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Carolina Panthers defeat Tampa Bay Buccaneers 28-21

Carolina Panthers running back DeAngelo Williams (34) spikes the ball in the end zone after scoring the game-winning touchdown against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers during in the fourth quarter of an NFL football game in Tampa, Fla., Sunday, Oct. 18, 2009. AP Photo/Brian Blanco)

More photos » by Brian Blanco - AP

about 1 month ago: Carolina Panthers running back DeAngelo Williams (34) spikes the ball in the end zone after scoring the game-winning touchdown against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers during in the fourth quarter of an NFL football game in Tampa, Fla., Sunday, Oct. 18, 2009. AP Photo/Brian Blanco)


Raymond James Stadium- Tampa, Fla: The Carolina Panthers displayed their 'Dr. Jekyl and Mr. Hyde' offense in Tampa Bay today with RBs DeAngelo Williams and Jonathan Stewart combining for 262 yards and three touchdowns. The Carolina Panthers' passing offense was not all successful however, with an anemic game that only managed to gain 65 yards with QB Jake Delhomme throwing two interceptions and WR Steve Smith managing to catch just a single ball for four yards.

It was the Buccanneers who struck first with Cadillac Williams scoring on a 20 yard run less than five minutes into the game.


From here on, however, the Carolina defense stifled the Tampa Bay offense allowing only 12 first downs on the day. The majority of gains occured on the ground as the Carolina defense struggled containing the quickness of Tampa QB Josh Johnson who gashed the Carolina defense on key third downs fininishing with 45 yards on the ground, running for 5.6 ypc.

The real story of the game was the Panther's running game. Led by DeAngelo Williams who had 152 yards rushing at 5.1 ypc the Panthers shredded the Buccaneers LBs and secondary. Jeff Davidson stayed on top of the Buccaneers' defensive playcalling bringing in Jonathan Stewart for the bulk of the carries in the second half. Stewart finished with a stout 110 yards, averaging 6.5 ypc. The Bucs simply had no answer for Williams and Stewart, and the Panthers took advantage.

Star-divide

One player Tampa Bay did have an answer for was all pro WR Steve Smith. Shadowed all day by Bucs corner Aqib Talib, Smith rarely had separation from his man and was visibly frustrated he was unable to break away. Other than two deep shots Delhomme took to Smith in the first half, he was rarely a target in the passing game.

Jake Delhomme continued his struggles in 2009 with two interceptions. The first a tipped pass that ended up in the hands of Barrett Ruud, the second a poor read of safety Tanard Jackson who jumped a pass intended for Muhammed and took the ball to the endzone for a key score which tied the game in the 4th quarter. Delhomme finished with a pawltry 9/17, 65 yards, 1TD, 2 INT, 42.2 rating.

Ultimately, however, the Bucs had no answer to the Carolina run which marched the ball 81 yards on 14 rushing attempts for the Panther's final drive which sealed a Carolina victory and improved the team to 2-3 heading back to Charlotte for an October 25th matchup against the Buffalo Bills.

Scoring Summary

1st quarter

TB Cadillac Williams, 20 yd run.

2nd quarter

CAR DeAngelo Williams, 20 yd run.

3rd quarter

CAR Jeff King, 1 yd TD pass from Jake Delhomme

CAR Jonathan Stewart, 26 yd run

TB Sammie Stroughter, 97 yd kickoff return

4th quarter

TB Tanard Jackson, 26 yd INT return

CAR DeAngelo Williams, 1 yd run.

Other notes:

  • Carolina's special teams struggled again allowing a blocked FG and a KR for a touchdown.
  • Special Teams player Dante Wesley was ejected from the game for a early, high hit on Tampa Bay PR Clifton Smith who left the game with a concussion.
  • Defensive standouts included Thomas Davis (8 tackles, 1 INT, 2 PD) and Julius Peppers (7 tackles, 2 sacks, 1 FF)
Poll
Who deserves the game ball from the Panthers' victory vs. the Buccaneers?
DeAngelo Williams
122 votes
Jonathan Stewart
12 votes
Julius Peppers
11 votes
Thomas Davis
17 votes
Jeff Davidson
9 votes
Ron Meeks
8 votes
Other (please specify in comment)
8 votes

187 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs  |  Comment 81 comments |

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Comments

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That last drive was absolutely disgusting. How bad does your defense have to be to allow a team to march 80 yards down the field on the back of 15 running plays?

by SlayerGhaleon on Oct 18, 2009 6:30 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

The difference was no Gaines Adams

With him the Bucs win. Oh well! ;)

I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com

by Jaxon on Oct 18, 2009 6:41 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

To have a strong passing game you need...

1. A star QB
or
2. A plethora of receiving options
or
3. A creative offensive mind calling plays

We have none of these. One star receiver isn’t going to carry our passing game. I’m afraid this will be our achilles heel this year… leading to the end of the Fox/Delhomme era. Meaning next year we will probably have new coaches, QBs and possibly receiver(s).

I love this running game, but it will not beat good teams by itself.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 18, 2009 6:51 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree with #1 and 3 especially because Davidson could utiliize Smith better in the passing game. Where are the screens, slants or reverse runs? I just think Davidson is setting this team up for disaster when the team gets down two or more scores. I also don’t like it when he chooses to run the ball on 2nd and long, basically setting up the 4th down punt.

As for #2, I disagree. Maybe it’s my fan bias, but I think a group consisting of Smith, Moose, Rosario, Williams, even King, and Jarrett is a more than decent crop of receiving targets.

by RaffyGonzo on Oct 18, 2009 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

It would help if we mixed in some routes designed to get more of our receivers open, or to exploit the talents of a particular one. I dont understand why we dont run more WR Screens to Smitty. It just blows my mind. Seems like all we do is run the ball and then late Jake overthrow a deep pass by 10 yards somewhere in the vicinity of Smith.

This is really all moot until (hopefully) next season, when we have someone throwing the ball besides Jake Failhomme.

by Tater596 on Oct 19, 2009 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What I meant was you have to have one of these if the others aren't present

Smitty has the ability to make plays out of nothing and take control of a game, the other guys don’t. I agree though if we had 1 or 3, then our receivers would probably look a lot better.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

My observations from the game....

     Our defense is playing great imo. Thomas Davis is having a pro bowl season. Pep has played well the last two games and seems to be fired up. However, Gamble got burnt and hasn’t shown the shutdown ability of a #1 CB

    Jake’s pick 6 leaves me worried about all the turnovers. Ball protection needs to be addressed in multiple areas. (QB,RB,ST)

     The eagles lost today, so that may help us in a wild card spot which seems to be our only option at this point.

     We’ll never know if Jarrett has what it takes if we don’t give him the opportunity….

by synonymesis on Oct 18, 2009 7:25 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I watched that Eagles loss...

Man the Raiders really took them to woodshed physically.
The trainer’s room in the Eagles Novacare complex is gonna be a busy place this week.

by paydirt16 on Oct 18, 2009 8:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Jarrett

Needs to be more involved. But again… our QB sucks, so will we ever know if he is any good?

by Tater596 on Oct 19, 2009 12:22 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Jarrett’s done nothing whenever he’s had a chance.

I think Panther fans should concentrate on Kenny Moore. I think he’s the future at the position, not Jarrett.

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Oct 19, 2009 1:16 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What has Moore done as a receiver?

He only has one more reception than Jarrett. Is that enough to declare him the future over Jarrett? Neither one of them get many opportunities, and when they do they are like Jake’s 3rd option… Which might as well not be an option.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dwayne Jarrett had more oportunities to shine in the preseason than Kenny Moore did… VASTLY more. The result:

Jarrett: 6 receptions, 57 yards
Moore: 12 receptions, 135 yards

Kenny Moore did more (forgive the pun) than Jarrett did with less. Furthermore (there I go again), he’s proved to be valuable on special teams too.

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Oct 20, 2009 9:19 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That and our coach and OC don't know what to do with him

Or Moore, or any other WR that isn’t named Smitty. Oh wait 4 yards… including Smitty.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Charles Johnson needs some love

2 sacks and 2 forced fumbles. Why again is Brayton starting?

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 18, 2009 8:11 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Amen.

I’ve been touting Mr. Johnson since he got here, and I feel like he’s ready to take the starting spot. He’s able to rush the passer much better than Brayton, and with his strength and speed I feel like he would be more effective against the run. I feel like Brayton should be in the rotation at both DE and DT, but not starting.

by r3 on Oct 18, 2009 8:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I say next year start Johnson and Brown

Let Pep and his 16Mil walk on out of here, and sign a stud DT. Johnson and Brown could get the job done without Pep, IF we can get some push up the middle.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Steve Smith apparently has no faith in this team...

He was asked after that game if he was surprised not to be more involved, and he simply said: "I don’t know, go ask the coordinator." Then he headed for the bus, adding: "I’m going to enjoy Christmas."

Per Gantt

by Davejinxer on Oct 18, 2009 8:28 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

That was a quote from the Wildcat game against Atlanta three years ago.

by bengoodfella on Oct 18, 2009 9:04 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You got a link for that?

Regardless it sounds like he’s not happy…
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/playerbreakingnews.asp?sport=NFL&id=2386&line=155723&spln=1

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 18, 2009 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

he shouldnt be

Jake sucking is eventually going to put a massive hole in his wallet. Not to mention since he is such an ultra competitive guy, he has got to be furious.

by Tater596 on Oct 19, 2009 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well next year

He will have a shot with a new QB and probably new play calling. If that QB is a rookie then he might have more to complain about.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Correction: The Jackson INT

was on a pass intended for Muhammad, not Smith. Smith was wide right running an out, Moose in the slot left running a crossing route. Because they were blitzing six, Jackson felt comfortable cheating down toward Smith, which put him in perfect position to jump Moose’s crossing route.

Honestly, it was a bad route combination for Davidson to run against a team that’s bracketing the receiver on the right. Still, that one’s on Delhomme. He should have recognized the blitz and anticipated the safety coming forward.

by r3 on Oct 18, 2009 8:52 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

dually noted, and corrected.

Thanks

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Oct 18, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

We seriously need a way to get Smith (and any receiver capable of catching a ball) in the game. I’m enjoying these back to back wins but in seeking more W’s, I fully recognize that a team with a stout defense would destroy us. One part of me feels the urge to stick with Delhomme at least to see this season out.. The other part feels sick when thinking of how it’s going to turn out in all of the games we’re forced to pass… Tampa just didn’t have the D to contain Williams & Stewart… but a lot of teams do. I hope for the best and as always am rooting Panthers to the Super Bowl but I honestly can’t wait for this off season to get here. I feel like there’s SO MUCH untapped potential being wasted away… None of our players are getting any younger and if we don’t bring the pieces together soon, we might start losing more than we’re gaining… Our Super Bowl run was almost 6 years ago now, although to me it certainly doesn’t feel like it was that long ago. In 6 more years, are we going to be saying the same things we are now? I certainly hope not, I’m ready to see this team come together and realize the potential we truly have.

by D-Ranged1 on Oct 18, 2009 10:51 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

good things and bad things

every week. the defense seems to be getting it together only giving up one TD. Looking at the rest of the schedule I see us going at least 8-8. If they finally start playing good on both sides of the ball (and ST), I see us 9-7 or 10-6.

by rkpanthers on Oct 18, 2009 10:52 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

We are 12th in Total Defense, and 2nd in Passing Defense

Passing Defense is probably a bit skewed (we’ll find out in 2 weeks vs Arz). However, we look better each week. Were getting a fairly consistent pass rush, not giving up too many big plays, And our rushing defense seems to be getting better too. Really points off turn overs are what’s killing us, and you can’t blame the defense for that. I think this is definitely an area to be optimistic about.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think Jarrett should be used more in the passing game

He’s a 6’4 receiving target who imo could be that guy that can take that second defender off Smith to open up the passing game more.

by RaffyGonzo on Oct 18, 2009 11:13 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Have any of us seen Jarrett open?

I don’t think he has the speed, quickness, or moves, to get separation. The only passes I recall he’s caught are slants in the 5-10 yard range. Nothing wrong with that, but I don’t see the ability to get open on a deep post or corner route. If he had it, I think they’d try to exploit him.

by bigdavis on Oct 18, 2009 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

at this point

I’d take a 5-10 yard slant all day long if it meant a completed pass.

by Tater596 on Oct 19, 2009 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

When you're 6'4, you don't need as much separation from a DB

To make an impact, but I guess when you have as pathetic of a quarterback as Delhomme behind center, then the receivers do need to create atleast a couple yards of separation.

So while a lot here think it’s the receivers not getting “open” for Delhomme to make the throw, I think it has a lot to do with Jake’s inability to zip a ball into a tight window. A quality that a lot of the top quarterbacks in the league can do.

by RaffyGonzo on Oct 19, 2009 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

I don’t remember Keyshawn getting much separation. I think it again comes down to Davidson and Fox just being a bit clueless in the passing game.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Incidentally, I voted for Other

The OL got my vote for game ball.

But for their road grading on the last drive — a thing of beauty and a joy to behold — we couldn’t have run up those gaudy rushing totals. BTW, wait til you see how we jump up in the league rankings of rushing yardage — from 28th up to #8. Great jobs by the OL!

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&offensiveStatisticCategory=RUSHING&conference=ALL&role=TM&season=2009&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=RUSHING_YARDS_PER_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=2&d-447263-n=1

by bigdavis on Oct 18, 2009 11:33 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I should note...

So that I’m not just the bringer of doom and gloom by constantly hammering on Jake Failhomme. I am glad to see that Julius Peppers is finally starting to play some inspired football. His numbers were good, but i was impressed on some of the plays where he dropped into coverage and caught some guys for tackles that were clearly faster than him. He is starting to look like a guy deserving of a fat paycheck, however, he still isnt quite up to his billing.

I voted for Thomas Davis. He is playing incredible football right now. He should get the bulk of the credit (along with our LBs in general) for the defenses strong play.

by Tater596 on Oct 19, 2009 12:31 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I voted for TD too

He is a converted safety, who for awhile looked like a potential bust. But now he is in a defense built around his position, and he is making the most of the opportunity.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Other

Dante Wesley, for not taking “fair catch” for an answer, and not buying into the idea that the punt returner needs to have caught the ball before you should be allowed to tackle him.

If you're so sure of what it ain't, how about telling us what it am!

by circa1015 on Oct 19, 2009 12:54 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

lol

His play was so spirited the league will probably give him a few weeks off for his effort!

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Oct 19, 2009 1:18 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

I think he’ll probably get together with Commissioner Goodell and celebrate by contributing sveral thousand to charity as well.

by panthersnbraves on Oct 19, 2009 2:57 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What was that?

Poorest display by a Panther in as long as I can recall.

by the bomb dot com on Oct 19, 2009 7:58 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No way he did that on purpose

Had to be a major brain fart on his part. Love the aggressiveness, but c’mon… don’t let your over zealous stupidity kill somebody!

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thomas Davis was a monster! The pick was a thing of beauty, and he had several great open field tackles. Give that man the game ball!

by Zeus12888 on Oct 19, 2009 1:48 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

+1

And split Pep’s salary with him while your at it.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

'Dr. Jekyl and Mr. Hyde'

With the amount of running yardage, and the Defense deciding to put in a good day again (less time on the field?), the Panthers should have been in the position to put their foot on the Buc’s neck and make them cry for mercy.

Hopefully they can get it together on passing and ST…. they’ll need it against the top teams.

by panthersnbraves on Oct 19, 2009 3:02 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Panthers Need to Shop on a Bye week

This team has all the components to compete for a Super Bowl if the staff comes to their senses and realize “Jake the Snake” must go. They need to quietly do a contract settlement (Hell..I would even be happy with M. Vick) with a foundated QB who won’t choke under pressure and take the rest of the season to push hard for a Wildcard spot. It’s a shame to see a team with so much potential go down the toilet with empty seat seasons in the future because the staff insist Delhomme is “their starting man”. I hate to say this.. but if Donavan McNabb or any other QB of color was performing like this..they would be collecting splinters on their backsides sitting on the bench and being told they were not smart enough to play the QB position..there it is..Yeah..I said it…if the shoe fits..wear it!!!!

by kodiac on Oct 19, 2009 6:40 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

That is a bit much

It has nothing to do with color, simply a matter of having no QB on the bench. Delhomme is very poor right now, but is still the best option we have. Being an Irish fan, I can’t help but think Brady Quinn would be an improvement over Jake after he put up avg. numbers against 2 great defenses and then got benched for Mr. 2/9 D. Anderson. If the price is reasonable, maybe he could turn the season around for us, just throwing for 180/game and no turnovers.

by Mr. E on Oct 19, 2009 7:43 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

This Makes No Sense

We have no faith in the guys behind Jake, and our bye week is in the rearview. We aren’t going after Vick, because that also makes no sense, since 1) he hasn’t done anything in Philly and 2) he was never that great to begin with in Atlanta.

Your race baiting is pathetic.

If we had a young black scrambler on our roster who knew the playbook, you can be sure we would have turned to him by now.

by the bomb dot com on Oct 19, 2009 8:04 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No.

As long as Jake is healthy & on the roster with the current coaching staff he will be the starter. TB’s Johnson looked like he would be an improvement. Same reason they did not pursue Garcia this preseason. They knew he was a better QB than Jake and didn’t want a QB competition — they’ve got their man. He just sucks…..

 I’m not buying that “Jake is our best chance to win” argument any more either. I highly doubt that Matt Moore could play as bad as Delhomme. When Moore played with the starters a couple of seasons ago he did okay —-as rookie that year no less. Are you saying that he hasn’t improved at all since then? When he played that year he was better than Jake is now.

The Panthers will struggle to beat bad teams and lose to good ones as long as Delhomme is their starter. Just like the playoff loss last year, Delhomme is hindering a good team’s chance to become great.

by dudemanhey on Oct 19, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Garcia is 39 and a system QB

He’s NEVER done well in the WCO, and wouldn’t do any better here than Jake is.

by Cyberjag on Oct 19, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Josh Johnson

if we had Josh Johnson on our roster, I bet he would be the starter right now. If not, he would certainly be the number two QB and I bet Jake’s leash would be a lot shorter. Imagine his legs and fresh arm with our running game! Honestly, I don’t see Freeman beating him out, I’m a big fan of his.

by Cyberjag on Oct 19, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think there's any need to cast racial aspursions on the situation.

Your statement is insinuating that if Jake Delhomme were African American that John Fox would have benched him, thus depicting Fox as a racist. There is simply no evidence that supports anything you have said.

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Oct 19, 2009 8:32 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I could not have said it better James

To bring a race element into it is ridiculous.

I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com

by Jaxon on Oct 19, 2009 8:36 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you must be a racist

Please keep your comments to yourself. It’s not my place to tell anyone what they should and shouldn’t think, but your inflammatory statements have no place on a modern football forum. What year do you think this is anyway?

Leave that prejudicial stuff at home and come chat with us. We would love to talk about football with you. Just football. :)

by Cyberjag on Oct 19, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Lol, why is it ok to be be a jerk

as long as you follow it with “Yeah, I said it”?

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Other notes

Great Play By the D. Great pressure.

Tommy D, Beason, Peppers, C. Johnson, E. Brown showing up again this week.

Diggs had a few great plays, too. Oh, and Big Hollis! The man is coming through in a big way.

Gamble had that mistake, same with Brayton. A few missed tackles on Johnson scrambles, but nothing catastrophic.

Good challenge by Fox, great return by the Captain (which should’ve been a TD, but we scored on the drive anyway).

by the bomb dot com on Oct 19, 2009 8:15 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

+1 having Hollis Thomas up front is huge for the running game

They Bucs got very little running up the middle, they could get the edge early

I blog the Carolina Panthers at www.catscratchreader.com

by Jaxon on Oct 19, 2009 8:37 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let's cross our fingers that he can stay injury free

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

this makes two games in a row...

two games in a row we gave the other team two touchdowns from avoidable turnovers…

two games in a row we lost a fumble on the 1-2 yard line costing us 7 points.

…we can’t continue winning games giving away 21 points each time. If we could protect the ball better these games wouldn’t be nearly as close.

by synonymesis on Oct 19, 2009 8:53 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Telling stat

We lead the league in points given up by turnovers.

by LittleKing on Oct 19, 2009 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Conversely,

nobody is mentioning Jonathan Stewart’s fumble inside the 10 yard line. If he held on to that ball it probably would have been another TD by the Panthers.

We need to secure the ball better at all positions.

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Oct 19, 2009 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

race bating and jake

I understand the comment about Jake and not being black, but the truth is that the comment is irrelevant. If Jake was black, things would be different. The same can be said about everyone on the team. If D-Will was white, if Smitty was Pakistani, if Jarrett was Ukrainian, etc. The point was made, but holds little weight.

Either way, I think for the rest of the season, when the game is decided, Moore should come in and play, whether we’rer up 21 or down 21. Of course, is Moore really the #2, or is it Feeley? I don’t know. We’re gonna bring in some new QB talent in the offseason, but to make a permanent change now doesn’t make sense. We got two wins in a row and the horrible Bills to watch Jake get some more reps. Smitty will demand to be traded in the offseason if jake is the starter next year.

Either way, I think Thomas Davis is playing better this year than Harrison last year, and is en route to Defensive Player of the Year honors…Who’s playing better?

On a side note…from NFL.com…“Panthers defensive ends Julius Peppers and Charles Johnson combined for four sacks and three forced fumbles. Peppers now has 14.5 sacks in his last 14 games vs. Tampa Bay and 19.5 sacks in his last 19 games overall.”

Also, is Jake only threw 7 passes in the 2nd half. Is that a sign that Fox has lost confidence in him?

by usana_gaines on Oct 19, 2009 9:38 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree and disagree

For some people, there is no doubt that things would be different if some people had darker or lighter skin. But I don’t think any of them work for the Panthers. So the product on the field would be the same, for better or worse. And for better or worse, the knuckleheads out there who think that skin color equates to performance in one category or another are still throwing stupid arguments around, except about different topics. :)

by Cyberjag on Oct 19, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If Jake was black

He’d probably be less of a sack of potatoes back there. And please, get it right… Smitty wouldn’t be Pakastani, Muhammad would be ;)

I find it amusing that over 40 million white people just voted a black man into the most powerful position in the country, and we are still having this conversation.

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 10:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Jake Delhomme

Hang in there JAKE —-I remember when they were saying the same thing about Kurt Warner

by bcrook on Oct 19, 2009 10:40 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Wow

Great point, I really had forgotten about that parallel.

Thanks for giving me a little something to hang some hope on. :)

by Cyberjag on Oct 19, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

There is no parallel

Come back down to earth

on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city

by southtunnel on Oct 19, 2009 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Cmon Jake.

I don’t care if you’re fans of the Panthers or not, something has to happen in our QB position.

You take one glance at the NFL.Com page about his statistics and boy is it pretty. We’re 2-3 in spite of 4 touchdowns and 10 interceptions.

And yet the Panthers seemed to be running away from it! At one point the defense had held the Bucs to 7 points, while we were winning with 21. At one point, I thought the Panthers would turn this to a rout, but the problems on the other two areas on the field besides defense proved that even a one of the worst teams in the NFL can play with the Carolina Panthers.

The special teams coverage was just awful. No one stayed in their lane. At all. Everyone ran towards the football, and they got stuck on one side of the field thanks to a wall of blockers, and the returner simply ran to the other side. It looked like PeeWee football. A couple of missed tackles finished off the play, and the Panthers showed how much they stunk at kick return coverage.

On Offense, Jake Delhomme threw another pick six against a receiver that was in TRIPLE coverage when he let go of the football. Meanwhile Moose was in one on one coverage over to the left side, and Steve Smith would have been in the same position on the other side if he was given a second or so more time to throw.

You just have to take a deep breath when Jake Delhomme has the ball in his hands. He’s not making good decisions at all. Even if he just took the ball, and curled up for the sack, it would have been better than giving the Bucs a get well soon card like that.

Clearly, the confidence lost in Jake can be seen among the coaching staff. In the last drive that ended for a score, the Panthers called 15 running plays in a row as opposed to one passing play. As easy as that was to do, that will never work against elite teams like the Patriots, Cardinals, and the Saints, all of whom we face later on in the season.

However, something is keeping Jake Delhomme on the field. I can’t put my finger on it, but something is extremely wrong here. Is something else unknown to us all influencing the situation? Something outside the realm of football perhaps? Jake Delhomme should have been sat a long time ago, even if he was Peyton Manning or Drew Brees there is no way that other teams would put up with his play lately. This has gone beyond the level of ridiculous. For this season, Jake Delhomme has been at his best is an average passer, and at his worst a game-breaker.

I know people want to believe in Jake Delhomme, but this has been the longest time I have ever seen him stink before. This may be the time, once and for all, that Jake Delhomme is truly done.

Ladies and gentlemen, it’s time to start Matt Moore. We have one game against the Buffalo Bills, whose team ranks dead last in defending the run. Why not start Matt Moore, and see what he can do? Give the ball to him at the beginning of the game, and call a balanced game while giving the ball to Moore on the play-action to see if he can start hitting Steve and Moose deep down the field.

I’ll end this comment with Jake’s stats during the game. 9 out of 17 pass completions for 63 yards, one touchdown, two ints, and one pick-six.

Honestly, can it get any worse than that?

"Once again the trousers of evil are yanked down by the mocking hands of justice!"-Revshawn

by Revshawn on Oct 19, 2009 12:36 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree with a bunch of what you're saying.

Honestly, I’ve been a big believer in Jake for a long time, despite his less-than-traditional throwing style, his reliance on back-shoulder throws and lobbing the ball up for Smitty to just “make a play”, all of that. I think he’s been an unorthodox-but-effective player at his position and a great leader. But I’m at the end of my rope, too.

However, let’s get our facts straight.

On Offense, Jake Delhomme threw another pick six against a receiver that was in TRIPLE coverage when he let go of the football. Meanwhile Moose was in one on one coverage over to the left side, and Steve Smith would have been in the same position on the other side if he was given a second or so more time to throw.

I covered it in a comment up above, but his pick-six was thrown to a single-covered Moose on a crossing route. The safety over the top of Smith cheated up hard because they had a six-man blitz on, and he knew Jake would release it early. Cheating up put him directly in the path of Moose’s route, and Jake’s throw would have been a perfect strike to Moose except for the safety cheating up.

But like I also said, that’s on Jake. He should have recognized the blitz, known what their defense was up to, known that their route combination was beaten and taken the sack. And of course it’s really on Davidson, who came up with a bad route combination against a defense that was focused on stopping Smitty.

Anyway, I’m frustrated and fearful of what Jake’s going to do next when he has the ball. He can no longer hit his receivers on deep routes the way he has in the past. Is that on Smith for losing his edge, losing his top-end speed? Or has Jake lost the touch on his deep ball? I have no idea. Maybe both. But our passing game, whether it’s by design (Davidson) or execution (Jake, Steve), is a liability to our team right now.

by r3 on Oct 19, 2009 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, you're not the coach...

No offense of course, neither am I. All we get to do is sit helpless and scream at the TV in frustration.

So what do you think the coaches need to do? What do you think they will do? Assuming Jake remains the starter, of course.

I’ll be at the game Sunday, and I hope to see a few screens and quick slants to Smitty early, just to get him in the groove of the game. I would love to see more single-back sets with Smitty, Moore, and Moose wide and Rosario in the slot. And I want to see them RUN out of it too. Buffalo is the perfect opponent for that.

If the Panthers can get Smitty involved with short passes early, then maybe they’ll get brave and start on some intermediate routes. If those work, THEN let Jake throw deep.

I really don’t believe Jake is physically done. I think that from a purely physical standpoint, he has years left. But his head is somewhere out in Belmont and needs to be put back on straight. Maybe it’s the new QB coach, maybe Davidson is hanging him out to dry. But Jake is a wasted asset.

Yes, I used the word asset. He was the leader of a 12-4 team and was directly responsible for at least four of those wins last year. And then in the playoffs and again early this year he was asked to be something he isn’t. A lot of damage has been done as a result.

So what do they do to fix it? Can it be fixed? I want to hear about that, and hope to see signs of the likely solutions this Sunday.

by Cyberjag on Oct 19, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, throw both of the running backs on the field!

Now, if we were to do something like this, I’d wait till Week 7 when we face the Arizona Cardinals to pull it off so that it’s new and the opposing team isn’t expecting it. But why not take Moose off the field from time to time, and throw in another running back with both our TE’s?

You can do all sorts of things from this kind of formation. The defense will always be guessing on whether the TE’s or RB’s are there to block, or if they’re there to go on a passing route. At times, you can go all out pass and throw both running backs and TE’s into routes and throw Steve Smith on a slant or deep route. It would cause all sorts of mayhem with the linebackers because they will have plenty of players they have to keep an eye on at one time, and it’ll catch the Cardinals are caught off guard by a new offensive wrinkle they’ve had no time to prepare for.

That’s what I would do. It forces the linebackers to pick and choose who they’re going to cover, and it leaves room for so much to happen right up the middle of the field and in the running game it doesn’t give up much leverage. You can always switch up the backs and throw Brad Hoover in as the extra back instead of Stewart at times.

So, you would have something like

                           OT OG C OG OT TE1 TE2——————————————Steve Smith
                                      QB
                            RB/FB1 RB/FB2

That’s the basic idea of it all. Move the TE’s and WR1 around and change their assignments as needed to keep the defense guessing. Drop Jake Delhomme into the shotgun with split backs if the O-Line can’t hold their ground on obvious passing downs. I’d just like the Panthers to just go crazy and do something entirely unexpected that the other team will have never guessed the Panthers would do, and therefore would not know how to defend against.

In a perfect world, a formation like this would be so unexpected that it would leave someone wide open more often than not, and highlights Steve Smith, our running backs, and our underused TE’s and keeps them all on the field at the same time.

Mwahaha.

A special gadget play I would do for this formation starts out like this. Stewart gets the ball on a handoff while Deangelo Williams breaks off to the right. Steve Smith goes on a deep slant/deep route option to the left while Rosario gets a slant route to the right. The play starts out as a fleaflicker from Stewart and Delhomme laterals the ball far to the right to Williams, and then Williams has the option of throwing it deep to Smith, throwing it short to Rosario if he’s covered pretty well, or just plain tucking the ball in and taking off as quick as he can go.

What say you guys?

"Once again the trousers of evil are yanked down by the mocking hands of justice!"-Revshawn

by Revshawn on Oct 19, 2009 8:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Interesting

…that you mention getting the short routes going, then intermediate and then – god willing – a deep route or two. In all other sports, when you are just sucking out loud at accuracy (football, basketball, hell even disc golf) you start out small to build confidence and rhythm and then progress outward. I didn’t see any of that Sunday. None. I fully agree that’s what needs to happen. More short passes to our WRs (not just Smith) in the flats…some curl routes, etc.

by boywonderncsu on Oct 19, 2009 2:57 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

more then that...

Our WRs are great blockers first and foremost. On several occasions Sunday I saw Moose throw excellent blocks (as usual) and caught glimpses of Smitty and even Jarrett tossing an effective block on someone. You know what formation works great when you have receivers who can block? The Bunch formation.

TE OT OG C OG OT WR2-WR3-WR1 (upside down V alignment)
                   QB

                   RB

From this formation you can break out into a variety of routes for intermediate and long pass plays, but the true beauty resides in the short passing game, where you can use those WRs as blockers for one another. Assuming the WR1 in the above formation is Smitty, he simply comes in to the left after the ball is snapped while Moose and Moore/Jarrett take on blocking duty. With the speed of Smitty, that has to be good for 5 yards everytime.

by Tater596 on Oct 19, 2009 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree, I also think we could be running more double TE sets with King and Rosario or King and Barnidge.

Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.

by James The Aussie on Oct 19, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree to that

I think both have a place in this bunch formation. For the true TE on the left side of the line you are going to want a good hybrid blocking/receiving TE which will allow for both effective runs to the weak-side of the formation and for effective routes in the flat and on the post routes. This is where Barnidge would shine, as someone who currently does not have an identity in our offense, but should as a balanced TE.

I could see either WR2 or WR3 being substituted for a blocking TE such as King to give us a “Jumbo-Bunch” look. The problem here is that we will probably be selling ourselves out to the run unless we keep King involved in the passing game as well.

by Tater596 on Oct 19, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sure!

I wouldn’t mind seeing us have more bunch formations. Mix in a few TE’s from time to time on blocking assignments once they get used to seeing the formation, and have the linebackers freeze and look silly in the backfield.

"Once again the trousers of evil are yanked down by the mocking hands of justice!"-Revshawn

by Revshawn on Oct 19, 2009 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe Carolina should hire an offensive assistant

Either Fox and Davidson are the two most uncreative guys in the history of mankind, or they just need a fresh set of eyes. Dan Henning would be an upgrade right now.

by Flowing Willow on Oct 20, 2009 9:05 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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