shouldn’t have such a large effect, but they do.
I’m guessing that if Pep blocks a kick, it gives him a + in Coverage, but I’m not sure.
As for missed tackles, I’m happy to see there’s a source to confirm what I’d always thought — that we miss a lot of them!
I may be in the minority here...
But I actually wish we could have pulled off a trade for Cutler. He’s young, and is a definite upgrade over what we have now. I know that right now he’s sucking like a whore with a rent payment due, but he’s in Chicago with absolutely NO offensive line and no one to throw to other than a decent TE and a punt returner who decided that he wanted to try being a WR. Add in the fact that Forte has had a down year and it further compounds Cutler’s problems — he feels he HAS to make high-risk throws to make something happen, and he has failed this season. (But when you think of it, Jake has done almost the exact same thing because of the poor play calling)
But, if you put Cutler behind our offensive line (obviously it would be even better with False Start Gross still in there — but it’s still better than what they have in Chi-town) with Smitty and Moose to throw to and Double Trouble to hand off to, and we have a completely different season right now — we’re probably sitting at 7-3 or 8-2 with a realistic chance at catching the Saints for the division — at least I think so.
So, I think the franchising of Pep was a bad idea when we could have possibly worked out a deal and got a franchise QB. (Correct me if I’m wrong, but doesn’t Denver play the 3-4? And Pep said he wanted to play for a team that uses the 3-4 — so Pep for Cutler would have been within the realm of possibility.) But, I do not think it is why we are 4-6 and on the brink of missing the playoffs. That, like has been stated already, is because of poor execution by the guys we do have, and the horrid coaching (particularly by everyone’s favorite offensive coordinator) that we have endured this season. Losing several key players (Kemo, Davis, Gross) to injury hasn’t helped matters much either.
lol....sucking like a ...
A little off color but funny none the same
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
in the future....
I will use “sucking like a professional escort with a rent payment due” for the kiddos. LOL
Considering the draft picks Chicago gave up for Cutler, I still don’t think it would’ve been a good idea to nab him even if we were guaranteed he would play better with us. We needed those picks to reinforce our defensive line, a much more glaring need than QB, especially in retrospect with all the injuries.
by SlayerGhaleon on Nov 23, 2009 6:24 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think Pepper's contract is the issue
With the special teams so far, it’s the fact that moving Marshall to second corner was a costly one as it basically took the team’s best from the special teams.
Contract
The problem is we were losing at the first of the year when the backups were not even needed, the first string was losing the games. Sure the contract amount is extreme but that came into play later when we were low on backups.Now we find ourselves in a situation where Evertte Brown’s draft slot really looks good and he has a lot of room in those shoes he has to fill.
Why blame Peppers
If your boss comes out tomorrow and says “You know what I am going to give you a 5 milloin dollar a year raise to you for doing the same thing you are doing now”, would you say NO. I don’t think so, Peppers just took the money and ran. Blame only the people at the top what have poor vision for the team and horrible player selection. Now I know some of you are going to come back and remind me of all the good players we have, fair enough but look at all the DUDS we have gotten over the years. We talk about one almost every week in a WR that can’t get open to save his life. (2nd draft choice and has almost caught nothing).
I thought Peppers would be the problem
But it’s turned out to be Jake putting us in a slump, and poor coaching trying to recover from it. Fox knows what it takes to win… He has a great-proven formula for winning, but he’s a terrible X’s and O’s guy. When things don’t go as planned, he has no clue how to strategically adjust.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Tennessee just won its fourth straight
after starting 0-6. What sparked them? A change at QB….
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
You beat me to bringing to the subject! haha
Looking over the standings, I’m leaning towards a Cincinnati/Minnesota SB. I wonder if that comes off as ridiculous being read as it did being typed.
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
It's slightly different in the Titans case
Young is a proven winner, he just needed a chip on his shoulder to motivate him. He is more of a dynamic talent than Moore. He also has an OC who takes advantage of who he has in the backfield.
by Flowing Willow on Nov 24, 2009 1:50 AM EST up reply actions
Really? I’m not much of a Titans fan but I always assumed he wasn’t that great – like if Michael Vick were to go to prison for a while and then come back and play again. Wait….
No really, I love mobile QB’s though. I think it really makes a defense stay on their toes way more so than one that’s immobile. Just knowing the guy has the speed to pick up the 1st down if the D doesn’t play him closely is an awesome advantage, imo. Not to mention, I want to see the option in the NFL.
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
I think Tennessee’s success has fare more to do with getting their starting CB’s back from injury than Vince Young.
It helps Chris Johnson caught fire too.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Nov 24, 2009 7:19 AM EST up reply actions
Too bad we don't have a top RB to motivate Jake
Oh wait we do! Must be just Jake then?
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
by southtunnel on Nov 24, 2009 1:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Young was the starter before Finnegan and Fuller came back
They won. Johnson has been on fire all year, he hasn’t JUST caught fire.
D-Ranged, the option has been used a few times this year, Tenessee used it against the Texans, and the Dolphins used it with Pat White.
by Flowing Willow on Nov 25, 2009 4:15 PM EST up reply actions
Ricky Williams scored on an option run
15 yards out vs the Pats.
Youngs and Johnson used it fairly successfully, both are electric enough to make it work.
by Flowing Willow on Nov 26, 2009 6:29 AM EST up reply actions
a big contract is the issue....just not Peppers' contract
Peppers’ contract consumed a major chunk of cap space, and left the Panthers vulnerable to injuries, but after this season he signs or walks no way that he’s re-franchised. Melodrama will ensue this off-season much like this year, but his contract isn’t the real problem.
It’s Jake’s.
By guaranteeing Jake $20 over the course of the next 5 years management now feels forced to keep him because of the amount of money he would command if he just walks away. That means that we have a QB in the twilight of his career who will be starting for the at lest next 2 years, unless Richardson fires Fox then it’s at least 1/2 to a full year.
Don’t get me wrong Davidson’s inability to recognize the tools his team has and game plan with them has more to do with our losses then Jake’s arm.
For example in only one game has Jake thrown fewer then 30 passes and lost this season. (That was the Eagles game where he was tossing an INT every 1st and 10.) In fact this team has lost every game that Jake throws for more then 200 yards, the split stat is Games Won: 47 of 80 for 58.6% completion Games Lost: 117 of 207 for 56.6% completion.
Delhomme is not a passing QB he is a game manager(20-30 passes a game) who has the intangibles to lead 4th quarter and 2 min come back drives. If 13 or more run plays had been called in the Falcons, Bills, and Dolphins games this team would be 6-4 or 7-3.
Two Reasons Folks.
So we are really done as far as this season goes and the two main reasons for that is two contracts.
1.) J. Peppers and his huge 16.75 million dollar contract
2.) J. Delhomme and his new contract due to count what is it 16 mil towards the cap next season ?
Easy fix;
Buyout Delhomme and let him walk at the end of the year and let Peppers leave as well. I don’t care what he wants Peppers needs to leave and his age is going to catch up to him sooner rather than later ( I mean he has already been in the league two years longer than J. Allen of the Vikes).
Oh yeah not to mention that Davidson is god awful as well.
Good bye Fox and take Davidson, Crossman, and Hurney with you and go and be the coach of the Browns or Bills at the end of this year unless M. Shanahan beats you to it.
by Holty_Panthers_Fan on Nov 23, 2009 9:37 PM EST reply actions
If we let Peppers walk, what happens? Who fills his position? When the monster isn’t there, the other end isn’t going to have quite as easy a time, I think you’ll see a major decrease from both ends, personally. I am not sold on letting Peppers go simply because I’m not sold on any of our other ends being a solid replacement for him. He’s still a monster and he showed that before hurting his hand.
He doesn’t show up every game but what player does, or is capable of such? Bad games happen for everyone but Peppers was on a roll (more like, steam-roll) before his injury. Players of his caliber are not replaced just like that. Not knocking our other ends, as they’re plenty talented, but they don’t have the “Julius Peppers” factor. Not Brayton, Johnson, Brown, nor Taylor. I’m afraid it’s a major blow to our D letting him walk.
Does anyone know how much it will hurt if we actually buy Jake out? I mean, I know his contract is huge but I don’t know how much of our cap we’re going to have free’d up. With the players we’re going to have to resign, I imagine such a loss isn’t going to be highly thought of? I don’t see Delhomme going anywhere – I do see him restructuring though.
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
Get rid of Hurney? Are you kidding? He worked several good deals to get us some talent at the DT position this year.
by SlayerGhaleon on Nov 23, 2009 10:10 PM EST up reply actions
i like the guy
but he needs to stop handing out draft picks, especially 1st rounders… they’re kind of important…
Last year it got us Jeff Otah, who was worth the trade. Brown is still a project, but has shown flashes. As I mentioned earlier, his trading of one of some picks this year shored up our DT spot.
If it works, I really don’t care if he trades them away.
by SlayerGhaleon on Nov 24, 2009 12:04 AM EST up reply actions
If we let pep and Jake go this offseason
I wouldn’t mind Fox and Davidson staying. Just need to get an athletic QB who can avoid the rush…
I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com
staying with Davidson?
i haven’t read much of the above, but there must be quite compelling reasons to still be loyal to him….
his playcalling makes watching panthers difficult….
we probably also need a new ST coach… ST has done much better now, but still pretty weak
You mean we need a QB who can make a play...
When Fox and Davidson are making bland/vanilla play calls
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
by southtunnel on Nov 24, 2009 1:37 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Interesting for whatever it is worth...
I’m currently playing with the aforementioned site by BigDavis (ProFootballFocus) and noticed an interesting little piece…
Considering we’re all calling for more run plays.. Between DeAngelo Williams and Jonathan Stewart, we lead the league in rushing attempts. We even beat out Miami. Williams and Stewart combine for 291 rushing attempts, meanwhile Brown and Williams combined for 274.
Of course, NFL.com will tell you different with its total rushing attempts, though as far as feature backs and committees are concerned, I’d rather believe PFF, as there’s no telling what the NFL may include under “rushing attempts”. (Quarterback sneaks obviously aren’t the kind of run plays we’re wanting, for example.)
Does this change the fact that I believe we should run more often? Absolutely not! It just eases my mind slightly until I think about Davidson ruining a game and get all annoyed again.
PFF Conclusion: Our tandem is combining for more attempts than any other tandem or feature back in the NFL.
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
Wow. I didn't rally know that....
Still….run the damn ball!
"Once again the trousers of evil are yanked down by the mocking hands of justice!"-Revshawn
I would have quickly assumed we were in the bottom half of rushing attempts the way it seems we seldom run. They do say the NFL is becoming a passing league…… or is that Madden that says that?
Regardless, I think that should just be our slogan from now on…
“Carolina Panthers – Run The Damn Ball!”
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
Two comments
In a few games, we ran so much it was as if we had tied Jake’s arms to his sides. In others, we gave up on the run early and got all pass-happy. We’re not consistent in our running attempts, and regardless of how many attempts we have compared to other teams, the real question is how many we have compared to how many passing attempts we have. And that would be 313 passing plays versus 303 running plays by backs and receivers and 18 quarterback scrambles that have been counted as runs.
That’s not the ratio you’re looking for as a Panther fan.
Agree’d, inconsistency is one of our biggest enemies and that is where we flounder, thanks the the play calling, which goes back to Davidson. How I do dislike Sir Gump.
I wasn’t really arguing anything as I still believe we need ‘run the damn ball’ more often, I was just pointing out that our duo are featured in our offense more than any other is in their respective offense. That is something I really found surprising.
If Gump can just get some consistency going, we can make this come-back work.
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
Play Calling has been the Downfall
For example: Deangelo Williams was breaking off 9 yard carries against Miami in the 1st Quarter. We get ti mid field and quit calling the run. We pass two times and punt. It’s been happening like that all year. RUN THE BALL!
TMQ (Tuesday Morning QB) has this to say in agreement with you (and all of us)
“‘Tis Better to Have Rushed and Lost Than Never to Have Rushed At All (Part 2): TMQ continues to be unable to understand the Carolina Panthers. Carolina came into its Miami game ranked third in rushing and 21st in passing, with five rushing turnovers and 15 turnovers on passing plays. So what did the Cats feature? Game scoreless, Carolina reached first-and-goal on the Miami 7 and went incompletion, incompletion, sack, field goal. Later, facing third-and-1, the Panthers threw incomplete, then punted. Later, trailing 14-3, with third-and-3 on the Marine Mammals’ 24, Jake Delhomme heave-hoed the ball — interception. To that point, the Panthers had 130 rushing yards and 45 passing yards; had the Cats simply run on third-and-3, at least a field goal was likely, and the fourth quarter might have been far different. On the night, Carolina averaged 6.7 yards per rush and 4.4 yards per pass — it’s rare for the rush average to exceed the pass average. Yet, counting sacks and scrambles, Carolina coaches radioed in 48 passing plays and 25 rushes. The Panthers were not playing catch-up against a big lead; the game was close all night. In his past 11 games, Delhomme has thrown 19 interceptions — and Carolina coaches keep calling passes. I just do not understand what is going through the minds of the Carolina coaching staff.”
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=easterbrook/091124&sportCat=nfl
We are the same team just without the lucky breaks and enthusiasm
This season isnt too different than last substitute the New Orleans L for last seasons Chargers W, substitute the lowly Bills L for the lowly Oakland W and substitute the Dolphins or Cowboys L with any game that we looked in control through the first half but held on and we are 8-2.
For the run the damn ball crowd, did you see the stat Thursday night that the top rushing teams in the league are all under .500 (except now the Dolphins are .500). If this was middle school I would agree, but this is the NFL and we need to be comfortable that our QB can pick up a 3 and 8 once in a while.
by parkershawn2001 on Nov 24, 2009 9:27 AM EST reply actions
The problem isn’t that we throw it too much, it’s that we throw it at entirely the wrong times.
Take the Miami game for example. The playcalling of run versus pass was pretty even for most of the game, which I thought was a good idea for taking on a good run defense team with a weak pass defense. The problem became that twice when we got inside the ten yard line, we threw it more than we passed it. Hell, the first trip we didn’t run it at all, which is laughable. Running it more on those two trips might’ve gotten us touchdowns, and gotten us an entirely different final score.
That’s what people are complaining about.
by SlayerGhaleon on Nov 24, 2009 9:56 AM EST up reply actions
We’re not simply saying “run the damn ball” mindlessly, of course we understand that we need a competent QB. The problem with that is our O.C. makes our QB look completely incompetent within his poor play selection. S.G. put it great…
“The problem isn’t that we throw it too much, it’s that we throw it at entirely the wrong times.”
The ratio of run to pass for a lot of the games we lost, as well as the terrible play calling, has been debated so often and in so much depth that it has simply, over time, boiled down to us simply saying “run the damn ball”. For instance, when I see Revshawn say “run the damn ball” I understand every sentiment comprised within that brief statement because, I think, we share pretty similar opinions on the situation.
I can see how, at face value, it would come off as a bit “middle school-ish” but trust me, we’re not that oblivious – honest :).
Double Trouble; we've got the best running backs in the NFL that never see the ball!
to add to this argument...
What kills me is when Gump calls a 40 yard pass to Smitty on 3rd and 1 when D-Will or Stewie just gained 8 yards to make it 3rd and 1 — in those cases throwing the ball is insane. We have “Double Trouble” for a reason, and we are under-using them.
I’m in the “run the damn ball” crowd — but I’m not so blind to the way NFL games are played that I say run the ball every single play. I do realize that a QB has to be involved in the offense to be successful. But, we should run the ball at least twice as much as we throw it.
We have the best RB tandem in the league — why are they only getting 20 carries between them, when the 5th worst QB* in the league is throwing the ball 35 times? We lose every time this happens — it shouldn’t be that hard to figure out, but for Gump it seems that coming up with a smart, solid game plan and/or picking the right RB to hand the ball off to in any given situation is like trying to figure out Thermonuclear Physics.
It’s not Jake’s fault. Yes, he’s in the twilight of his career and should be a backup somewhere, but it’s not his fault that he’s told to throw a 40 yard bomb on 3rd and 1. It is his fault that he over/under throws it — but he shouldn’t have to throw it in the first place. If he wasn’t under the direction of an OC who has the mental capacity of an orange (at least in the football sense), we wouldn’t have this problem. We would be 7-3 or 8-2 right now (with Jake) and would be talking about how we were going to catch the Saints and win the division.
*No stats to back this up, but earlier in the year Jake was the 5th worst QB based on rating, this could have changed by now.
Franchising a player that didn't want to be a Panther can't be good...
While I agree that the “Panthers Blame Game Has No Simple Solution”, I would argue that franchising a player who didn’t even want to be there most certainly impacted personnel decisions as well as providing the team with lots of un-quantifiably bad karma.
It does not make sense to simply look in a linear view as to what has actually happened in the order of injuries, etc., without stopping to acknowledge certain monumental choices for what they are. To do so is to ignore history and minimalize truly important events. Is there anybody out there who wouldn’t love to have a pick in next year’s 1st round? Sure, #91’s a great player but how’s that stack up compared to getting a potential franchise QB?
No one can seriously state that franchising Peppers and therefore restricting a large portion of salary cap space to one player was not a significant event. It is as simple as economics – if you spend a large chunk of money on one thing you do not have it to spend on another thing, and therefore severely restrict your future choices. What that “thing” might have been only team management knows – to simply list players that were dealt to other teams this year does not account for the entirety of “what-if” scenarios involving available players. Sure, the argument of what positions were actually impacted by injuries has some validity, but so does the argument that strengthening one area may help make up for weaknesses or losses in another area – better QB/WR choices could be argued to have helped the team as much as better replacements for the injury-depleted positions.
My point is that to deny that the Peppers (and in hindsight, the Delhomme) contract had the significant impact on this season that they’ve had is to ignore the pink elephant in the room. Acknowledge it and reclaim your room; deny it and you better be ready to pay a lot peanuts and get nuttin’ in return!
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Cat Scratch Reader
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2010 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
